Sunset Thoughts- Page 2

[James885]

Posted: 7/6/10 at 7:28pm

I never saw Patti or Glenn live, but I have both the London and American premiere recordings and have seen video (not bootlegs) of both of them. I prefer Glenn. She may not have had the strongest voice, but she was (IMO) much more believable as a former silent film star. There's a video of her performing With One Look at a gala for ALW in character and in full costume, and she gives an absolutely mesmerizing performance. Patti struck me as very cold and sterile and didn't, in my opinion, convey that air of elegance that Norma should have.

On the plus side, the worst Norma IMO is Petula Clark in the second national tour. She was horrible. And Susan Schulman's staging wasn't too hot either.

[AEA AGMA SM]

Posted: 7/6/10 at 7:55pm

I'm curious how the Schulman staging would look now with a bit more distance from the original Nunn/Napier production and now that there have been some other smaller-scale productions. The fact that it wasn't that grand set was certainly noticed in more than a couple of reviews.

As for the first national tour, I'm curious who thought it was a good idea to send out. If I recall correctly, the way the numbers worked the show would need need a minimum of 3-4 weeks in one venue just to recoup load-in/out and transportation costs, and at that point in time if a show wasn't Phantom or Les Mis just about every road presenter balked at anything more than two weeks.

[chernjam]

Posted: 7/6/10 at 9:32pm

AEA - I saw the Schulman staging twice as well...

Lots of people ripped on it and Petula Clark as well... But to be honest, it was extremely effective. The direction seemed tighter and more focused. A lot of little things - Too Much in Love To Care was 100 times more memorable and moving - the finale with a lot of flashbacks during the "orchestral" music after Norma screams JOE (for inviting Betty to come over) - the finale itself was simplified and worked. It really was great. And had they done that with strong casting, there's no reason it couldn't have made boatloads of money. The original production was a wonder to behold, but for it to be a bona-fide, financial "hit" would have meant it would sell out at top prices for something like 2 years. Ambitious to say the least.

As for Petula, she really wasn't that bad in that tour. I know lots of people couldn't stand her, but I'd rank her higher than LuPone and Paige

[jo]

Posted: 7/6/10 at 9:48pm

Interestingly, SUNSET BOULEVARD is still the leader for the highest advances for a Broadway show ( $ 37 million or so, quoted in many quarters - sorry, but I have lost the links)! I doubt that it can be beaten for a very long time.

Hopefully, we will eventually see a revival that will not diminish too much the appeal of the original staging and the excellent musical score.

I have practically given up on a movie version ( it's Paramount's call, as they own the original movie rights) - be it a musical or a remake of the classic movie.



Updated On: 7/6/10 at 09:48 PM

[My Oh My]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 12:28am

I was very familiar with the original London cast recording and was/am a huge Lupone fan by the time I saw Glenn and company in the L.A. production over at the Shubert.

To me, there was no question that Glenn gave one of the best, most nuanced performances I had ever seen. Her delivery of the lines, whether sung or spoken, was clever and even enlightening, making moments that seemed forced on the London album produce maximum effect where none was expected.

Anyone who has seen Patti as Eva (whether live or on a grainy bootleg) will tell you her recorded performance on the Evita American Premiere album is much subdued. I now know that she had recorded it very early on before she was given time to grow into the character or even develop it, and I had read somewhere that she had just recovered from illness. Whatever the case, her recorded Norma performance is almost identical from what I've seen on videos. I was sort of hoping she'd be better.

What really surprised me about the Sunset American Premiere recording is Glenn--and the entire cast, for that matter-- basically carbon copied their stage performances exactly on the recording. There is usually some variation but it was almost as if it was recorded live. Everything, the way they delivered their lines on stage at the Shubert, every nuance is preserved on the recording, and when I listen to it, it takes me back.

The changes only improved the show, imo. I agree that "Every Movie's a Circus" is a crap number and some of the over-long scenes, like the one at Artie's apartment with the dumb gags about DeMille and hopes and dreams, blah, blah, blah I didn't care for. But as a whole, the changes improved what sounded like a very unexciting show in London.

[jimmycurry01]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 1:40am

I have never seen a live production of Sunset. I would have loved to, but was too young or too poor both times it came to Chicago. I do have almost every cast recording ever made from the London Cast, the American Premier cast, Canadian, BBC Radio cast, and countless Demo CDs for all of the replacements. Glenn Close is really my favorite. She really gets the character to me. It is true she is not the best vocally, but there is more to acting on the musical stage than just having a pretty voice.
It would have been interesting to see what Patti did with the role in the revised production on Broadway, but I suspect Glenn would still have been the better choice.

