Sondheim and Lady Gaga - Page 2

[Cupid Boy2]

Posted: 3/13/15 at 7:27pm

A travesty? Wouldn't it be enough to just say he didn't care for it?

[EricMontreal22]

Posted: 3/13/15 at 7:49pm

"It's quite ridiculous and unnecessary for him to have made this comment, especially over a month later. What's the point? "

I'm sure he was asked by the reviewer. In the full article it's pretty clear he's not commenting on her talent, just on how disconnected she was from the songs, and her approach tothem and that much of the positive reaction was due to people being "amazed" by her versatility. I think that's all more than fair.

I dunno, I enjoy that he's getting slightly more outspoken. He's still not become the grumpy old man "get off my lawn" cliche that faves of mine, like Gore Vidal became in their twilight years.

As for the younger bf--so was Peter Jones (was that his previous BF?) It's not too uncommon among people who really seem to come to terms with their sexuality in their later years. And it's not like he makes a big point of it--the way some other celebs with much younger partners constantly do--he keeps it mostly, as it should be, as their business. He doesn't hide it but it's never been a bragging point or a big deal the way it has even with some celebs like Stephen Frears (who doesn't exactly make a point of it either.)

[EricMontreal22]

Posted: 3/13/15 at 7:50pm

"Well, we all know Sondheim is called "God" in theater circles - he's just the grumpier, less benevolent God. "

I assume you have not read the Old Testament.

[EricMontreal22]

Posted: 3/13/15 at 7:51pm

"However, he DID like the movie of SWEENEY TODD, and did see THE WIZ six times in the 1970s. But nobody's perfect. "

Let's just clarify that was the STAGE version of The Wiz, which makes it slightly more understandable.

[g.d.e.l.g.i.]

Posted: 3/13/15 at 7:51pm

Re: the dungeon, I cannot tell a lie... no dungeon. But it was Botzo with the Rope and the piano bench. Hehehehe.

[EricMontreal22]

Posted: 3/13/15 at 7:52pm

"
I don't think so. Look at the popularity of 50 Shades of Gray. Some people might actually like that he has a dungeon."

Well he didn't deny having a thing for S&M, at least in the past. Which is pretty common knowledge. The details of the sex dungeon did get beyond ridiculous.

[tazber]

Posted: 3/13/15 at 8:14pm

"I assume you have not read the Old Testament."

Zing!

Updated On: 3/13/15 at 08:14 PM

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 3/13/15 at 10:43pm

But Steeeeeeeve, BWW posters were ready to cast her immediately in ANY MUSICAL AT ALL.

[jv92]

Posted: 3/13/15 at 10:48pm

NOT MY MUSICAL! - Steve Sondheim

[PalJoey]

Posted: 3/13/15 at 11:05pm

Is anyone really surprised he's curmudgeonly? He pretty much admits in every interview and biography that he's been "bitter" since he first realized that his mother hated him--and then subsequently realized that he hated her more than she did him.

But if you read the Gaga quote in context, the putdown is more of people who sing Richard Rodgers as if it were opera. He has always disliked that. He is grudgingly admiring of her versatility--he just disliked her choice of singing style.

As for the dungeon and the S&M, I'm glad he scotched those rumours once and for all. Those who know him know that he's far too self-conscious and neurotic to have the patience for S&M. (Like Woody Allen trying to dress up in leather.) His cruelty is more the mental variety, taking form in game-playing and being smarter than everyone else in the room. But whips and chains?--he would be analyzing everything and finding rhymes for the safe word.

The dungeon stories were made up by the kinds of fans who now write fan-fiction and slash-fiction. Same goes for the stories of chorus boys (and Puerto Rican delivery boys) tied up in the upstairs bedroom. Those stories were made up by chorus boys who WISHED they would be tied up in a composer's bedroom.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 3/13/15 at 11:10pm

I was taken aback by it because I never thought that the rumors about the dungeon were intended to trash him, I think people who have dungeons are sex positive individuals who don't care about what people think. I first heard the rumor back when he was closeted and seemed to be a loner who never made romantic connections with anybody.

I did laugh when he essentially said the live TV musicals were only good for hate watching.

[jv92]

Posted: 3/13/15 at 11:17pm

I've never taken him as bitter, just unfailingly honest. And not honest in that bitchy, jealous Arthur Laurents way. Honest as in, he makes sense. Most of his criticism of artists and their work are not unfounded blabber. They're well thought out, never truly malicious, and at the end of the day, make absolute logical sense.

