Producers to LOCK OUT the Grinch- Page 2

[silversurfer2]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 4:27pm

I just feel sorry for the kids....

[Marianne]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 4:34pm

Didn't Charlotte St. Martin make some snide comments when Grinch was the first show affected, to the effect that Local One is making little kids cry/the stagehands are the ones who stole Christmas?

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 4:36pm

A Union-free Broadway will not and should not happen.

[JKlock]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 4:37pm

I believe so.

The first weekend of the strike there were plenty of news broadcasts that concluded with the statement "so the Grinch really did steal Christmas" (or something along those lines..)

[mominator]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 4:47pm

Wasn't there a news conference at 4:00?

[leko2]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 5:54pm

1. I've been watching NY1 all day, I have yet to see a press conference from anyone about this. Update: NY1 Just reported that the Grinch is heading to court due to the lockout.

2. There's like 10 other threads that say the same thing and I personally brought up in at least one that local one could be locked out because the hands are striking at other theaters.

3. No one has yet to state what the actual contract between Local One and the Grinch really is. Does it cover all labor or just extra shows?

4. What bugmenot said could be entirely true. The Jujamcyn theater is a building run by an unfavorable employer. According to the IATSE constitution, which is the supreme law when it comes to these things, no member of the Alliance is allowed to work in a place operated by an unfair employer regardless of any contracts entered into by any Local and any manager or syndicate. IE: Even if Local One has a contract directly with the Grinch, the St. James, by virtue of being owned/operated by the Jujamcyns, is on the Unfair List and members are not allowed to work in that building.

5. The actors, musicians, ushers, ticket takers, box office personnel, wardrobe workers, hair dressers, house mangers, stage managers, and stagehands are all working under a union contract and most, if not all, have access to a strike fund somewhere that will pay them. During the run of a show, Pink Contract stagehands, Actors, and Stage Managers are paid by the producer directly.

6. It's going to take more than this to make Broadway union free.

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 6:06pm

This is resembling an adult (use the word loosely) mudfight.

[coolkid11776]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 6:16pm

The Grinch is not the one who is steeling X-mas in this case it's stagehands.
Dear God I hope this doesn't last till X-mas

[Tkt2Ride]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 6:46pm

Again, how is it stagehands when the League locks you out of your workplace?

Just more proof that it is St. Martins publicity campaign that has shut down Broadway.

Also, to get the scorecard right here, I try to use the term League as much as possible since in essences it is the Theatre owners who are trying to make more money from the show. The Producers are being locked out as well.

Thus the lawsuit begins for the Grinch vs. The Jujamcyn. As stated many times before, the Strike is legal because they were working under contract. Even though the stagehands had a separate contract with The Grinch, the strike is against the League who owns the Theatre.

I just wish there were some empty Theatres they could move their shows too. This is why this is happening. The League has the Producers by the neck as well. How very sad.

Taka- I am sorry if you don't think it is sad for Union Members not to band together in times of trouble. I never meant to "bully" anyone but to make them think and compare their situation to that of others who were struggling with their contracts. To ask people to think of others doesn't seem like bullying to me. It seems like trying to be thoughtful and considerate of those whose Union is the glue that holds and empowers other weaker Unions.

The issue here is very broad and much more far reaching than most people care to venture. I just know that from studying the History of Strikes, their losses and gains, the weaker the Union, the less stable the Economy in general. It is just sad how few really understand this and pick up whatever sound bite tossed at them.

From what I have read and understood, this Union works at somewhat below Market to high Market depending on how much tenure and how many hours an individual is capable and willing to work.

I wonder what is wrong with the workers setting the Market Standard based on their skill and education? Since when is acquiring new skills not an education? Skilled workers hold Certificates of Completion just like College Graduates do. Propaganda and competition has tried to pit one against the other when both are really equal. It just baffles the mind sometimes.

[ILoveMyDictionary]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 6:48pm

I feel really bad for the kids who were going to be in it. Can you imagine being all excited to make your Broadway debut and then find out it won't happen?

[Taka]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 6:53pm

Don't get me wrong, I feel it's sad for the unions, too. But some of the supporters of the Union are so *vicious* that not only do they attack the position of naysayers, but the naysayer themself as well. What I'm wondering is why we can't agree to disagree civilly.


I'm sorry if I'm offending you in any way. It's just that when ever I see someone on this board who supports the producers or who thinks that both sides are acting childish, the union supporters gang up on them.

[Taka]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 6:55pm

And I never said that *all* union supporters are guilty, either. On the contrary, the stagehands seem to be the politest of them. The weird part is that those who *aren't* stagehands and support the unions (well, some of them, again, not all of them) tend to be the bullies.

[bk]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 6:56pm

Regardless of Jujamcyn and their decision today, aren't some people forgetting a simple little fact - Local One struck The Grinch - not the theater, but the SHOW. Pardon my cynicism, but then Local One, after all that bad publicity, then turns around and do this about face - knowing exactly what position it puts Jujamcyn in. As someone pointed out on another board, if Local One had a contract with Grinch which was separate and apart from their normal contract, then when they struck they breached it. As this person posits, there could be legal issues if Jujamcyn allowed the show to go on. I'm sure it will all be sorted out in court - IF it goes to court.

