New Tony Awards Category is crap...

[NYC_or_Bust]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 12:37pm

Of all the possible choices and they go with THAT? I guess I'm just a strong supporter for Broadway ensembles. Who was it that in a recent TONY awards tele-cast said there SHOULD be an award for best ensemble? I think that's a much better category..I mean, provided, BEST MUSICAL would include the ensemble, having a category particularly for them could do a number of things for the show (i.e. boost ticket sales)...If you've got a great star, great story and great ensemble...wouldn't you think that could sell? I don't know anyone leaving a show that says "Wow, (stars name) was amazing, but that ensemble....YIKES"

[luvtheEmcee]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 12:38pm

Maybe that's soon to come.

[uncageg]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 12:40pm

NYC, I have actually left a show not liking the ensemble.

[popcultureboy]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 12:40pm

Possibly. And the category isn't crap. There have been cases where people who take over a role from its orginator have been as good or better and are deserving of recognition.

[bjivie2]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 12:46pm

Yeah, I think it's a shame that ensemble isn't being recognized, but that's not going to sell tickets. A Tony-winning replacement is.

[RockabyeHamlet]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 12:47pm

I think the new catagory is an awesome idea. But I also think they need one for best ensemble.

[popcultureboy]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 12:47pm

And from a logisitical point of view, nominating 5 ensembles creates a ticketing headache you can't even begin to imagine.

[NYC_or_Bust]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 12:48pm

popcultureboy, you wouldn't happen to be Harvey Fierstein , would you? ...only joking...


I UNDERSTAND the category, and I agree I believe that they should get some recognition...But it just seems like they've really gone out on a limb for that category...It just seems like they ran out of stuff and somebody just threw that out there to say it...

I'm just curious if these are soon to follow by TONY AWARDS 2010

Best Disney Show on Broadway
Best Performance by a Man Playing a Woman
Best Swing
Best Show Running at Least 10 Years

I mean, really...

[ShineOn]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 12:59pm

It's all political. The Tony's are crap. It's nice to be recognized for your achievements, but they aren't the be all and end all. The best man rarely wins anyway. The underdog walks away empty handed, unless by chance some crazy publicity stunt occurs to save the Tony committees behind and they rightfully award the character show/person that year. It's just one big huge endless conspiracy.

Broadway has become crap. The sacredness of theatre has been diminished. The minute it became Disney-a-fied and Hollywoodized it fell into a point of no return.

This category doesn't surprise me in the least. Congratulations Brooke Shields and Rosie O'Donnell. Now maybe you'll get the "recognition" you "deserve"?

[touchmeinthemorning]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 1:04pm

Wow...I'm shocked at how many bitter people there are here.

The Tonys are, of course, not about who is most talented. It is about the best marketting opportunity Broaddway has to offer. I say that if we can get more people into Broadway shows, why wouldn't we be happy with that?

Also, thiis category has been talked about more than any other potential category, so it is hardly out of left field. Those of us that follow this discussion have been hoping this would happen.

I agree that it would be great to give out an award for best ensemble (as I think being in the ensemble is the hardest job on Broadway)...the tricky thing is defining what an ensemble is. Not impossible, but much more difficult than this new category to define.

[doodlenyc]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 1:22pm

I recognize that there have been many award worthy performances from replacements, but I feel like this is a slippery slope. While I doubt that the Tonys will never become the unwieldy kind of award shows that the Emmys and Grammys have become, I feel this is a line that doesnt need to be crossed. I think it would be sad if Brooke Shields won a Tony for Wonderful Town a year after Donna Murphy lost for the same role.

Am I being too much of a traditionalist?

[popcultureboy]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 1:32pm

Essentially yes you are . Who's to say Brooke wasn't better than Donna? That's the point. It's widely agreed that if this category had been in place at the time, Reba would have won for Annie Get Your Gun.

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 1:48pm

The bitterness on this thread is hysterical.

"The Tony's are crap."

I'm sure every person who has won one says EXACTLY the same thing. And I'm even more sure they don't care what you think about it.

"It's just one big huge endless conspiracy."

That's right....and they are coming to get you next....

See what happens when you stop taking your schizo meds?

"Broadway has become crap. The sacredness of theatre has been diminished. The minute it became Disney-a-fied and Hollywoodized it fell into a point of no return."

And what have you written or produced that is more worthy of Broadway? Firstly, theatre is an art, not a religion, and is therefore not "sacred". Secondly, all art forms change and evolve. If they didn't we would still be watching operettas and minstrel shows on Broadway. What has become crap is the narrowmindedness of the so-called "fans" of theatre.

"This category doesn't surprise me in the least. Congratulations Brooke Shields and Rosie O'Donnell. Now maybe you'll get the 'recognition' you 'deserve'?"

Perhaps they will. And perhaps you will get the "recognition" you "deserve" as well.

"The Tonys are, of course, not about who is most talented."

