Number of completed songs in Sondheim new score

[BETTY22]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 7:16am

I friend in the show tells me there are SIX new songs in the first act and - wait for it - ZERO new songs in the second act.

The score was less than 50% completed when he passed.

 

[binau]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 9:21am

BETTY22 said: "I friend in the show tells me there are SIX new songs in the first act and - wait for it - ZERO new songs in the second act.

The score was less than 50% completed when he passed.

"

But when you say 'new songs' are you suggesting that other songs (e.g. trunk) will be used or the score will indeed be 6 songs act one 0 songs act two?

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 9:32am

I don't have any insider info, but this is one of the most fascinating cultural artifacts we've seen in American theatre in a long time.

As we know from Sondheim himself and that Cameron Mackintosh interview last year, this was very much a work in progress with some of the songs not even complete. I think we need to seriously manage expectations about this being a great work of art (unless the early previews indicate otherwise). If I find it to be an intriguing curio, I'll consider that a success for an off-Bway run.

I'm curious about what type of work was done on the show after his death to bring it to a produceable state.

Updated On: 8/6/23 at 09:32 AM

[Owen22]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 9:44am

I have no expectations that this will be good.

But I ain't missin' it!

[Jordan Catalano]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 9:47am

Well maybe act two has all the characters talking about how much they love Sondheim musicals and singing their favorite songs from his shows. 

[thirtythirtyninety]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 10:16am

6 new Sondheim songs is infinitely better than none! 

[TotallyEffed]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 10:26am

Jordan Catalano said: "Well maybe act two has all the characters talking about how much they love Sondheim musicals and singing their favorite songs from his shows."


The source material is so utterly bizarre and surreal that this sounds plausible and kind of amazing lol

[pethian]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 10:38am

Maybe now we're beginning to see why the show's powers-that-be were so tight-lipped about their show. Would all that frenzy to buy tickets the second it was announced have happened if this news was known then? Meanwhile, even with that, there are tons of tickets still available.

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 11:09am

This is baseless speculation, but if it turns out to be embarrassingly bad, it could raise questions of the estate's ethics and producing someone's unfinished work after they die. Different, perhaps, than things like TICK TICK BOOM (in which finished songs were given a narrative by David Auburn) or A.I. (Kubrick's long-in-development screenplay which was later directed by Spielberg) or LONG DAY'S JOURNEY INTO NIGHT (a finished work that O'Neill didn't want produced nearly that soon after his death but his widow allowed it). And as with a lot of things, there may be no clean, definitive answer.

Updated On: 8/6/23 at 11:09 AM

[JasonC3]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 11:17am

LOL.  Can't wait to see where threads like this one go until we get some actually experience with the work. Happy speculating!

[BJR]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 11:22am

It's true it's not billed this way, but we could think of it as a play with music. And given the experimental nature of the source material, that would fit.

[signorafosca2]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 11:39am

Considering there were 4-5 readings of this show over the last seven years of Sondheim’s life I find it very hard to believe there are only six completed songs. I understand this show was unfinished but this doesn’t ring true.

[ljay889]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 12:13pm

signorafosca2 said: "Considering there were 4-5 readings of this show over the last seven years of Sondheim’s life I find it very hard to believe there are only six completed songs. I understand this show was unfinished but this doesn’t ring true."

I completely agree. 

[pmensky]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 12:33pm

When Sondheim was on Colbert, didn’t he say it was ready, or done? 

[bear88]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 1:11pm

Let’s assume, for the sake of discussion, that BETTY22’s blind item is accurate.

I have operated on the following set of assumptions about this show, based on various news accounts.

1) Sondheim never finished it. He also is a well-known procrastinator, writing many significant songs during his career in previews or out-of-town tryouts. That was never going to happen this time.

2) It wasn’t necessarily close to being finished. Cameron Mackintosh said 50-60 percent, and BETTY22 has it at less than that. The second act is a total mystery.

3) Michael Cerveris said the first act was basically done when he did a reading in 2017. Was it only six songs then? The show could have been rewritten since then, and songs could have been dropped.

