Question about "Lament" from Into The Woods...

[ljay889]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 2:46am

When was this part of the song cut? Was it cut during previews of the original production?

Now you know what's out there in the world.
No one can prepare you for the world,
Even I.
How could I, who loved you as you were?
How could I have shielded you from her
Or them...

This section is on on the OBCR and the revival recording, it's not on the London recording. Vanessa William's version even has different lyrics for this section, but it seems she did not perform this part of the song live. Why did Sondheim rework the lyrics if it was cut? I am confused.

Can anyone make sense of this? I love this section of the LAMENT, I do not understand cutting it in the first place.






Updated On: 1/13/09 at 02:46 AM

[nobodyhome]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 2:52am

Yes, it was cut during previews of the original Broadway production.

I'll take your word about the revival. I only saw it once and don't remember if that part was in it when I saw it. As for why Sondheim rewrote it only to ultimately cut it (presuming that's what happened), I'd have to guess that they thought it might stay in this time but eventually decided to cut it as they had originally.

[ljay889]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 2:56am

Thanks for the response. Why did they cut it? It's not like cutting would save much time. I think it's a lovely part of the song.

[B3TA07]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 3:10am

Too much vulnerability

[nobodyhome]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 3:42am

To my knowledge, they've never publicly discussed why they cut it. I'd guess it was cut because it's a longish show and the second act was slightly tough going for the audience and they thought they could do without it. Obviously, Sondheim liked it enough to have it included on the recording. I know that some productions have put it back since it's not too difficult to reconstruct it.

Personally, I like it but I don't think the show suffers for it being cut. The part I do think should be in the show (or at least offered as an option) is the cut bit for the Baker's Wife and Cinderella.

I also prefer the version of "No More" that was done at the Old Globe, but that's another story, never mind . . .

[ljay889]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 3:53am

Thanks again for your response.

Are you talking about the cut bit from "A Very Nice Prince" between Cinderella and The Baker's Wife? If so, I adore that part as well.

How did you feel about Sondheim changing LAST MIDNIGHT for the revival? I don't mind the change.

[CATSNYrevival]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 4:57am

I never noticed that the lyrics were revised for "Lament" until just now. I rather like them though it's true that Vanessa didn't sing them live. I've always been a fan of the revised lyrics for "Last Midnight". On CD it seems pointless, but live when you could see her holding the baby, and then giving him up, pulling her hair out, and having her arm start to turn back all old and ugly -- it was frightening. It was a great change.
Updated On: 1/13/09 at 04:57 AM

[BobbyBubby]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 5:00am

Was that section of "A Very Nice Prince" cut in previews? I've always missed it when seeing productions.

[husk_charmer]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 8:55am

Aren't the Lament lyrics in the PBS Broadcast?

Personally, I prefer them, it gives the Witch a little more humanity.

What I'm more curious about is what happened to half of the lyrics in "Our Little World" in the revival?

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 9:50am

Aren't the Lament lyrics in the PBS Broadcast?

Nope.

[nobodyhome]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 11:21am

Yes, I was referring to "A Very Nice Prince," ljay889.

I know that section was in the Old Globe production. I think it was in the show during early Broadway previews but was cut fairly soon.

I don't really care for the changes made to "Last Midnight" in the revival.

Of course, there's always the question of what I would feel if the revival version were the original version and the original version were the revival version. But I can't know that. Anyway, I didn't think that bringing the baby in there was an improvement.

[PiraguaGuy2]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 12:43pm

SPOILERS AHEAD


I didn't like the addition of the baby, but I loved the ending lyric changes:

I'm leaving you alone
Squirming in the mess that you've made
Fix it on your own
Time for me to go, I'm afraid
Back to what I know
Back to long ago
Safe inside the world that I'm from
Better ugly and spurned with my powers returned
And I fear
Midnight's here
Time to disappear
Mother, here I come!

As opposed to:

I'm leaving you alone
You can tend the garden, it's yours
Seperate and alone
Everybody down on all fours
Alright, mother, when?
Lost the beans again
Punish me the way you did then
Give me claws and a hunch
Just away from this bunch
And the doom
And the gloom
And the boom...
CRUNCH!

They really clarified what is a confusing plot point to most people - that the witch doesn't kill herself, instead she returns to the form she was in in Act I, and teleports off to some mysterious place.