[bryan2]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 11:44am

What I want to know why people get mad that Patti was given over a million dollars to be "replaced" It was a business decision based on Patti being grossly miscast and really not "pretty enuff" to be believed as a silent movie film beauty. The american reviewers were the most cruel saying she was short and from the front you could see up her "ardvark" nose into her nostrils. i think if he brought her here after the reviews ..he would have been an idiot when GC was getting raves in LA.. Patti should realize it was a business decision not a personal or emotional one...
I also would love to hear a copy of Faye Dunaway singing anything from Sunset....

[Brick]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 12:12pm

^There is a quite a bit of ignorance in your remark, but I'll attempt nonetheless.

First of all, it is called breach of contract. If Patti had a contract to go to Broadway, even a verbal one, then she had right to sue. Second, it wasn't handled professionally. Patti found out she had been fired by the press announcing Glenn's move to B'way.

These two things alone are reason enough to make one very upset actress, meanwhile holding a very flawed show and production on her shoulders.

That is only two things: Patti has written two chapters on the debacle. I imagine there is much more.
Updated On: 7/7/10 at 12:12 PM

[bryan2]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 12:36pm

Ignorance is a strong statement. I was quoting frank rich
not myself. I am also aware of the breach of contract...hence a business decision and she was compensated through her suit. I happen to like Patti very much but not as Norma....and I think dwelling as she has in almost every interview makes her look bitter and it really is time to move on..And the best vengence is to win and she did with Gypsy!!
I dont know why you feel you have to come back with a condesending comment but that basically says everything about you I guess...and thanks for attempting to explain to my ignorant self you realy schooled me !

[castlestreet]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 12:49pm

I will agree with the Bitterness statement 100%- eventually you have to find a good place for it. While I agree totally that it was handled very poorly, she needs to get to a place where she can finally say- "I wish things had been handled better, but there is nothing I can do about it now".

The other aspect of her interviews that have rubbed me the wrong way is how she talks about Evita. I know it was a Webber show, I know that she doesn't want to pay homage to the man, but she always talks about hwo it was one of the worst experiences of her professional life. This is the role that turned you into a star.

It was only on that PBS interview she did on Youtube, that I heard her explain why for the first time. She had terrible vocal problems her entire run of the show. She finally commented that when she played the part in Australia (which I was not aware she had until that point) she reached a confidence in herself to go out there night after night and sing the hell out of the score!

I love Patti LuPone and have for many years, but she probably would seem like the bigger person if she stopped bashing Webber in every single interview she does- I thought the comment she made about him being a drunk was kinda petty, and that he wants to be Stephen Sondheim. I don't think he wants to be Sondheim any more than Sondheim would ever want to be Lloyd Webber- they have very different styles and very different approaches, and I would say they are both more than comfortable with their careers up to this point.

Maybe Patti should listen to her buddies song "Move On"

[chernjam]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 1:38pm

castlestreet -
ABSOLUTELY! Thank you for saying what I've been thinking for years. She has consistently derided Evita since Sunset making it seem like a horrible experience with a "difficult score". Funny, she didn't seem to dislike it when she campaigned and sought to star in Sunset from the Sydmonton festival to the World Premiere.

Granted - she has every right to feel it wasn't handled properly but lady it's 16 years now - GET OVER IT. Hell, if she burried the hatchet, agreed to star in a revival in NY she'd make boatloads of money, look classy and "prove" alw wrong for not going with her in the first place (from what I remember, they are storing the original set somewhere, so it might not be as hard to put together as we might think)

Wishful thinking, for sure. But she's the one who really seems "Small" by ridiculous comments like "he wishes he was Sondheim" - just absolutely childish.

And lest we forget - she was offered originally to star in London, LA and THEN NY - when she passed on LA is when they sought Glenn Close. She as a show business person should know by then what a cruel business it can be and shouldn't have even opened the door to letting someone upstage her

[Bettyboy72]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 3:50pm

"What really surprised me about the Sunset American Premiere recording is Glenn--and the entire cast, for that matter-- basically carbon copied their stage performances exactly on the recording. There is usually some variation but it was almost as if it was recorded live. Everything, the way they delivered their lines on stage at the Shubert, every nuance is preserved on the recording, and when I listen to it, it takes me back. "

I totally agree. I bought the American Premiere recording solely based on loving Glenn (at that point I didn't know she could sing) and I immediately fell in love with it. I felt then (still do) that it is like listening to a radio play with amazing performances. I felt like I was in the theatre. A very solid recording.

