Amateur production of CABARET (Is this allowed?)- Page 4

[beltingbaritone]

Posted: 12/26/08 at 10:02pm

I don't steal music, thank you. I just don't think its fair that you are rude to someone for generalizing when you yourself do it to, but just write it off as sarcasm. Maybe the other poster was being sarcastic as well.

I don't feel I owe you any respect, because I'm not recieving any in return from you; especially just because of an amount of posts. There are other "Broadway Legends" here who are respect others (like the user who posted this thread). I'm not sure why you have to rude.

I enjoy Broadwayworld, and I'm certainly not a newbie to theater. I don't understand why you feel a sense of entitlement just because you've posted here since 2004. That doesn't make you any more knowledgeable than someone who just joins today. You should probably get off your high horse and realize that being a "Broadway Legend" doesn't say anything about you except that you have the time to post here frequently.

And that's all I'm going to post about this, so other posters can discuss on topic.

Updated On: 12/26/08 at 10:02 PM

[binau]

Posted: 12/26/08 at 10:08pm

You've certainly earned the "diva" in your username - an opinion is an opinion, posting on a forum for longer doesn't make you superior.

[TheatreDiva90016]

Posted: 12/26/08 at 11:09pm

I never said that.

I just said you might want to get used to the way things work around here before you start whining.

That's all.

Go on with your lives.

[wonkit]

Posted: 12/26/08 at 11:11pm

SOCK puppet strikes again.

[bwaytramp]

Posted: 12/26/08 at 11:12pm

geez who even cares,

you people claim to love theater so much just go and enjoy the show.....stop freakin dissecting things into a million peices

jeez

you all are on soapboxes

[binau]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 12:06am

"I never said that. "

N.B:

"I don't need to be told anything by someone who joined within the last 2 months.

Put in some time on the boards first. "

Yes, that totally doesn't imply you think someone's opinion is valueless because you've been on a forum for longer. Guhhh...elitism..superiority...


But whatev.

[gypsy4]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 10:56am

Can't directors come up with there own vision for a show instead of steeling someone elses. Sometimes you can license a choreography guide book which is put together by
the original choreographer but than is only avaliable for very few shows.
Updated On: 12/27/08 at 10:56 AM

[TheatreDiva90016]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 2:19pm

qolbinau and BB,

This one's for you:
Click Here.

[binau]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 4:01pm

And there you go again...

[PattiLover]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 4:21pm

The worst offense of all is that the creative teams that completely steal from other productions get all the credit for being original. I worked on a production of Cabaret that pretty much recreated 85% of the revival...Luckily we had a good director who dug into the marrow of the show and created it from the ground up, but most of it was still stolen anyways...he began to get creative amnesia and think it was his own design (someone earlier in the thread mentioned photocopying the coffee table book-that was one of my duties). The problem with Cabaret is that you cannot go back to the campy Joel Grey version with that aweful "Sitting Pretty" and other junky songs. The Mendes revival is the best version of the show. It should just be liscensed since any production of the show is going to steal it anyway.

[TheatreDiva90016]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 4:23pm

qolbinau,

I guess you just don't want to learn...

[binau]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 6:35pm

You're right, sorry. I'll ignore any poster who joined within the last (how many months do you think?) as their opinion isn't valid otherwise, I get it now! How blind I must have been to see how arrogant this is..

Updated On: 12/27/08 at 06:35 PM

[TheatreDiva90016]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 6:56pm

I never said to ignore them.

Nice way to twist my words around.

I just said you need to know how this board works before you start bitching at people that have been here for years.


But I'm glad you understand your arrogance.

[bwayguy22089]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 7:21pm

This is a very interesting thread. First off, I never condoned this behavior. I think the magic of theatre is being inventive and using your own imagination. However, didn't the video say "in the style of the revival"? Do we know for certain that they took credit? Did anyone see a program from the show? Just wondering. I just don't want to jump on the bandwagon until we know all the facts.

