HS edition of Les miserables- Page 2

[QOM]

Posted: 9/18/05 at 11:10pm

"As for changing lyrics and making cuts, I don't think it's necessary, but if it is only a word here and there (not excessive) and keeps the integrity of the author/composer's intent it is ok."

"More ignorance... I can't believe people are actually posting things like this."

If MTI grants permission, there is nothing ignorant about it. Butchering a show or making cuts w/o permission is another story. Theatre educators of today have a harder job to prepare serious students for college and the real world. We need to expose our students to characters with depth and ones that will challenge them vocally. You all must know how difficult it is to get into good theatre programs. If we are to prepare them for this we have to be able to provide them with a wide range of experiences, especially if you have some very talented individuals who may actually have a chance at a career one day.Yes, we have done our share of Music Man's and Oklahoma's, which were great, but I know our kids were stretched more from doing Les Mis. If I need to change one word, with MTI permission, (which by the way, wasn't done for Les Mis) in order to give kids that experience, I will do it.

[LizzieCurry]

Posted: 9/18/05 at 11:14pm

I wish there were more people like you teaching these kids, QOM. You rock.

[QOM]

Posted: 9/18/05 at 11:16pm

thank you..I appreciate that! :)

[zzannahk]

Posted: 9/18/05 at 11:17pm

New Question: forget the quality of the school, do you think high schoolers (ages 14-1 are mature enough to do this play? my cousin said it was very hard for the girls playing the lovely ladies because the other kids at school were too immature.

[QOM]

Posted: 9/18/05 at 11:23pm

We only had seniors playing the "ladies." We also spoke with the seniors first and those who did not feel comfortable were more in the background of the scene. I would not put freshmen girls in a scene like that. That's just my opinion.

[The Distinctive Baritone]

Posted: 9/19/05 at 9:58am

I agree that's it's wrong to change the lyrics in a show, but I think that if you're doing something "dirty" and dealing with high school kids, this moral guidelines on changing it are fuzzy. It's a no-win situation, really.

However, giving a character's lines to another is completely unacceptable, as there would never be any reason for this.

Lizzie, I understand your being upset, but still, no one likes a tattle-tale.

Besides, having teenagers do "Les Mis" is already going to butcher the show. How much more damage could a few lyric changes do?

[QOM]

Posted: 9/19/05 at 11:02am

well I guess one way of looking at things is that any high school (or non-professional group for that matter)attempting to do any broadway show is butchering. Due to the nature of my job, I, of course, disagree with that. I have seen about 10-15 LSME productions and only 2 were very good. The rest sucked. But the ones that were good were amazing and better than a lot local theatre shows. I go to a lot of high school shows and have seen some talent that you would not believe. Last year, I saw an unbelievable production of Jekyll & Hyde. There was a good article in the NY Times last year about the state of theatre in America's high schools. Things are a lot different than when I was in h.s. There are some very expensive, very creative, and very incredible shows going on in our schools these days.

[The Distinctive Baritone]

Posted: 9/19/05 at 12:46pm

QOM--what do you do for a living? (How/why do you see all of these high school shows?)

[LizzieCurry]

Posted: 9/19/05 at 1:53pm

There's a difference between being a tattle and doing what's right. If MTI wasn't going to find out by actually being there, someone had to tell them. (They never replied to me, if that matters at all.)

True, kids doing Les Miz is already a disaster in the making -- but they're also learning as they go along. If their teacher/director is showing them that bending the rules to his whim is okay, then what?

[softershade]

Posted: 9/19/05 at 2:09pm

sadly, my high school director chose to do LMSE for in the spring and i already know it's going to be butchered like no other. the problem being we don't have very many students who can actually sing which is a huge problem especially with this show. we have about 3 girls who do the shows (most choir students refuse to be affiliated with our drama director because she's just horrible, myself being the exception) and like 2 guys who can sing, and neither of them would be able to handle the role of valjean.
it's going to be a very stressful show which i don't even know if i'm going to bother auditioning for if it's just going to fall apart within a few weeks and just be a total disaster.

but i do have a question for those of you who have been in a production of LMSE, seen it, directed it, whatever...are the notes different? and if so, by how much? thanks.

[LizzieCurry]

Posted: 9/19/05 at 2:20pm

I wish the notes for Bring Him Home HAD been different for the two barely-not-boy-soprano Valjeans I saw...