[bryan2]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 3:57pm

Get a copy of Barnum...Glenn sings in that also...actually her voice is better in Barnum..(songs are not as rangey)

Sunset needs to be a movie .>MERYL can you hear me

[Bettyboy72]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 4:08pm

Personally, I feel that Meryl gets enough and should let Glenn play the role in the film. Meryl Streep gets everything and I'm a little sick of it.

I think Glenn should make her RETURN to the big screen in the film and get an A-listers for Joe and Betty.

[bryan2]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 4:53pm

Glenn in it wouldnt make me unhappy but I think
that Meryl is more bankable and can get it made...
Glenn is the best actress ever not to win an academy award.
Fatal Attraction was hers but they gave it to Cher to pay her back for omiting her for Mask....the hollywood way
but I agree ...

[esparza 333]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 5:00pm

I think she might get the role if it it gets underway around 2012 which is most likely to happen anyway. I say this because she has an extremely baity role in a promising film coming up that could serve as a screen comeback for her. it is called Albert Knobbs and she plays an eccentric woman who lives her life as a man in the Victorian Era and gets arrested along the way. She is producing and it sounds very interesting. I read it was a play somewhere but I could be wrong. This could serve as a comeback and could be the role that finally wins her an Oscar and I think after buzz generates and offers come in a Sunset remake will be brought up. At that point it would seem inevitable.

[Bettyboy72]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 5:04pm

esparza, that film sounds wonderful. I cant believe Glenn has no Oscars when Swank has two!!!! Whats up with that? Fatal Attraction and Dangerous Liaisons got her no Oscars???? Criminal!!!!!

[esparza 333]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 5:12pm

I know it is a crime. For me she is on the same level as Meryl Streep and always has been. Just look at her work over the years not to mention her bravura and tour de force work on Damages. Hopefully this film will take her all the way. I mean she is a powerhouse. And i don't think anybody in the business has better facial expressions then her. She can chill you with one look (no pun intended). That's why she was ideal for Desmond.

[bryan2]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 5:23pm

We cant push too hard because ALW will pick an unknown like he did for phantom...and we all know what happened

[Broadway Bob*]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 5:38pm

I'm still in the Streisand camp for the film version.

And it's my fantasy (completely un-SUNSET related) to see Glenn Close, Meryll Streep, and Sigourney Weaver in a movie together. Talk about sheer star power! The audience would come out of the theater looking like the guy in the old Maxell tape commercials!)

[Bettyboy72]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 6:13pm

"And it's my fantasy (completely un-SUNSET related) to see Glenn Close, Meryl Streep, and Sigourney Weaver in a movie together. Talk about sheer star power! The audience would come out of the theater looking like the guy in the old Maxell tape commercials!"

I hear you, but that cast would be no guarantee. Remember EVENING with Close, Streep, Richardson, Redgrave, Wilson, Danes, Atkins, Collette, bostiwck and Dancy???? I was so excited about that film and WHAT A HOT MESS!!!!

[madbrian]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 8:41pm

Close, Streep, Streisand, and most of the names being tossed around are too old for Norma. Among the age-appropriate actresses out there (50ish), I think Michelle Pfeiffer might be able to pull it off. Also, I think James Marsden is right for Joe.

[Finch]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 8:59pm

Did anyone see Susan Dawn Carson--one of Norma's understudies from LA to the show's NY closing? She went on a couple of times to replace Elaine Paige, I think.

[Bettyboy72]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 9:18pm

I think Streep, Close and Stresiand would photograph just fine as Norma. For crying out loud, Streep was 60 years old playing a 40 year old in Mamma Mia and NO ONE batted an eyelash.

If you ask me, CLose looks exactly the same to me now as she did in the 80s.

[castlestreet]

Posted: 7/7/10 at 9:38pm

I have long dreamed that a movie version of the musical was finally going to happen- hell- I remember back in 95/96 Liz Smith reporting that a signed deal was done with Babs as Norma and Tom Cruise as Joe-YIKES! But of course it was nothing more than rumor.

I think one of the most important things is finding someone who is capable of directing it- in my own opinion, of the three Webber musicals that made it to the big screen, each and everyone of them were paired with the wrong director.

I think a Sam Mendes production would have a fighting chance of getting made in Hollywood, and now that he and Kate are split we wouldn't have to worry about another director casting his wife in a role she shouldn't be playing (attend the tale of Sweeney Todd)

I'm all for Glenn still- I think she'd finally win her Oscar even if the critics aren't crazy about the movie itself.