Seesaw...My new favorite musical.- Page 4

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 3/15/16 at 7:23pm

Not many of those do Broadway musicals.

[justme3]

Posted: 3/15/16 at 8:32pm

Mr Roxy said: "If Encores did it, who would do the Tommy Tune part . It would be a bitch to cast.

"

The guy is climbing 4 stairs at a time it's unbelievable

[EricMontreal22]

Posted: 3/15/16 at 9:09pm

Make the stairs small?  

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 3/15/16 at 9:33pm

justme3 said: "GavestonPS said: "I too love Michele Lee's belt and her performance on the OBC recording, but readers shouldn't assume Lainie Kazan was any slouch in the vocal department. I saw Miss Kazan in concert about 10 years ago (she was in her 60s by then) and it was one of the best performances by a vocalist I have ever seen.

Maybe Bennett WAS just bothered by her weight, but who knows? Directors get an odd idea in their heads (see Hal Prince on HELLO, DOLLY! or on Liza Minnelli in CABARET) and nothing can shake it.

 

"

Lainie Kazan was a great singer on Seesaw, but acting-wise she wasn't a "Gittel". Michele lee was just perfect for this role. 

I tried to send you a PM, did you get it?

 

"

Yes, and as you now know, we've exchanged responses. I'm surprised to hear that Lainie Kazan was "wrong' for Gittel. She would have been absolutely right for the part in Gibson's original play, while Michele Lee was entirely too conventionally pretty. (Both ladies can act; we know that much.) What DID the writers and Bennett do to the poor characters and story?

* When I say Kazan was right for Gittel, I am setting aside the issue of whether she looked like a dancer to Michael Bennett.

[EricMontreal22]

Posted: 3/16/16 at 6:08am

Have you read the chapter on Seesaw in the Mandelbaum Bennett bio?  I should re-examine it myself, but I think there was more to the cast change than Bennet wanting someone who looked more like a dancer (though that was one aspect..)

[CarlosAlberto]

Posted: 3/16/16 at 6:23am

I read Mandelbaum's book and from what I can recall (it's currently in storage) is that it was the combination of the weight and Bennett's feelings that Kazan wasn't a dancer.  

 

I agree with Galveston that Kazan absolutely fit the role of Gittel as written by William Gibson in the play "Two for the Seesaw". Gittel is a Jewish Girl from the Bronx, she's kooky and a bit rough around the edges, in other words everything Michele Lee was not perceived to be.   

 

Producer Lawrence Kasha suggested Lee as a replacement for Kazan. He was stage manager for the Original Broadway production of "How to Succeed Without Really Trying" and knew Lee from that production. He went on to cast her in the "Dallas" spin off, "Knots Landing" which he also produced.

Updated On: 3/16/16 at 06:23 AM

[Auggie27]

Posted: 3/16/16 at 8:28pm

We've discussed this show a lot here over the years, but I saw the original, early months (just after Gavin took over) and then the national company in DC.  The revisions to the show were considerable, and the new edition -- which featured a star making performance by Arnaz -- was vastly superior.  The first act closer, "The Party's On Me," pulled the whole act together, in a way "Ride Out the Storm" failed.  ("The Party's On Me" sounded a lot like Liza's "I Want a Natural Man," same 70s arrangement.)

Updated On: 3/16/16 at 08:28 PM

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 3/16/16 at 10:02pm

^^^^^ Perhaps this is a case where Encores should do the revised version rather than restoring the "original".

[justme3]

Posted: 3/17/16 at 4:28am

CarlosAlberto said: "I read Mandelbaum's book and from what I can recall (it's currently in storage) is that it was the combination of the weight and Bennett's feelings that Kazan wasn't a dancer.  

 

I agree with Galveston that Kazan absolutely fit the role of Gittel as written by William Gibson in the play "Two for the Seesaw". Gittel is a Jewish Girl from the Bronx, she's kooky and a bit rough around the edges, in other words everything Michele Lee was not perceived to be.   

 

Producer Lawrence Kasha suggested Lee as a replacement for Kazan. He was stage manager for the Original Broadway production of "How to Succeed Without Really Trying" and knew Lee from that production. He went on to cast her in the "Dallas" spin off, "Knots Landing" which he also produced.

"

Michele Lee was cast to Knots Landing by its creator Michael Filerman. Larry Kasha did serve as a producer on the show but at a later stage. 
I vaguely recall him working with her on one of her earlier productions (Bravo Giovani / Parade / Vintage 60), does this sound familiar or I'm just confusing it with H$S?