Actually, most of the time, they are. It's the category of Best Musical that is usually the cause for debate and relies heavily on campaigning efforts of the producers. The biggest problem is that we all assume that whoever is voting should think like us, and they simply do not.

This category has been a long time coming, especially after Reba's critically acclaimed performance replacing Bernadette Peters in Annie Get Your Gun. London's Olivier Awards honoring the West End has had this category for some time.

Updated On: 9/26/05 at 01:48 PM

[ShineOn]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 1:48pm

See, now Reba is someone I can justly say deserved that award. But this category is going to be used as a crutch for producers. It's their angle. That's my qualm with it.

[WOSQ]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 1:51pm

"Crap" is perhaps a bit too strong a term for my taste, but I do not think the category is needed.

Yes, there are very talented people who take over roles, but the cream is the one who originated the part. Rather than take away from the originators, let the Tony stand for something. Let Reba McIntyre take the chance and come in in a new production.

Will we have featured women who are less than household names in a play competing in the same category as musical men who are recognized stars? Or will we have 8 new performing categories?

What if the producer does not give out comps to their show? Will that mean that those eligible from that show be excluded? I cannot see how the producers of Wicked (for example) will want to shell out 1400+ comp tickets again. Those 1400 tickets represent $140,000 which is a lot of money.

[Theatreboy33]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 1:54pm

i figure this means the producers will really try to keep shows in constant tip top shape, always aware that their actors can be nominated. Shows will be less likely to fall into the trap of just "going through the motions." I mean, it's kind of exciting to think that in the future we can see another nomination for someone playing the phantom or leo bloom.

[NYC_or_Bust]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 2:03pm

I belive a Broadway Season is much like a high school year book. It should be immortalized, and that's what the TONYs are for. They are a constant reminder of THAT season. I think it's really stupid to press on into next year's award show and give someone a Tony for a show that qualifies in last year's season for every OTHER category.

I've seen plenty of shows -POST TONYs ,that set pieces have changed...So does that mean the set designers should be allowed to qualify next season for a TONY?

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 2:13pm

"i figure this means the producers will really try to keep shows in constant tip top shape, always aware that their actors can be nominated. Shows will be less likely to fall into the trap of just 'going through the motions'."

Well, that didn't work for London. I've seen more productions phoned-in in the West End than anywhere else.

CORRECTION: The Olivier Awards DO NOT have a separate category for replacements. Replacements are in the same categories as original cast members and are up for the same award (Supporting Actor categories are not split into male/female). Martine McCutcheon (2002) and Joanna Riding (2003) both won Best Actress in a Musical or Entertainment for the exact same role (Eliza in My Fair Lady).

[Kringas]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 2:13pm

So does that mean the set designers should be allowed to qualify next season for a TONY?

No, because currently there is no category for Best Set Redesign.

[Rentaholic2]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 2:20pm

My only reservation about this new category is the fact that there will be that many more Tony-winning actors...not that that is necessarily a bad thing, but to win a Tony is a such a special deal, and I just don't want it to become something where we throw them around. It makes it less significant for Tony winners.

[zepka102]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 2:23pm

Matt, i just want to say i love you

[NYC_or_Bust]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 2:28pm

Kringas, my point is ...do you think that it's okay for categories to have "second chances"....

I believe that when somone is cast in a role, and are able to qualify for THAT, then that's it...no take backs, no fill-ins, no second chances...

While yes, some replacements have proven to be better than the origional leads, I believe they should be given recognition but not an award. They weren't there for the season that it qualified for the Tony Awards.

There are other forms of recognition. So what if they are better and don't win an award? Isn't that what sometimes happens to leads in shows anyway? I mean think back to 2003...Bernadette Peters against MJW. A lot of people believed that Bernadette was robbed. But there's no second chance, she didn't win. That's showbiz....

A least when it comes to Broadway and Tony Awards, I personally don't believe in second chances for a performer in a show that qualified LAST season

Shows are kept fresh with changes (like casting), but I believe if this is some ploy to keep the TONYS fresh, they could have come up with a better category

[EponineThenardier]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 2:37pm

I keep thinking how good Barrett Foa is in Ave Q and would love to see him nominated. But I also think John should have won instead of Hugh, so it's kind of a slap in the face. And more or less it goes to the best written part with a very good performer in that slot.

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 2:44pm

"I've seen plenty of shows -POST TONYs ,that set pieces have changed...So does that mean the set designers should be allowed to qualify next season for a TONY?"

Perhaps, if the set was redesigned. But changing a piece here or there or scaling the same design down a bit is not really a change in its original design. A new actor taking on a role previously created by someone else is like redesigning a performance. I think that's easy enough to understand. Zoe Caldwell, Patti LuPone and Faye Dunaway (tour) did not give the same performance in Master Class. Zoe won the Tony, Patti deserved a Tony, and Faye was deservedly never given the chance to win the Tony. She would have been better off staying in bed.

[EponineThenardier]

Posted: 9/26/05 at 3:18pm

Actually I would love for Hugh Panero to get this for Phantom. But he might be in line already for Lestat, you never know.