Into the Woods Official Movie Thread — Page 110

But the lyric's of the Witch's Lament, "This is the world I meant, couldn't you listen? Couldn't you stay content, safe behind walls, as I could not?" makes no sense with Rapunzel's new "end"! The world didn't do anything to mess her up, it was the Witch! Unless...the Giant coming and scaring Rapunzel is the world making her upset and bringing about her "end".

Meryl Streep as the ugly Witch really should have a (well done, non-over-the-top, non-fake-looking) scarier, witchier nose and chin because she doesn't just want to be beautiful again. Her other reason was so that Rapunzel would not be turned off by her looks, "ashamed of" her looks as the Witch says.

By the way, I was wondering what everyone thought of this: In the original "Last Midnight" the Witch sings, "You're so nice. You're not good, you're not bad, you're just nice. I'm not good, I'm not nice, I'm just right. I'm the Witch, you're the world. I'm the hitch, I'm what no one believes, I'm the Witch, you're all liars and thieves like his father. Like his son will be, too, oh, why bother, you'll just do what you do." The revivals changed it to the Witch taking the baby singing, "You're so pure. But stay here and in time you'll mature. And grow up to be them, so let's fly, you and I, far away. I'm the hitch, I'm what no one believes, I'm the Witch, they're all liars and thieves like your father, just like you will be, too, oh, why bother, they'll just do as they do."

I really don't like the Witch taking the baby and the little "I'm gonna take him - oh nevermind!" false shock value there, and why would she think he would grow up to be like them in her care if Rapunzel didn't turn out like them in her care? And I really hate how the new lyrics aren't as good as the old ones which have more meaning: the whole "Nice isn't the same as good" message the play has. I do however like the 2002 revival's new lyrics of "I'm leaving you my last curse. I'm leaving you alone, squirming in the mess that you made. Fix it on your own, time for me to go I'm afraid" instead of the original's "you can tend the garden, it's yours", because, why would they ever care to tend her garden? I hope the movie's "Last Midnight" is more like the original one.

So...what do you think?

Updated On: 9/7/14 at 02:13 AM

Thank you jimmycurry01. I was gonna explain the same thing

I'm still holding hope out that Rapunzel will die after all!

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^Which is something that's more tragic and heartbreaking than being killed by the Giant. The dramatic purpose of the "Witch's Lament" is intact, nothing has been lost.

Since the new song has been cut, there might be a chance that the full version of "Lament" could be used.

Updated On: 9/7/14 at 01:28 PM

Oh, I forgot to say the original "Last Midnight" lyrics also expand on the Witch’s character more in that (maybe?) she doesn’t believe there needs to be a good or bad, just a (morally?) correct way to do things, and she chooses that way.

If she doesn't literally mean to tend her garden...what does she actually mean? You mean she doesn't really care about the garden, she's just kidding? Or there's an actual other meaning?

I must admit if Rapunzel is in a terrible marriage with a cheating spouse, then indeed the world has done a horrible thing to her and so "This is the world I meant" does make sense. But I did hear that Rapunzel's Prince doesn't cheat, and Rapunzel chooses to leave him, so it's still the Witch who messed up Rapunzel, not the world.

And her being in a terrible marriage with a cheating spouse doesn't hold the same dramatic weight as death!!! So, no, it still doesn't give the "Witch's Lament" the same power.

Updated On: 9/10/14 at 11:02 PM

MagicalMusical, gardening is usually a metaphor for life. When she says. "You can tend the garden, it's yours. Separate and alone..." It is pretty much the same as saying, "I'm leaving you alone, squirming in the mess that you made." The witch is taking no responsibility for the situation and leaving them to fix their lives by themselves. Essentially, Sondheim chose to dumb down the lyric by removing the metaphor and spelling it out more plainly.

The garden metaphor is a big deal for the witch. Twice in the play we learn that something has happened to it. Once something is stolen from it, and in turn her beauty is stolen from her. Later her garden is crushed by the giant, and in turn her daughter is crushed by the giant. This isn't a coincidence. It is well thought out, and still the metaphor runs a bit deeper for that character and her life, and life in general in the play.

I agree Larcen, it actually plays better if the Witch was WRONG when it comes to Rapunzel, I'm glad that Lapine changed that element of her story. I guess it fits the leaked script by cutting the "This is the world I ment" part of the "Lament" maybe the lyric "Couldn't you stay content?" could still work in the film.

Wait... What audio?

Oh...My....God... Meryl was SO GOOD! I can't wait for her more than ever!

She sounded great. Also, she was singing in the ORIGINAL KEY (that's coming from my totally untrained ears)/ So, I know there was a debate about that, but there it is. I wonder if her other songs are in the original key. If not, it's fine, the low keys still work.

Meryl can hit the higher notes well here is a good example...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pupd_Z7JmpA

Thanks for the explaining guys. I guess "the garden" for that metaphor is the mess everyone made. I still feel Rapunzel's death is the only thing that would hold the same dramatic weight and it doesn't fit the lyrics any other way. "No matter what you do, children refuse...to learn." Learn what? If Rapunzel ran to her death, she didn't learn, but if she runs away to a better life, she did learn! She still has to have a tragic end to "refuse to learn." The Witch still must be right this time.

And what did you mean by "Rapunzel still leaves with the Prince despite the stunts he's pulled." If he doesn't go looking for another girl, what stunts did he pull?

Updated On: 9/10/14 at 07:06 PM