[broadwayhoney]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 7:08pm

Just to add to the hearsay.....rumors......endless posts trying to figure this out stuff. Here is another view:

1. Local 1 is striking the League of theatre owners not the producers or the shows. If they were striking the show, it wouldn't make sense.

2. Local 1 did not intend to strike the St. James because they had a special contract with The Grinch Pruducers. However, the head of IATSE demanded that they strike the St. James because Jujamcyn is part of the league. The Grinch is innocent bystander!

3. Throughout all of last week, the head of IATSE was pleaded with to allow the stagehands to return to work on The Grinch.

4. After negotiations broke down, Local 1 head got permission for stagehands to return to work on The Grinch.

5. The theatre owner Jujamcyn elected to lock out the stagehands, which in effect locks out the show. Jujamcyn reasons that he will not allow striking stagehands into his theatre until strike is over.

6. The Grinch Producers will seek an injunction tomorrow to force Jujamcyn to open the doors since he is in breach of contract.

That's my understanding of the situation. For all it's worth!

[bk]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 7:16pm

Regardless of who did what to whom when, both parties would seemingly be in breach of contract.

[bardolator]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 7:20pm

Rotel--I know The Grinch is not in a Nederlander theatre; I was referring to MargoChanning's comment. Basically, I was asking whether this was the same kind of situation as was already affecting the Nederlander shows.

If AEA can't get the strike pay refunded, will this leave their coffers pretty much empty when it's time for Equity to negotiate its new contract next summer?

[Fosse76]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 7:21pm

"6. The Grinch Producers will seek an injunction tomorrow to force Jujamcyn to open the doors since he is in breach of contract."

Wouldn't that apply to the many shows in Nederlander houses as well? None of those shows are being produced by the Nederlanders, so why does the Grinch get an exception? I guess my question is, are the stagehands working for the theatre (i.e., they just come into work when there is a new show if asked) or the producers of the show (in which they essentially are contract employees). If the former I am not sure that Jujamcyn can lose the Grinch suit. If the latter than obviously Jujamcyn cannot win.

[localonecrew]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 7:25pm

"Local One struck The Grinch - not the theater, but the SHOW"

wrong. we struck the league of which jujamcyn is a part. the most militant part it seems.

[Fosse76]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 7:33pm

"wrong. we struck the league of which jujamcyn is a part. the most militant part it seems."

Form what I hear, they are the worst to work for. They must have some Freudian issues there.

[localonecrew]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 7:35pm

paul libin, and the "pizza boy" daniel, are scum

[bk]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 7:35pm

Spin it any way you like - Local One struck and the Grinch could not perform, even though Local One had a completely separate agreement regarding that show. After the bad publicity of that action, suddenly the union does an about face and decides they WILL work the St. James and The Grinch. I'm sure people will draw their own conclusions.

[MargoChanning]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 7:36pm

"Wouldn't that apply to the many shows in Nederlander houses as well? None of those shows are being produced by the Nederlanders, so why does the Grinch get an exception? I guess my question is, are the stagehands working for the theatre (i.e., they just come into work when there is a new show if asked) or the producers of the show (in which they essentially are contract employees). If the former I am not sure that Jujamcyn can lose the Grinch suit. If the latter than obviously Jujamcyn cannot win. "


The difference is that the special contract that the GRINCH negotiated with Equity, Local One and The League this summer in order to play a 12-performance week is still valid and unexpired, while the agreements Local One had with the Nederlanders, Jujamcyn and the Shubers expired back in July (the union initially didn't plan to strike the Nederlander Theaters since they didn't unilaterally decide to impose new work rules on the union, but when the Nederlanders decided to lockout the union in a show of solidarity with the League, the work stoppage still occurred).

The union decided that its lack of agreement with Jujamcyn over the St. James took precedence over the valid agreement with the producers of THE GRINCH (in the St. James) and so they decided picket the theatre -- until yesterday when they decided to take the picket line down, at which point Jujamcyn locked the union out. The producers of the GRINCH are going to court to get an injunction to be allowed into the theater and so it'll be up to a judge to decide whether the valid contract with the producers takes precedence over the expired contract situation with Jujamcyn.

Updated On: 11/19/07 at 07:36 PM

[localonecrew]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 7:38pm

"I'm sure people will draw their own conclusions. "

and we have. you are a league sock puppet. easy conclusion.

[cooperross]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 7:45pm

And you are the typical hot-headed union thug. Easy conclusion.

[Fosse76]

Posted: 11/19/07 at 7:49pm

"The producers of the GRINCH are going to court to get an injunction to be allowed into the theater and so it'll be up to a jugdge to decide whether the valid contract with the producers takes precedence over the expired contract situation with Jujamcyn."

It all boils down to what the contracts (or more appropriately, agreements) say. I would guess that the Agreement between Local 1 and the League would actually take precedence, since ultimately that is who the stagehands are working for, even though their pay is from the show itself. I can't imagine that there isn't a clause in the rental agreement between Jujamcyn and The Grinch regarding work stoppages. I guess we'll find out soon enough.