SUPER Controversial Thread!!! (Not for the faint of heart)- Page 10

[Bobby457]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 11:46am

Its funny...we were just having a big conversation in the office about having to pay to go to synagoge (sp). I just think that is SO wrong! there is my 2 cents

[newyorkuniq]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 11:49am

I have been a Catholic my entire life but I do not agree with some of the churches opinions.
Now regarding homosexuality this post has made me think about some things from Catholic school that you might find interesting.
When I was in 5th grade I had a teacher who lived with another women for over 20 years in the same house. We were kids but it seemed really obvious that they were in a "relationship". One day a kid raised his hand and asked "are you gay?" The entire room went silent, and she ignored the question. The next morning we were sat at our desks and our principal (a nun) came into the room and gave us a very harsh screaming lecture. She told us not to accuse someone of something so sinful etc etc.
As we grew up and went through high school seven of my classmates from that class discovered they were gay. One of them is my best friend today, and he is still traumatized from our catholic school experiences.

[Bobby457]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 11:52am

Im certainly glad I wasnt subjected to the Catholic Religion....I have lots of friends are scarred for life from that.

[newyorkuniq]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 11:55am

Well I am proud of my faith and am glad I was. Maybe not those certain opinions but everything else is very important to me.

Posted: 9/28/04 at 12:24pm

The last play I was involved with was a production of PARTY in Denver, CO. I played the rather flambouyant center of the piece, who also happened to be a gay Catholic priest. It was always interesting to me how many gay priests came to see the production (many of whom I knew pretty well) and showed absolutely no awareness of the interesting impression they were giving to the outside world. On the one hand, they could go out on a Saturday night and howl with laughter at this very gay play (and enjoy the fact that the entire cast ends up naked) - and then go for drinks with the cast afterwards at a gay bar - but then Sunday morning turn right around and represent an organization that isn't exactly welcoming to its gay members.

Ultimately, I have had to severe my relationships with all the gay priests I've known through the years (who were some of the most intelligent and educated people I've ever met) simply because I could no longer condone the inherrant hypocrisy - even if they could for themselves. Updated On: 9/28/04 at 12:24 PM

[mominator]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 12:45pm

For many, many reasons I call myself a "recovering Catholic".
Too Catholic to be Protestant, tooPotesttant to be Catholic, so I am in religon limbo.

Posted: 9/28/04 at 12:53pm

mom - have you tried the Unitarians?

[mominator]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 12:56pm

Sadly yes. Still too Catholic. Actually Dave and I find it a little bit funny.

Posted: 9/28/04 at 12:58pm

Well, mom, there's always Buddhism.

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 1:01pm

mom, a lot of Presbyterian churches are very open-minded.

[mominator]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 1:04pm

I don't know matbe the Lutherans? I have heard they like to sing all the verses of the hymns.

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 1:04pm

mom, I spent my childhood in the Lutheran church. You don't get any closer to Catholic than that. Try the Presbyterians.

[SonofMammaMiaSam]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 1:06pm

The Church of BWW.com is really working for me right now.

[mominator]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 1:08pm

I like your thinking SOMMS!
Will do Rath.

[son_of_a_gunn_25]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 1:29pm

Catholic here, but out church is very liberal. Out priest even hinted at the fact that the Church is probably going to have to address certain issues with all the advances in knowledge of psychology and such like they did when we learned a lot of problems were caused by mental illness and not demons. I was in a conversation with him about what exactly in church doctrine is relatively concrete and what he thinks might change in the future. The psychology thing was very vague but I am pretty sure I knew what he was alluding to as I am sure you can also.

[popcultureboy]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 1:31pm

Surely the term "liberal Catholic" is an oxymoron?

[LadyGuenevere]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 2:56pm

For two cents on how growing up homosexual in a Catholic school is...

I go to a WONDERFUL Catholic school, where they're considering starting a...oh snap, I forget the name- Gay-Straight Alliance or something like that? People are still trying to see if they have support...of course they're a bit scared to really start the club because of what some homophobic students (or closeted students) might do.

