Exorbitant ticket prices- Page 2

[Seperite]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 8:58am

Those who have responded with "Broadway is a business" missed the point of the original message.

This was not intended to be an old man's lament of "I remember when..." ticket prices were cheaper. I'm making a purely business argument, intended to appeal to a producer's focus on the bottom-line: that if you're charging $150-175 per ticket, but only actually reaping $25 per seat, and not selling 2/3 of your tickets (as is the case in On the Town; similar numbers are likely true for many other quickly-shuttered shows) then you're not optimizing your sale prices. Cut the FACE cost of an orchestra ticket to a number that will put you in competition with other forms of entertainment -- say, $40 or $50 -- and the number of tickets you'll sell will skyrocket, thus offsetting any loss from a reduced asking price. The fact that the producers are, in actuality, already accepting deeply discounted sums for the tickets should make a reduction of the face value all the more palatable. Make it easier for the consumer to pay the prices you're already willing to accept (by not forcing them to use special discounting apps, or wait for TDF discounts, use TKTS booths etc.) and you will sell more tickets. The $150 - $175 asking price is a charade, and it keeps casual theatergoers away. The vast, vast majority of people are casual theatergoers, not hardcore junkies who know all the tricks of the trade vis a vis discounts. Most don't want to bother with "working" to find discounts; if you force them to, they'll just stay away from the theater, or come only on rare and special occasions. Bring down the face value to a price that is competitive with other forms of entertainment, minimize the "work" people have to do to get the discounts you're already providing, and the number of people who attend will skyrocket.

[dramamama611]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 9:49am

Maybe. Maybe not.

Lots if people will also see lower prices as a sign if an inferior product.

The cost is not what keeps shows from succeeding. Neither is quality. It's lack if interest.

[indytallguy]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 11:22am

Bring down the face value to a price that is competitive with other forms of entertainment, minimize the "work" people have to do to get the discounts you're already providing, and the number of people who attend will skyrocket.

It would be interesting to see more producers experiment with this. My perception is that the "high price offer often discounted" is the primary practice for much of Broadway, but other industries use many more models to try and sell more ... and make more. Maybe Disney's foray into pricing and yield mgmt might be a catalyst for others to try different approaches.

[canmark]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 11:25am

Some shows are using “flex” pricing, are they not? If the show is close to sold out, the remaining seats have a higher price. It the show has a lot of seats remaining, the remaining seats have lower price. Supply/demand. I know a lot of sporting events (basketball, hockey) do this, too. Depending on the opponent and the advance ticket sales, the price of a specific seat can vary considerably.

That said, it would be nice if producers offered discounted seats on a more regular basis. The last row of the orchestra, the last few rows of the balcony, perhaps. Throw a bone to the people who can’t afford the expensive seats – someday they may be your big ticket patrons. On the other hand, most shows to offer some combination of discounts, student discounts, obstructed view, rush, lottery, standing room, TKTS, etc.

Unfortunately, if you want to see big-name entertainment in the city you’re going to have a big-name prices. This is the same at the opera, symphony, or Madison Square Garden. Want to sit courtside at a Knicks game? You’d be paying well over $1,000 a ticket – premium seats to a Broadway musical are cheap in comparison.

[Daddy Warbucks]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 11:25am

If you're willing to sit in the back, some shows offer some pretty cheap seating. The Living on Love performances all have seats $25 seats (in addition to the incredibly expensive premium seats). $25 is a pretty incredible price to see Renee Fleming's Broadway debut -- not to mention Douglas Sills, Anna Chlumsky and Jerry O'Connell.

[wonderfulwizard11]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 11:37am

I don't enjoy how high ticket prices are, but it makes no sense for producers to price all their tickets at a lower cost. Clearly, for every show there are people out there willing to pay full or premium price, so why would any producer automatically lower the price and potentially reduce their profit? True, if people use discounts, the producers can't reap the full benefit, but at least they have a shot of doing so.

And though I rarely, if ever, pay full price for a ticket, sometimes I think people who have an issue with the prices aren't looking hard enough. There are plenty of good deals for theatre in this city, but you just have to dig for them a little.