 

[justme3]

Posted: 3/17/16 at 4:38am

In the 1973 version Gittel is described as a giver, she loves to give from herself but doesn't know how to take. Jerry teaches her how to take back and love herself
She's also a "loveable lunatic" - a "Schlemiel" with awkard jokes who doesn't always think twice before she says something, yet sweet and loveable
Gittel also descrbies herself as not very smart and sophisticated. She doesn't know what "The Big Apple" means and confuses Nebraska and Nevada.
She is still Jewish from the Bronx

While I didn't see the play itself I listend to recordings of the different versions and think Michele was a much better "Gittel" than both Lainie and Lucie. I can't comment on the actual acting but she sounds a lot natural for this particular role

[CindersGolightly]

Posted: 3/17/16 at 3:29pm

I'm surprised nobody mentioned what a great vehicle this would be for Anna Kendrick's Broadway return. After rewatching her Kennedy Center Honors performance and thinking of this thread, I started to wonder how she'd play Gittel. Maybe that is just me, though.

[CarlosAlberto]

Posted: 3/17/16 at 4:27pm

justme3 said: Michele Lee was cast to Knots Landing by its creator Michael Filerman. Larry Kasha did serve as a producer on the show but at a later stage. 
I vaguely recall him working with her on one of her earlier productions (Bravo Giovani / Parade / Vintage 60), does this sound familiar or I'm just confusing it with H$S?

 

Oh thanks for the correction justme3 and the information regarding the character of "Gittel".

 

I thought I remember Michele Lee saying she got cast in "Knots" because of Kasha but I must have been mis-remembering it. 

 

I believe it was David Jacobs and not Michael Filerman who created "Knots Landing".

 



 

 

 

 

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 3/17/16 at 7:11pm

justme3 said: "In the 1973 version Gittel is described as a giver, she loves to give from herself but doesn't know how to take. Jerry teaches her how to take back and love herself
She's also a "loveable lunatic" - a "Schlemiel" with awkard jokes who doesn't always think twice before she says something, yet sweet and loveable
Gittel also descrbies herself as not very smart and sophisticated. She doesn't know what "The Big Apple" means and confuses Nebraska and Nevada.
She is still Jewish from the Bronx

While I didn't see the play itself I listend to recordings of the different versions and think Michele was a much better "Gittel" than both Lainie and Lucie. I can't comment on the actual acting but she sounds a lot natural for this particular role

 

"

I find your post very odd, because Michele Lee possesses none of the qualities you quite rightly ascribe to Gittel. Although Lee is apparently of Jewish descent, she doesn't read as conventionally "ethnic". And she certainly doesn't normally play schlemiels who can't tell Nevada from Nebraska.

She must have won over the audience by sheer force of her considerable talent. But perhaps she did so at the expense of the character?

[justme3]

Posted: 3/18/16 at 10:04am

CarlosAlberto said: "
Oh thanks for the correction justme3 and the information regarding the character of "Gittel".

I thought I remember Michele Lee saying she got cast in "Knots" because of Kasha but I must have been mis-remembering it. 

I believe it was David Jacobs and not Michael Filerman who created "Knots Landing".

"

You're right about David Jacobs. I knew David Jacobs came up with the initial idea of Knots Landing (before Dallas!), but for some reason I thought both were credited as "creators" 

This is the story behind the Knots casting:

"It was a pleasure too for Michele Lee, who played Karen MacKenzie for 14 years on “Knots Landing.” She told me this morning that Karen was named for Filerman’s sister. The actress and producer met at a dinner party. “Michael called Jack Grossbart, whose house we were at, and said I found my Karen!” Lee recalled."

[justme3]

Posted: 3/18/16 at 10:12am

GavestonPS said: "
I find your post very odd, because Michele Lee possesses none of the qualities you quite rightly ascribe to Gittel. Although Lee is apparently of Jewish descent, she doesn't read as conventionally "ethnic". And she certainly doesn't normally play schlemiels who can't tell Nevada from Nebraska.

She must have won over the audience by sheer force of her considerable talent. But perhaps she did so at the expense of the character?

"

Did you see Michele Lee's pilot show which aired around that time? She was playing a very Gittelish character - this sweet lovable girl that can't get a date. Then when she finally gets one, she wears her dress backwards, gets stuck in the sewing machine, burns the food and finally the guy tells her he can't make it to their date the following day because.... he's getting married that night

But apart from the non-sophisticated part which I don't attribute to her, I think Michele had a lot in common with the character back then. 

[CarlosAlberto]

Posted: 3/18/16 at 11:10am

 

 

I've never heard of the Michele Lee pilot...it sounds like they were going for a Mary Tyler Moore/Marlo Thomas kind of thing just slightly kookier. 

 

I would love to see it out of curiosity, maybe the Paley Center has a copy to view?

 

Since we're talking Michele Lee I have to say that she is resilient. She has really done it all: Broadway stage, films, records and television and yet I feel like she's always been undeservedly underrated. 

