Jeff Loeffelholz suicide news coverage- Page 10

[JSquared2]

Posted: 7/20/18 at 1:29pm

Wayman_Wong said: 


Speaking of the N.Y. Times, why has it been so conspicuously absent in reporting this story? The Times website ran a short about the probe a few days ago, but it was by the Associated Press."

 

Perhaps because there's no "story" to report on yet because the facts are not all in?  One would think that as a former "reporter" (as you never fail to remind us, Wayman), you would understand that!  Kudos to you though, for trying to turn this tragic event into your new "cause celebre" (and only 30 years after the Miss Saigon/Jonathan Pryce "scandal" rocked the world)!.

[Kad]

Posted: 7/20/18 at 1:31pm

You know, JSquared, there isn't a competition on here to see who can be the most consistently and needlessly bitchy.

[newintown]

Posted: 7/20/18 at 1:37pm

"You know, JSquared, there isn't a competition on here to see who can be the most consistently and needlessly bitchy."

Oh? I thought all this time that was the reason there was so much of it...

[MosaicOwl]

Posted: 7/20/18 at 1:51pm

Wayman_Wong said: "Speaking of the N.Y. Times, why has it been so conspicuously absent in reporting this story? The Times website ran a short about the probe a few days ago, but it was by the Associated Press."

The Times is currently working on a piece.

 

[Wayman_Wong]

Posted: 7/20/18 at 3:06pm

MosaicOwl, thanks for the update. And my sympathies for your loss. 

[adamgreer]

Posted: 7/20/18 at 3:31pm

HogansHero said: "adamgreer said: "Did the Weisslers pay Riedel to right [sic] that piece? I mean, Jesus. He really tries to shift the blame right on to the victim. Pathetic."

Anything is possible but as I said above I think it was set up by one of Bobbie's people (or himself). The Weisslers don't have a lot of reason to take Bobbie's side-one could argue rehabilitating Stiffleman would be more in their interest.

@Wayman, are you suggesting Riedel has ever recused himself from writing about anyone because they were his "buddies"? LOL. Seriously?"

I was actually mostly kidding, but now that I’ve more posts in the thread it doesn’t seem entirely out of the realm of possibility that Riedel would write a story defending his good friends the Weisslers. 

[HogansHero]

Posted: 7/20/18 at 6:18pm

That's possible though the story to me seems much more in defense of Bobbie. Anyway, we will never know. or

[BKLYN8567]

Posted: 7/20/18 at 6:46pm

Is this Reidel guy a known hack/bad reporter?

Far from an expert in the theater world, but caught wind of the news when it first started getting traction and have been following it ever since, which led me to this board.

Just kind of surprised at the response to the article, since its the first one to mention "sources" that somewhat contradicts some (not all) of the accounts from Jeff's notes. The "other" side has been very quiet through all this, so it doesn't make sense to me why someone from that "camp" would need to get this story out when there's already two investigations going (by Chicago and by Equity). That side will never win in the court of the public opinion, so I don't see a reason for a fluff piece if this is what it is. 

I only ask this because, (and I apologize to friends and family of Jeff, as it appears they do post and contribute to this thread), because while I understand how difficult this has been for them, let's assume (which is really all we can do at this point until a full investigation is complete and those present at the rehearsal are revealed with their own accounts, and maybe even discovery of text/email communications to see if there was wink wink stuff happening) that the accounts from this Reidel sources are legit, and the main thing that Bobbie did was his comment about money and how long Jeff has been with Chicago (which would be bad and inappropriate, but far from what most would consider harassing and bullying, I would think), isn't the damage to his reputation already done?

And I get that reputation means so little compared to losing one's life, but there's really been four or five accounts that's come out publicly so far: Jeff's notes, Dusold, Nicklaus, an unnamed theater employee that was there, and Reidel's "sources".

Dusold had no comments on Bobbie, only his own personal experience with Leslie and a friend's corroboration that Leslie had issues with Jeff.

Nicklaus too further added fuel to the fire for how bad Leslie treats the cast, with her own stories. In what was a somewhat lengthy blog post, almost a "throwaway" comment was that all of her experiences with Bobbie had been positive.

Even the unnamed theater employee who said that Bobbie dragged Jeff through the mud also added that they'd never seen Bobbie personally attack anyone, in what was again, another throwaway line.

Again, I apologize to Jeff's friends and family if some of this might come off insensitive, but I think in an effort to get some answers to what happened to Jeff, its quite possible that Bobbie's also being dragged into this when it appears Leslie is the one (if we are to believe the rumblings backstage since its happened) that's been and was the problem.

What's happened is absolutely tragic, but not sure two wrongs make a right in this particular case.

[mrkeatingsir]

Posted: 7/22/18 at 6:35am

Watching the Dangerous Duets videos on youtube from the mid-90s, it is very clear that Loeffelholz was more than capable of carrying the demands of Mary Sunshine.  But the coloratura/soprano are voice types that time is not kind to and twenty two years later I suspect that Loeffelholz's voice fell prey to the passage of type with a shrunken range, unstable vocal line, patchiness and an inability to negotiate downward intervals (bottoming out).   No one suspected when Loeffelholz signed a run of the play contract that Chicago would run twenty odd years.   Opera singers who cancel high fee performances do so in most cases because they were booked two or three years in advance and the singer realizes the voice changes would make singing the role difficult, thus it becomes a matter of cancelling rather than risk public humiliation.  Sills was wise to this and retired just before her decline would have been noticable.   Bobbie's frustration and alleged comments might well have stemmed from the thought that Loeffelholz is not the singer he was and should bow out gracefully.  The fly in the oil was, of course, the run of the play contract, and Loeffelholz was in his purview not to resign or take a buy out.  Fine.  But what also could be at play here is the realization that he could no longer do what he could and the grief that accompanies this loss:  Julie Andrews and Teresa Stratas were both hospitalized for depression after losing their ability to sign (albeit it through surgical error) and Gwen Verdon had spoken many times about a dancer dying two deaths and the psychological trauma that brings.  Bobbie's alleged comments may have exacerbated this sense of loss that Loeffelholz may already have been experiencing.  A tragedy all around.