[PB ENT.]

Posted: 9/19/05 at 4:41pm

I've been around my share of LMSE projects. As some are aware, I work with Craig Schulman (Bd'w Valjean) We booked about 14 LM workshops/masterclasses over the past 2 years, with more to come. While neither Craig nor I have attended that many of the actual productions, I did see 3 of the local shows ( Cherry Hill East,(NJ) Lenape (NJ) and Cheltenham, (PA). But I attended two additional workshops with Craig.

If I may say, releasing Les Miz like many MTI shows, to high schools is a wonderful opportunity if the school is up for the challange. It has been by far the most excitment for the students and their communities with high schools musical for a long time. The Cheltenham production was exceptionally good. Their sets,costumes and scenery rivaled Broadway. Their kids were truly great.

Now as far as capabilities, casting the female leads is not a problem. Cossett & Fantine are not nearly as vocally demanding as casting a 17 yr. old Valjean & Javert. As was mentioned, these young men have not reached vocal maturity and won't until they are closer to 20+. However, an insightful musical director can lower a few of the notes and take the safe version of BHH. It worked like a charm in 1 production. In defense of our young Valjeans, DJ Weaver, Cherry Hill's Valjean was so impressive, he was invited to be part of the last LM show on BD'w ( as they brought in some of the student casts in the NJ/NY/PA area).

Regarding the Lovely Ladies, it's really not a morality issue. In some productions the girls wore body suits under lacey old dresses and were properly directed to appear more as street urchins than prostitutes. It worked well.

Regarding making changes without permission. This is a major NO-NO. The contract with MTI clearly states that "no changes are to be made without written permission". Duplicating the script is prohibited as it's copyrighted. Don't get caught!

I have witnesed reps. from a major holding companies sit in the front rows of a professional Philly theater during opening night of Sound on Music when they got wind that a few things were changed during rehearsals. You can bet your bottom dollar, if a company professional or not, changes anything, licensed otherwize, it is taken very seriously.

I do not think it is wrong to turn in any theater group when this is proven. Their are rules and rights for reasons.

LMSE is a morally sound production for HS. This issue was raised as soon as it was released. It was quickly acted upon by each school board. If it's not accepted, don't do it.

Sure, there may be many mediorce forms of LMSE out there. But personally, I see this as a great opportunity for a handfull of really talented kids. If directed well, it can be a wonderful experience.

Feel free to contact me if you are interested in a LM workshop for your production.

Pati b
http://www.pbspotlight.com


(edited to link website)

Updated On: 9/19/05 at 04:41 PM

[Candleshoe2]

Posted: 9/19/05 at 6:58pm

This right here shows what a BAD production of LMSE looks like! Watch the video at your own risk: http://www.dubuque.k12.ia.us/Hempstead/LesMis/

[best12bars]

Posted: 9/19/05 at 7:16pm

QOM, I love and agree with everything you said, with a few negligible exceptions...

Why do you think that the roles in Les Mis are any more challenging than, say, "Oklahoma?" Curly & Laurey are both very demanding singing roles, if done well, and by mature voices. So is Jud Fry. Will Parker demands a singer/dancer of high skill. Sure you can (and do) see average schoolers in those roles, but the roles themselves ask a lot of a performer. The dancing can be very difficult, particularly the dream ballet.

You talk about the possible controversy over casting high school seniors as "the ladies," and yet Oklahoma has its saloon prostitutes in the dream ballet. Whores, through and through.

I love that high schools are doing Les Mis now, but I don't believe its as much of a stretch or leap forward as doing a well-mounted production of Oklahoma!

[theatrebabe]

Posted: 9/19/05 at 7:26pm

They're doing it at my community theatre place this summer. I'm auditioning. Are Eponine and Fantine still good parts?

[Pinguin]

Posted: 9/19/05 at 7:30pm

The Eponine and Fantine parts are diluted a bit, but yes, they're still good roles. The only thing I really miss in the school edition is the complete version of A Little Fall of Rain.

Making Les Mis shorter is not a tragic situation.


And I think if done tactfully the show is appropriate for high school students.

[theatrebabe]

Posted: 9/19/05 at 7:46pm

Oh no!!! They cut some of A Little Fall of Rain? Ahhhhh!! I love that song! Ah well. What'ya gonna do?