Updated On: 1/13/09 at 12:43 PM

[ljay889]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 12:44pm

I have to agree with Cats, Vanesssa pulling her hair out is pretty chilling. Her version is on Youtube.

[PiraguaGuy2]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 1:00pm

The pulling back of the sleeve to reveal the bony arm was pretty crazy too.

Vanessa and Laura Benanti really were the only good things about that revival.

[Brick]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 1:45pm

Agreed. I loved both Williams and Benanti in this. It was the first time I saw Benanti, and I said, "WHo is that?! She's incredible!"

I also liked the post-giant destruction at the end of Act II. I thought Laping did a beautiful job with the tone of loss, fear, and hope. It's true, it did resonate as a post-9/11 sentiment.

[EponineAmneris]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 1:53pm

VERY interesting thread... Enjoying the information.

[husk_charmer]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 2:06pm

Brick-
For those of us who didn't see the revival, what do you mean by the destruction? Just the design itself...or was there more?

[Hex3]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 3:32pm

I think what Brick is referring to is the Giant's first attack during the actII prologue.

And while I did enjoy the revised "Last Midnight" when I first saw it (it was shocking since I didn't know that it was coming) I do prefer the original. And as for the Witch killing herself: My opinion had always been that her mother was dead. So if she was going to her mother then I automatically thought that she was killing herself. And I like that idea much more than her just going to some other random place. And it also makes more sense to me considering all that she had lost including the death of her daughter.

Fun bit of trivia though: During the out of town try outs for the revival the Witch actually turned into a snake at the end of "Last Midnight".

[nobodyhome]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 3:46pm

I've always thought that even though her mother was dead, but still has power even in death.

I don't think the Witch is going to join her in death or she wouldn't be singing "Give me claws and a hunch / Just away from this bunch!" She seems to be making a bargain with her mother: get me out of here, even at the price of making me ugly again. I'd think she'd be more likely to take her chances with the Giant than ask her mother for death.

[eatlasagna]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 3:46pm

i saw the revival out of town tryout several times... and i don't recall her turning into a snake... was that very early on in the run during previews???

[WiCkEDrOcKS]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 3:47pm

I enjoyed the last revival. And I actually prefer Williams' LAST MIDNIGHT to Bernadette's.

Williams was chilling...funny but dark and even frightening at times.

[TimeSquare3]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 3:52pm

I really liked Vanessa.

[BroomstickBoy]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 4:09pm

another bit of trivia :

the revised lyrics of the 'Lament' in the revival, "no one stays untainted by the world, only I, only I who loved you as you were. Only I, who's frightened less of her, than THEM."

were actually in the original production, but changed during previews. Sometime after the 3rd preview, the same show where Bernadette sings 'Boom Crunch' and then right at the end sings a refrain of 'Last Midnight'.

I feel that they could have easily done the revival staging of 'Last Midnight' with the original lyrics. I was in a production of ITW last spring and that's how we did it, and it worked just fine, could have used better direction BUT that's not the point .

[Brick]

Posted: 1/13/09 at 4:39pm

I was referring to the end of Act II. After No One Is Alone, and before everyone comes out and says their lessons learned, the stage was all rubble and shadows. There was a sense of devastation, loss, fear, and yet hope. Lapine lingered this moment more than in the original production. You can even hear it in the begin of the last track on the recording.

And I vastly prefer the revival "Last Midnight". Yes, I've heard of many productions who've had the witch pick up the child since. But I think the new lyrics really clarify the events.

[Hex3]

Posted: 1/14/09 at 12:56am

To Brick:

Oh, okay. Yes I definitely remembered the ending. And, yes, it was very chilling. And to each their own on Last Midnight.

And to eatlasagna:

Yes, as far as I know, she turned into a snake through out the out of town tryouts. Though no one really got what had happened and that's why they changed it. I got this information from Vanessa Williams herself so I'm pretty sure it's accurate. Here's how it happened. She eats the beans and rips her hair and sleeve off. But instead of being all old and gnarly, her arm and head were covered with gold and green shiny scales. Then after she sank into the ground a snake slithered up one of the trees. But what most people saw was just the green and shininess and not that they were scales. Some people actually thought that beanstalks were starting to grow out of her because of the whole eating the beans part. Also since the rest of the stage was pretty dark, not every one noticed the snake going up the tree.