[Pootie2]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 11:49am

Tourists aren't going to spend much time looking for the deals especially if they want to see specific shows already (e.g. BoM), but I'm reminded of a friend who's a watch engineer. When I looked through the catalogue and asked how much some of these cost, he commented with a wink, "If you wonder about price, you're not their clientèle." It seems Broadway is moving towards that. What was affordable for lower/middle-class decades ago is no longer the case now; target audiences do change. (By the way, since the 2008 crash, employment rose but pay almost a quarter less.)

Time to look to Off-Broadway, I guess?

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 11:53am

Broadway is a luxury to all but those who basically have an addition to it liking to drugs. We all know people like that. Broadway is not a necessity like food or rent. You can do without it. We see a fraction of the shows we used to and somehow we survive

Little by little average theatergoers are starting to stay away. The producers think that by increasing prices they can make a quick buck. They will eventually find out how stupid this is. When this pool of theatergoers dries up, the average theatergoers will not be there to bail them out.

The same thing is happening to all forms of entertainment - movies sports etc.

[After Eight]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 11:57am

"Time to look to Off-Broadway, I guess?"

Have you seen what they're charging off-Broadway?

How much is a ticket to Hamilton?

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 12:01pm

Off Broadway is a smaller version of the joke that is Broadway pricing wise

How many people on this board would go with any regularity if there were no discounts offered on any show? You pay what the stated price is all the time with no discounts ever.

The board would be very different if this ever happened.

Updated On: 2/15/15 at 12:01 PM

[OlBlueEyes]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 1:10pm

I'm sure someone here has a better knowledge of this than me, but the small Vivian Beaumont, capacity 900, has a mezzanine (more accurately called the loge at this theater) of only six rows. The first four are priced as same as the orchestra. Rows D and E are maybe $50 cheaper and are available for groups.

Then there is this mysterious seventh and last row that always sells for (I think for The King and I) $67.00. No discount for groups or anything else. No increase for weekends. It's not available to the regular ticket buyer through Telecharge. I think it's dedicated to students, groups, and others who can't/don't buy the expensive seats.

[yankeefan7]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 1:22pm

"Bring down the face value to a price that is competitive with other forms of entertainment, minimize the "work" people have to do to get the discounts you're already providing, and the number of people who attend will skyrocket."

Have you seen what ticket prices are for a rock/pop concert? If you want a really good seat you are going to pay the same amount or more as some of these Broadway shows and there are no discounts. For example, Billy Joel is coming to my city in December and seats at the opposite end of the arena (highest level) from the stage are at least $100.

[frogs_fan85]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 2:34pm

OlBlueEyes, the Beaumont's loge is only five rows deep. Rows A-C are the same price as the orchestra and Rows D and E are priced $55 cheaper (at least that's the price differential for THE KING AND I). The full capacity is 1,084 seats, not 900. Although it might be lower for THE KING AND I depending on if the orchestra pit necessitates the removal of a few rows.

[Seperite]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 2:44pm

The comparison to rock/pop concerts is not viable for a slew of reasons. The venue only has to be filled once or twice for a rock concert to be successful; a Broadway show has to sell tickets 8 times a week. The fanbase for the type of Billy Joel concert you're talking about is also much larger, so there's less of a need to cater to the needs and wants of the public.

I don't think lack of interest is an issue. Given the variety of shows on Broadway (plays and musicals, comedies and drama, revivals and contemporary works) there really is something for just about everybody. Few New Yorkers wouldn't avail themselves of the opportunity to see SOMETHING once in a while if the price was affordable (whatever 'affordable' is) just as just about everybody watches movies from time to time. The issue is not that Broadway, as an entertainment medium, is not of interest to the general public -- it's that it's completely off the radar for the masses of people who cannot afford it. Make the price "officially" competitive -- to a figure that you're accepting anyway, when discounts are factored in -- and more people will come.

And again, I'm talking about what producers of shows that DON'T have moviestars in them, or who are not at the helm of BoM/Lion King/Wicked juggernauts, should do. Most such shows fail; those that succeed are aberrations (there are probably five Last Ships for every one Gentleman's Guide, and ten Country Houses for every one Curious Incident.) Rather than continue to employ the same failed policy again and again, for those shows that don't have a built-in audience, try a more dynamic form of pricing, and see if your show doesn't succeed.