I never really cared about the S&M rumors-- true, false, it didn't make a difference. Whatever goes on in anyone's bedroom other than my own is none of my business, as long as it isn't involving children. I'm glad that he's shot down those rumors, too, but if he came out and said, "Yes! I love S&M!", I wouldn't have cared. It's a YP, not an MP, to quote BOOGIE NIGHTS.

[Claudia Draper]

Posted: 3/13/15 at 11:56pm

So even more confirmation that Lady GAGA will not be in Streisand'S GYPSY. Jesse mueller hello. Tom wopat for herbie!?!

[darquegk]

Posted: 3/14/15 at 12:04am

The whole Gaga performance was reminiscent to me of Andy Kaufman doing "The Great Gatsby," or how Martin Short used to close his specials with a Noel Coward ballad- when a performance artist turns down the dial for a little while, and hits you with (if not realness) some normalcy, it makes an effect whether or not they do it especially well.

[CarlosAlberto]

Posted: 3/14/15 at 12:32am

Well I'm just gonna put it out there and say I could care two flying fvcks what Stephen Sondheim thinks...

Updated On: 3/14/15 at 12:32 AM

[henrikegerman]

Posted: 3/14/15 at 12:35am

"when a performance artist turns down the dial for a little while, and hits you with (if not realness) some normalcy, it makes an effect whether or not they do it especially well."

Fascinating how different people view this performance.

She didn't strike me as normal at all. And before she has always struck me as committed, genuine and real no matter what style she was working in.

Her Oscar performance struck me as by far the most affected thing I've ever seen her do and utterly lacking in taste.

[After Eight]

Posted: 3/14/15 at 12:41am

More gracious remarks from the ever-gracious Sondheim.

Based upon the charming sentiments in his musicals, whodathunkit?

[EricMontreal22]

Posted: 3/14/15 at 12:44am

Says the king of graciousness, himself.

[South Florida]

Posted: 3/14/15 at 12:44am

AE, Lady Gaga sucked that night.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 3/14/15 at 12:54am

So wait. Mothballs is defending Lady Gaga?

[After Eight]

Posted: 3/14/15 at 1:00am

"I think that's all more than fair."

Ha ha ha. Says the world's most impartial judge of all things Sondheim.

"I dunno, I enjoy that he's getting slightly more outspoken."

I dunno either.

Except I do know. Only too well, unfortunately.

Oh, and one last thing. Try to avoid using words such as "faves." It's embarrassing in someone your age.

[jv92]

Posted: 3/14/15 at 10:21am

Well, look what the cat dragged in!

[PalJoey]

Posted: 3/14/15 at 10:51am

Oh, I don't think Sondheim himself was using "dungeon" in a pejorative sense. He was remarking (accurately) on people in the 1970s to 1990s (when the rumours first circulated) who used it as one of many ways to belittle or diminish him.

He means that the dungeon rumor was the equivalent back then of gossips who like to diminish people but saying "Oh, he's a drunk" or "Oh, she's a pothead" or "Oh, such a bottom" or even "Oh, what a fag," which Sondheim himself, of course, infamously used as a lyric. That's what people did back then (and still do, sorry to say), but I don't think Sondheim's statement itself was intended leatherphobically.

I've never taken his reaction to the dungeon rumor to be anti-leather or even sex negative, just creeped out that people were having such specific imaginings of his sex life and then assuming the rumors to be true.

I mean, there was even a Sondheim Sex Dungeon joke on 30 Rock. That has to be weird for the guy, no? I mean, even Tina Fey thinks he has a dungeon...

Updated On: 3/14/15 at 10:51 AM

[jayinchelsea]

Posted: 3/14/15 at 11:01am

Does anyone on this board remember that Oscar Hammerstein, who wrote the lyrics to TSOM, basically raised Steve and was a godfather to him? Of course he would have an opinion about Gaga's attempt to sing these songs, and imo, he's totally right. Her voice was adequate, but she had no sense of what she was singing, and we kept waiting for her to break into some kind of joke. Never happened...

[AddisonMizner]

Posted: 3/14/15 at 11:24am

Would anyone who has access to The Times be able to copy and paste the article in its entirety on here? I would love to read it.