And our senior year, for religion, we delve into certain topics, one of them being homosexuality. And every teenage boy and girl that has come out of that class has had a better view of homosexuality, and they're definitely less homophobic- I have seen that course change people, which is a really good thing.

So not all Catholic schools are bad! (Now, for my greedy, corrupt, villain run Church...that's another story)

[bythesword84]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 4:10pm

No, many Catholic schools are fantastic, mine were. The problem is, as with anything else, people focus on the negative things and completely overlook the good ones.

As for the whole use of the Bible, people need to realize that Catholic and Protestant religions are different. They don't share the same beliefs which is why their Bible's vary. If they agreed on everything they wouldn't be two separate religions.

And no, liberal Catholic is hardly an oxymoron. It just means that you've accepted that the literal interpretation of the Bible is not true. If you're going to believe that Jesus taught to love everyone, then you're a true Catholic. If you pull out the OT and start babbling about rules and things then you're not a true Catholic in the sense of the word. The word Catholic in itself is meant to mean "universal" which includes not turning anyone away.

People are so commonly confused about the Catholic teaching on homosexuality. I've said it once, and I've said it 100 times, the Church does not specifically target homosexuals and say "oh those are bad people." The Church teaching is actually that any sex which does not have the potential for procreation is wrong. That meaning sex of any way, shape, or form, be it 2 men, 2 women, a man and a woman, whatever. Sex is taught to be something sacred and not something to be used with whomever whenever one wants. So it doesn't just mean homosexual behavior, it means any form of behavior in which the two adults are not wanting/hoping/accepting that a child is going to come from this.

Posted: 9/28/04 at 4:13pm

So, in other words, they're not anti-homosexual but rather anti-human nature?

[mominator]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 4:17pm

so by the Churchs' teachings bytheword84, my husband and I should have stopped having "relations" 16 years ago when I had my tubes tied?

[robbiej]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 4:29pm

bythesword,

Unfortunately, what you want to be a good Catholic is actually not what the Catholic church defines as a good Catholic. And, with all due respect, their the ones that get to define it...until there is enough of an uproar from the flock. Good Catholics really don't get to pick and choose what they want to believe...though most Catholics I know are realists and live with the contradictions.

The Catholic church has targeted homosexuals, and not just homosexual acts. It goes beyond 'You can't have homosexual sex because procreation is not possible.' They declare the inclination toward homosexuality a disorder...in other words I'm sick. And must be cured.

I was actually unaware that the Protestant and Catholic Bibles were all that different. I am aware that Protestantism came into being because of the perceived corruptions and willful disobediences of God's law in the Church hierarchy.

[robbiej]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 4:30pm

Actually, mom, the big sin was having your tubes tied.

[bythesword84]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 4:34pm

I don't think it's human nature for people go sleeping around just for the heck of it.

I'm not a Church authority, I was just stating the teaching. It doesn't matter to me if people do or do not have problems with it, I know where I stand and that's really all that matters. Anyone else can do whatever they want, it's not up to me to press my beliefs on someone else. It is however, up to me to specify what the teaching is whenever it gets muddled up, which is all I did.

And as for tube tying, I don't think tube tying by choice (ie because you want no more children as opposed to medical necessity) would be constituted as approved of by the church anyway. Don't take what I say about this as Gospel truth though because I'm not familiar with that aspect.

However, marriage is a union of two people who are joining together in order to (hopefully) raise a family at some point in time. Once they are married, then they can do what they want but the church teaches against any voluntary actions which would prohibit having children. So, if you had your tubes tied because you had to, or a hysterectomy (spelled wrong I know) for medical reasons, or just can't have children that's one thing. To just say "I don't want children" goes against their teaching of what marriage is.

[robbiej]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 4:38pm

Also, after doing a bit of research, I discovered that premarital sex is considered a 'grave sin', but homosexual acts are described as 'intrinsically evil'.

Interesting difference in wording.

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 9/28/04 at 4:38pm

And that is why we have to accept that the word marriage has taken on greater meaning than what any church has deemed. Our society has evolved greatly--just within heterosexual relationships.