 

There's a film she made in 1969 with Dick Van Dyke called "The Comic". It was about the life of a Stan Laurel-ish comedian with a very dark side. She is very, very good in it.

 

 

[PalJoey]

Posted: 3/20/16 at 8:55am

 

Here is Michele Lee singing "Nobody Does It Like Me" at the 28:10 mark:

 

 

[justme3]

Posted: 3/24/16 at 6:20am

Ken Howard died today...

https://www.broadwayworld.com/article/Michele-Lee-on-Ken-Howard-He-Was-Always-There-For-Me-To-Lean-On-20160323?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+feedburner%2FtBhcV+%28BroadwayWorld.com+Featured+Content%29

[justme3]

Posted: 3/24/16 at 6:37am

CarlosAlberto said: "

I've never heard of the Michele Lee pilot...it sounds like they were going for a Mary Tyler Moore/Marlo Thomas kind of thing just slightly kookier. 
I would love to see it out of curiosity, maybe the Paley Center has a copy to view?
Since we're talking Michele Lee I have to say that she is resilient. She has really done it all: Broadway stage, films, records and television and yet I feel like she's always been undeservedly underrated. 

There's a film she made in 1969 with Dick Van Dyke called "The Comic". It was about the life of a Stan Laurel-ish comedian with a very dark side. She is very, very good in it.

"

I love The Comic! 

Yes, there is a copy of the pilot at the Paley center

[justme3]

Posted: 3/24/16 at 6:38am

Here's a short scene from Seeesaw between Michele Lee and Ken Howard

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCxtjaoQTpc

Updated On: 3/24/16 at 06:38 AM

[cliffordbradshaw2]

Posted: 3/24/16 at 9:41am

I saw Ken Howard in "Promises," "1776," "Seesaw," "1600," "Child's Play," and others, and he was always perfect.

For anyone interested, here is Michele Lee recreating her closing aria from "Seesaw" in 2010.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DzKDqSDxWso

[Esther Blodgett]

Posted: 3/24/16 at 10:50am

Odds and Ends:

 

Seesaw was not the only show poor Lainie Kazan was fired from that season. Almost immediately after being replaced in Seesaw, she was cast as Crystal Allen in an all-star revival of The Women (Alexis Smith, Rhonda Fleming, Myrna Loy among many others). During the out-of-town tryout, she and the producers both agreed that she was wrong for the role, and she was replaced by her understudy. Lainie's departure from The Women was a lot more amicable than from Seesaw. The Women came in and did not run very long, maybe a couple of months.

 

Ken Howard, all six foot six and half of him, could dance. One of those songs he has had a long solo dance for him and the audience just ate it up because he looked like the two-left-feet type. He wasn't Fred Astaire but he acquitted himself very well.

 

There is a long article from the Times that was reprinted in editor Steve Suskin's book "Second Act Trouble". It it, Seesaw's difficult gestation is explained in detail although of course, there are parts not completely clarified.

 

Whether Michele Lee was 'right' for Gittel or not is secondary. The audiences loved her and she did just about everything in her power to make this flawed and slapped together show a hit.

 

 

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 3/24/16 at 11:04pm

^^^^ I'm still speaking hypothetically, but, Esther, maybe the show would have seemed less "slapped together" if the leading lady had seemed more suited for the part. (Again, we're talking about intangible qualities here. Nobody, as far as I can tell, questions Michele Lee's talent, skill or work ethic.)

A clash of cultures has long provided the theme for musical theater. ANNIE GET YOUR GUN, OKLAHOMA!, CAROUSEL, SOUTH PACIFIC, DO I HEAR A WALTZ?, all those operettas about princes who marry waitresses, etc.

One woman's low self-esteem seems pretty thin stuff on which to build a large-cast musical production.

***

No, justme, I never saw Lee's sitcom. But I know the film of HOW TO SUCCEED works, in part, because Lee is grounded and sensible in contrast to Robert Morse's flightiness.

[justme3]

Posted: 3/28/16 at 9:58pm

Yes you are right, the play does seem in part like unrelated scenes patched together.
The song "In Tune" is just stuck there and is not really a part of any plot, and I think enough was said about Spanglish. 
I'm not saying it wasn't fun and entertaining but they could have done a better job plot-wise. And in a way with all the changes and all the different people that worked on it the play was indeed 'slapped together'

It's been 4-5 years since I last saw How to Succeed but my impression was that Morse's character was the ambitious lead, and Lee was just brought in as a background character.
The character sure has its strong moments, but also silly / flaky ones (like the elevator scene). I'm curious what the original play was like, especially with songs like "happy to keep his dinner warm", but that would be the subject of a different thread :)