[schmoe]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 2:52pm

I understand what you're saying about all the discounts resulting in a lower price anyway, but I don't think TKTS and other discounts are going away. So, if you begin with a lower face value, then you are going to lose money even faster and there is no guarantee that audiences will skyrocket. At the bottom line, a product costs a fixed amount to make and if the pricing does not support a profit on that price, it won't be around too long. And, I do think that the supply and demand argument is completely relevant. That is why some shows stay around and make money and some are gone quickly.

[Cesare2]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 3:29pm

I don't think a cheaper top price is perceived as much of a selling point. It's seen as a concession that the show is not as good as the others, even if the show clearly has lower running costs. Why else would flopping shows still advertise premium pricing? I remember a show once billing itself as "Finally an Affordable Musical!," with ticket prices significantly lower than other musicals playing at the time. You had to look at the smaller print lower in the ad to see that it starred Len Cariou and George Rose, and that it had music by Charles Strouse and book and lyrics by Alan Jay Lerner. The show was always at TKTS. (I saw it three times that way.) It opened and closed on the same night.
The answer would seem to be to offer cheaper tickets in less desirable seating areas. But the Book of Mormon did that, and look what happened.

[wonkit]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 3:46pm

The problem with lowering prices is a professional production on Broadway isn't cheap. Equity and the crafts unions have set such high minimums in terms of contracts, staffing and extras [medical, pension, etc.] that it may not be possible to run a show at lower prices. I am all in favor of unions - they have kept performers and staff at a living wage, but a producer simply cannot afford to low ball tickets and still make the nut, even if every seat is sold. And remember - in addition to covering costs, investors expect a return on their money. Even at these high ticket prices it is true (and has been for years) that only 20% of shows recoup the entire outlay and make any profit at all.

I agree that prices are high, but having spent $18 for an IMAX movie ticket, I can tell you that live theater at least delivers something worthwhile most of the time. Movies lately are crap.

[Jane2]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 3:47pm

I think tourists are the most important factor in theater ticket sales. Here's my scenario - the tourists book a trip to NYC. They go through a travel agent, let's say. They plan an itinerary, including theater. They select a show and date to see it. After the agent and tourist finish the planning of the trip, the agent states the cost and the tourist accepts it or not. OR-the price of the whole trip is stated right at the start, without the details. Somehow, the price of the theater tickets gets lost in the shuffle, and the tourist is only concerned with the price of the trip as a whole.

Am I close? I"ve never planned such a trip, but this is what I envision. Correct me if I'm wrong.

[mordav]

Posted: 2/15/15 at 5:54pm

As a tourist, I come to New York for a couple of weeks every March/April, I will see about 8-10 shows while I am there, a mix of Broadway and off-Broadway. When I first started coming I'd book everything beforehand and pay full price, wanting the best seats.Nowadays, I will book a few before I leave and the rest I will pick up at the TKTS booth. But I see mainly plays and I know the line isn't that long.I can't speak for other tourists, but this is how i do it.
Also, I don't know how it will affect the tourist dollar in general, but the American economy is really strong right now. Two years ago one Australian dollar got me one US dollar, now it gets me seventy-five cents. This means I am paying almost a thousand Australian dollars more for the same accommodation I had two years ago, which means something has to go. Expensive ticket seats are one of the things that had to go for my upcoming trip. If tourists are the most important factor in ticket sales, the strong US economy might hurt theater sales.

[OlBlueEyes]

Posted: 2/16/15 at 2:25am

OlBlueEyes, the Beaumont's loge is only five rows deep. Rows A-C are the same price as the orchestra and Rows D and E are priced $55 cheaper (at least that's the price differential for THE KING AND I).

Ouch!

I had the Beaumont confused with the American Airlines and the King and I mixed with 20th Century. AA has a seven row mezzanine. First four rows are the same price as the orchestra - full price $147 - the next two rows are "rear mezzanine" -- full price $102 - and the last mysterious Row G, also part of the rear mezzanine - full price $67 and never discounted any lower.