[yankeefan7]

Posted: 7/22/18 at 7:53pm

"You would think so...but I've certainly never met one that wasn't a frugal arsehole and totally devoid of all empathy or conscience."

That is so sad and this incident is just horrible. Too bad they did not have common decency and talk to him about his contract. Why not bring him in and say they don't think he can handle the role anymore and discuss a decent buyout deal. There was no need to be so cruel. My goodness, the NY Yankees bought out A-Rod a couple of years ago for over 20 million dollars and I am sure this could have been settled for relatively "peanuts".

[nyclover2]

Posted: 7/22/18 at 8:01pm

Poor Man. We need to stop bringing this up and show him some dignity.

Can the mods close this thread

[Miles2Go2]

Posted: 7/22/18 at 8:56pm

The OP who created this thread is Jeff’s relative. I think we honor him by discussing him and demanding that the circumstances of how he was treated in his workplace right before his death be explored.

[DAME]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 1:27pm

Last night one of my co workers mentioned that ABC news is doing a investigative piece on this.  I would imagine for 20/20 since that program usually tackles things like this.  I am just curious if the original OP is aware of this?  I have also heard from someone that had Leslie  as a teacher and described her teaching approach as stressful.  I hope whatever really happened is a moment where we can all reflect on how to treat each other. 

[adamgreer]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 1:29pm

Just posted this in the other thread, but I guess I’ll post it here, too.

The NY Times has a piece about the suicide today. Not much new information except for the fact that Stifelman hasn’t been at the show since Loeffholz’s passing.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/28/theater/chicago-musical-actor-suicide-broadway.html 

Updated On: 7/28/18 at 01:29 PM

[CurtainPullDowner]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 1:53pm

adamgreer said: 

The NY Times has a piece about the suicide today. Not much new information except for the fact that Stifelman hasn’t been at the show since Loeffholz’s passing.

 

The cast must be happy about this.

Can her firing be far behind?
 

 

[adamgreer]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 2:04pm

CurtainPullDowner said: "adamgreer said:

The NY Times has a piece about the suicide today. Not much new information except for the fact that Stifelman hasn’t been at the show since Loeffholz’s passing.

It 

The cast must be happy about this.

Can her firing be far behind?


"

It certainly seems like it’s heading that way. Like Riedel said, someone has to be the “sacrificial lamb” and they can’t fire Bobbie, so...

[poisonivy2]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 2:05pm

I'm stunned they werent willing to buy out his contract if the cost was really 30k. That just doesn't seem like a lot of money at all. 

[Miles2Go2]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 2:15pm

Thanks for sharing this thoughtful, balanced, well-researched article. It left me sad, and curious if real change will happen in the backstage environment of the theater community. The tributes from his fellow artists at the theatre speaks volumes to how much Jeff was loved and also their hopes for change. “Love.” “Kindness.” “Support.” “Respect.” Wouldn’t it be nice if we could consistently abide by these tenets on the threads of this forum as well?

[adamgreer]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 2:28pm

poisonivy2 said: "I'm stunned they werent willing to buy out his contract if the cost was really 30k. That just doesn't seem like a lot of money at all."

It was mentioned pages ago in this thread, but Barry Weissler relishes his reputation as a cheapskate. He once went to arbitration over $35. 

[Miles2Go2]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 2:35pm

poisonivy2 said: "I'm stunned they werent willing to buy out his contract if the cost was really 30k. That just doesn't seem like a lot of money at all."

I agree $30,000+ doesn’t seem like much given how long the show has been running and how long ago it recouped, but from the article: “He could be bought out — a step that would have cost the budget-minded production, which has used tight cost controls to continue running for 22 years, about $30,000 to $40,000, according to his friends.” 

[HogansHero]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 2:51pm

adamgreer said: "The NY Times has a piece about the suicide today. Not much new information except for the fact that Stifelman hasn’t been at the show since Loeffholz’s passing."
 

That's a pretty big piece of news to me...
 

[binau]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 3:13pm

The detail that his father also committed suicide seems relevant.....this is a complex situation.

[Tag]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 3:20pm

^And the whole chocolate shop/lawsuit situation...

[Miles2Go2]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 3:33pm

Suicide almost always has complex bio/psycho/socio- eitiologies. Just because it wasn’t his only stressor, doesn’t invalidate the part his possible workplace may have played in his death.

[poisonivy2]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 3:42pm

Miles2Go2 said: "Suicide almost always has complex bio/psycho/socio- eitiologies. Just because it wasn’t his only stressor, doesn’t invalidate the part his possible workplace may have played in his death."

It also doesn't justify the unprofessional behavior exhibited by Ms. Stifelman and Mr. Bobbie. There are professional ways to deal with a performer who just isn't right for the part anymore.