[poppy isabella]

Posted: 9/19/05 at 7:57pm

I thought the original authors/composers were included in the revision process? This makes a huge difference to me. It sounds like some of what I read in this thread is saying MTI shouldn't have revised it.

[PB ENT.]

Posted: 9/19/05 at 10:35pm

Some of you are misinformed. The list of things cut are growing with this thread. Roughly about 10-15 min. are cut. Nothing to take away from the overall show.

Do you realize that quite a while before it closed, the Broadway production was also cut back about 10-15 min.?

While I'm sure some of the HS productions are less than great, there are many productions that are fairly good. Again those who can't handle LM should not mount it.Unless you've seen more than a few of them, you really can't pass judgment.

To answer the question about difficulty? Roles like Valjean, Phantom, J&H, etc. are gruelling both vocally and physically. Just ask any of the actors who have done them. So, taking a 17 yr. old with very limited experience in both depts. and you are in for a real challange.

[poppy isabella]

Posted: 9/19/05 at 10:44pm

I was MD for a community production of this School Edition. We did it with all ages (ie adults in adult roles, teenagers in younger roles, little Cosette was 7, etc.). We had permission from MTI because it was part of a community academy, an educational environment. Anyway, I thought our show was great! And I'm usually pretty judgemental about the shows I'm involved in. In all the research I did in preparation for rehearsals, the main differences I noticed were, like PB Ent. said, that verses were cut so that it was all around shorter. Pleasantly shorter.

[QOM]

Posted: 9/20/05 at 1:57am

Distinctive Baritone- I am a high school music teacher. I see a lot of high school shows each year to get ideas, to check out possible show choices for my school, and of course, to check out the competition.

Best12Bars- I hear what you are saying and I totally get the importance and value of doing Oklahoma and Music Man..and have done both of these shows with my students. I do feel that Valjean is a tougher part to sing and act than Curly is and I think a sing-through show provides a different kind of challenge than what students are accustomed to. Another point that I wanted to make is that America is (unfortunately) used to seeing mediocre and bad productions of the Broadway classics. How many bad h.s. productions have we seen of Oklahoma, Guys and Dolls, etc? But Les Mis is a different story. This show was just released for high school productions and up until now, we have only seen professional quality productions...not to mention the Broadway version was an unbelievable smash hit. Because people haven't really seen it any other way until now, it is less acceptable to the public to see a crappy version of this particular show. This in and of itself makes it more of a challenge to pull-off. My main goal is to provide my students with a wide variety of experiences. LSME was different than anything we had done before it and I thought that was important to the educational process.

[LizzieCurry]

Posted: 9/20/05 at 2:52am

"Oh no!!! They cut some of A Little Fall of Rain? Ahhhhh!! I love that song! Ah well. What'ya gonna do?"

They also cut the end of Confrontation and some of Stars, yet somehow, put BACK some of the lines that went with the overtime cuts of late 2000/early 2001. Go figure.

[LizzieCurry]

Posted: 9/20/05 at 4:13am

Timely article on high schools and royalties:
The Daily Herald (Everett, Washington)

[QOM]

Posted: 9/20/05 at 11:13am

Thanks for posting that article. It is terribly difficult to find ways to finance a h.s. show, but my personal feeling is that the problem is not with royalty fees but with inadequate school budgets. It really is a lose-lose situation...as an artist/professional, I believe that playwrights/composers deserve sufficient compensation (royalty fees) for their work. Yet, as a teacher/director I have to produce top quality productions with less-than-top-quality budget and a horrible facility in which to perform. Where does one skimp...costumes, sets, sound, lighting???? How can one answer that? Recent shows like LMSE cost a lot more. I wish the fees were more consistent so we know what to expect when we are making our budget requests (a year in advance). In all of the years I have been doing this (and it's a lot), I have only come in under-budget one time on a show. I have broken even several times but I have gone over-budget a bunch of times as well. We have to get creative with fundraising...mostly progam solicitations and underwriting for some things to make ends meet. It takes a village to finance and produce a h.s. show...a very dedicated village!

[LizzieCurry]

Posted: 9/21/05 at 9:46pm

Just curious, what have been your most successful ways to raise funds? I was never in HS drama, but my sister was in band, and I went through many bake sales...