4) There was a reading, with Nathan Lane and Bernadette Peters, just a few months before Sondheim’s death that led to public announcements about the planned show by Sondheim and Lane.

4) Several prominent creatives - including the director, music director, and Sondheim’s longtime orchestrator - believe the show is in presentable form. Their involvement affected my decision to buy tickets, albeit the cheapest ones I could get.

5) The show is being billed as a musical, but if it’s really a play with music (the music being Sondheim’s last songs and whatever other music the creatives pull together), I would still be interested in seeing it. Some of my favorite plays in recent years (Cambodian Rock Band, Vietgone, Indecent) have been plays with music.

6) If it’s really a play with music, there would be legitimate questions raised about how this show has been marketed. But that’s a separate issue.

7) The cast is interesting. There are a lot of talented people involved in trying to make this work. I do not believe they are all participating in a cynical cash grab.

8) The show might be terrible, but that is always a possibility. As my wife said when we decided to get tickets: ‘It will be an experience.’

[binau]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 1:26pm

No doubt next week Cameron Mackintosh will say “oh I know I said it was 50% done but but I didn’t tell you about the FINAL conversation I ever had with Sondheim, I mean Steve. He performed the entire score to me and only me for the very first time he said. It was just days before he died. I was shocked. “Here we are”, I said to Steve and he decided to name the whole show after it. 

[bear88]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 1:54pm

pmensky said: "When Sondheim was on Colbert, didn’t he say it was ready, or done?"

No. Sondheim said they had a reading and were ‘encouraged. … We’re going to go ahead with it. With any luck, we’re going to get it on next season.’

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 2:23pm

bear88 said: "pmensky said: "When Sondheim was on Colbert, didn’t he say it was ready, or done?"

No. Sondheim said they had a reading and were ‘encouraged. … We’re going to go ahead with it. With any luck, we’re going to get it on next season.’"


Knowing how Sondheim worked, if a production was announced with an actual timeline it probably would have kicked him into gear to finish his score. Love how much of a procrastinator our king was (and that he could get away with it!)

[pethian]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 3:03pm

This reminds me that SUNDAY IN THE PARK WITH GEORGE only had a first act at its initial production at Playwrights.

But what an act.

[BalconyClub]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 3:03pm

To borrow the lyric from BALLROOM, I’d rather have fifty percent of Sondheim - or any percent of Sondheim - than all of anybody else at all.

[devonian.t]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 3:16pm

I suspect that for many people, the reaction is going to be "what if he had been around to finish the process..."

[jacobsnchz14]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 3:25pm

devonian.t said: "I suspect that for many people, the reaction is going to be "what if he had been around to finish the process...""

Me with Rent.

[Alex Kulak2]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 5:20pm

bear88 said: "4) Several prominent creatives - including the director, music director, and Sondheim’s longtime orchestrator - believe the show is in presentable form. Their involvement affected my decision to buy tickets, albeit the cheapest ones I could get."

That's the main source of my faith in this show. Tom Kirdahy, Joe Mantello, Jonathan Tunick Alex Gemignani, none of these guys are hurting for work. I have believe they have enough integrity (and enough respect for Sondheim) to only attach their names to the project if they really believe he'd want to see it presented in the version it's currently in.

[JayElle]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 8:34pm

signorafosca2 said: "Considering there were 4-5 readings of this show over the last seven years of Sondheim’s life I find it very hard to believe there are only six completed songs....."

What show?  Name please?  tnx

 

[signorafosca2]

Posted: 8/6/23 at 9:08pm

JayElle said: "signorafosca2 said: "Considering there were 4-5 readings of this show over the last seven years of Sondheim’s life I find it very hard to believe there are only six completed songs....."

What show? Name please? tnx

"
Whatever they were calling it in 2016, which is the earliest referenced reading I’m finding right now although I believe it was being performed in readings/workshops as far back as 2015.

https://playbill.com/article/matthew-morrison-says-sondheims-new-bunuel-musical-is-challenging