Also, I never said I invented riffing lol. That's just dumb. I actually don't even really like riffing. However, I like to think that I made up my own. I had never heard them before. Someone copied every single one. That's why I was a little suspicious, but I didn't really care. If I were an amateur company and some professional company stole my designs or my choreography and made profit from it, then I'd be a little more angry.
Updated On: 12/27/08 at 07:21 PM

[binau]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 7:26pm

It's not just the issue about giving credit or not, but the 'copying' of 'intellectual property' (sets, costumes, choreography etc..) without having the licence or permission to do so..

[bwayguy22089]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 7:58pm

No no I agree. I'm not saying it should be done, I'm just saying it's not the end of the world, especially when an amateur theatre does it. I'd rather them do that than not do anything at all.

[blaxx]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 8:02pm

That's the wrong attitude! I rather them learn how to analyze a script and come up with a vision of their own.

[bwayguy22089]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 9:03pm

No no no lol, me too. I'm not disagreeing. I just want theatre to be prevalent everywhere.

[DaneSaw]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 9:39pm

I really don't think it's hurting anyone that this was done, especially by an amateur or community theater. It happens all the time. I know of a company that did "bare" before the performance rights were released and got around it by saying that they were doing a concert of a few songs when, in reality, they only cut the songs "Spring" and put on a full production...

Amateur theater usually doesn't get any kind of recognition for this sort of thing, nor do they usually make any money, especially if it's a community theater type deal. It may not be truthful to the set designers, choreographers, director, etc., but I highly doubt they're going to take personal offense if Acme Theater in Nowhere, Wisconsin decides to rip off the Broadway revival of Cabaret. I'd personally rather see that than some half-wit director give his/her interpretation of the show. It usually comes out a mess anyway.

[TheatreDiva90016]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 10:39pm

What?!

Not hurting anyone?

When they steal an entire show (bare) and 'get around it' by lying?

You are taking money away from the people who spent years writing and producing it.

And to use the excuse that "It usually comes out a mess anyway"...

I really don't know what else to say.

[iwearshoes]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 10:57pm

I have been lurking around this thread for a few days and just wanted to throw in my two cents.

I worked with this director on an amateur production of Seussical and the way that it was directed was to wheel in a television, put in the bootleg, watch, and go from there. Let us discuss the legality of that!

[TheatreDiva90016]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 11:02pm

I think that's really all that needs to be said.

Who is this director and why hasn't he been stopped?

[DaneSaw]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 11:10pm

He probably hasn't been stopped for the same reason a lot of productions like that haven't been stopped...they're not making much of a profit, they're not getting any kind of accolades or recognition on a large scale, and the number of productions that occur in that manner are so huge in number that it would be pointless to try to penalize one company when 12 others are probably doing the exact same thing elsewhere in the country.

If MTI or whatever company were to track down and punish every company that tried to get away with doing a show without rights/doing an unlicensed revival rip-off, they'd have no time to do anything else.

Hell, some kids at my college did the "revival" of Cabaret...they advertised it as a "student workshop" and got away with it scott-free.
Updated On: 12/27/08 at 11:10 PM

[Brick]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 11:25pm

As a director, it doesn't bother me. I don't intentionally copy other productions, though I wouldn't mind if someone copied mine. As Anne Bogart says, "I invent nothing. I steal everything".

The case where I believe it is a major issue is if a director lost a job remounting their own show, with someone else copying their work. (It's happened.)

[binau]

Posted: 12/27/08 at 11:37pm

"What?!

Not hurting anyone?

When they steal an entire show (bare) and 'get around it' by lying?

You are taking money away from the people who spent years writing and producing it. "

They aren't taking money away - this is a similar argument developers or corporations use against piracy; say they claim $2 million in loss because they have counted X amount of illegal downloads. The thing is they haven't lost it, because it assumes that every person pirating would have bought it otherwise.

Would the amateur group have paid for appropriate use or approval of their production if they couldn't do it illegally? Well I would think if they were going to, they would have.

Yes, it doesn't change that what they did was wrong, but it is hard to clearly spell in black and white terms that people have been 'hurt'/that revenue has been lost.