A theory on the supposed robbery of Raul- Page 2

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 3:28pm

Generally agreed upon by whom? I haven't heard that theory. Why wouldn't the voters have seen it? It ran right up to the Tonys, so everyone has had plenty of time, even the out-of-towners.

[BDavis0092]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 3:29pm

Jonny Boy, that was one of the most ignorant and moronic statements I have ever heard in my life. Raul Esparza would not be where he is right now if "He sucks". How many Broadway and Off-Broadway projects have you been in? Please do not say that Raul Esparza sucks. You may not like him personally, that does not give you the right to say that he sucks.

[Borstalboy]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 3:35pm

Sad but true: Most Tony voters don't see the shows they vote for...hell, many of them don't even live in New York.
David Hyde Pierce is a name. Raul who? Same reason SPRING AWAKENING won, there were umpteen zillion articles about that and COAST OF UTOPIA in the press. People heard of it, they vote, they forget about it.

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 3:36pm

Most Tony voters see as many shows as they possibly can. And that is the truth. They take it seriously, for the most part. There are the ones who don't care, but they are thankfully the small minority.

I can't imagine COMPANY wasn't one of the main shows on everyone's list. At least as many had the chance to see that as LITTLE DOG LAUGHED.

[raphael06]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 3:41pm

Good blog FreeAdmission!

[popular_elphie]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 3:46pm

Many Tony voters, however, only want to go to shows that THEY'D seem interested in. Because PIRATE QUEEN got scathing reviews, they didn't see it, and therefore, didn't nominate it for anything so they wouldn't have to, although it deserved a costumes nomination.

I mean, SPRING AWAKENING got a costumes nomination. What - for some raggedy dresses and a couple school boy pant suits? There are more intricate, and certainly better costumes on Broadway.

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 3:47pm

Most Tony voters are interested in most shows. They're in the business. That's why they're voters in the first place.

[ljay889]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 3:48pm

They're in the business.

- Tell them, Carmen Bernstein.

[munkustrap178]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 3:57pm

popular elphie, you don't even know what you're talking about.

The Tony voters don't choose the nominees. Every year, there is a board of 25 or so Tony Nominators that see EVERY SINGLE show on Broadway, and then vote on the nominees in May. They didn't think THE PIRATE QUEEN was worthy - they didn't NOT NOMINATE the show so the Tony voters wouldn't have to see it.

Please.

People on here need to stop making excuses for why their shows aren't succeeding.

[Wanna Be A Foster]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 3:59pm

Many Tony voters, however, only want to go to shows that THEY'D seem interested in. Because PIRATE QUEEN got scathing reviews, they didn't see it, and therefore, didn't nominate it for anything so they wouldn't have to, although it deserved a costumes nomination.

So much is wrong with that post. First off, the Tony voters don't pick the nominees. The nominating committee picks the nominees. The nominating committee is a group of 25 New York theatre professionals. There are 750 Tony voters. Second, even if the Tony voters did choose the nominees as you stated, you're saying that they didn't nominate PIRATE QUEEN because they wouldn't have to see it? Huh? How exactly would that work?

[munkustrap178]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 4:00pm

If Foster didn't have me blocked, he wouldn't have said EXACTLY what I just did.

Someone should tell him that

[ljay889]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 4:02pm

If Foster didn't have me blocked, he wouldn't have said EXACTLY what I just did.

Someone should tell him that

- Munk.

--------------------

I think it's frickin funny he posted the same thing, lol. You two are more alike then you would like to believe.

[Rathnait62]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 4:02pm

re: A theory on the supposed robbery of Raul
munkustrap178



Broadway Legend
joined: 5/18/04 re: A theory on the supposed robbery of Raul
Posted On: 6/13/07 at 04:00:46 PM



If Foster didn't have me blocked, he wouldn't have said EXACTLY what I just did.

Someone should tell him that.

[ben4]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 4:19pm

My personal theory...


There was a competition...

And Heeee LOOOOSSSST!

[WOSQ]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 4:21pm

Everyone who knows anything simply KNOWS that there was a conspiracy to deny Raul Esparza a Tony Award.

The producers of Curtains were seen handing out fifty dollar bills to every Tony voter they could get near. The bills were in a spiffy little envelope with the show logo in gilt.

Poor Michael Cerveris was in a show produced by a non-profit and there is nowhere in Manhattan Theatre Club's budget for "Tony Award Graft".

Company had lost its producers so much moola that they could only afford twenty dollar bills to the voters and there you have it. A difference of thirty bucks!

This is where the phrase 'thirty pieces of silver' really comes from.

[C is for Company]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 4:34pm

Unfortunately the night of the Tonys was before July 15th, a perilous time for Pices. Had it been when Venus was in Capricorn, he'd avoid a catalogue of crises. Or more specifically, this robbery that apparently took place when I recall nothing being stolen from him.

[TheatreDiva90016]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 4:41pm

I'm, like, totally blaming it on the dude on the grassy knoll.


It's all his fault.

[Tkt2Ride]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 4:45pm

Interesting, still most will take a bribe and then do what they want. It could very well have been that they counted on Raul continuing onwards with great performances in the future while Hyde will find himself more on the big screen.

I totally accept that some people can't put their likes and dislikes of a person aside when voting. They may have found Curtains just more to their taste because it isn't revised so much?

I disagree with the theory though. It is just more of a hypothesis to me. Theory should be based on fact. I can't think of how many times I watched Judy Garland or Sammy Davis Jr. perform certain songs with true gusto. Ah, Judy singing, "Bring in the Clowns", priceless. Songs that are painful, should come from the gut. If the performance is good, the performer goes to their gut, to pull out those emotions that hurt and bring us pain. If you look comfortable or relaxed singing a song like that, then I would think you just aren't feeling the part.

Man of La Mancha's "Impossible Dream" is a good example. I have seen it performed so many times but very few times, did I believe the person singing it was really relating to it's greatness.

Bono, of U2 fame is one example that comes quickly to mind. Watching him perform, "New Years Day" or "Sunday, Bloody Sunday" gives me chills. He puts so much into his songs when he performs. Some can call it acting, some can just call it "being" in character but I like it. It's from the heart.

[gustof777]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 4:45pm

as sad as it is I'm gonna have to agree with Munk. He does have a really bad reputation and I wouldn't be suprised at all to find out that, that's what killed his chances. Sad. I don't know why I didn't even think of that before.

[Tom148502]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 4:46pm

"I couldn’t help noticing how much effort it seemed to take him to sing it. It took me awhile to realize why that bugged me."

Exactly. I felt the same way. I don't want to watch a performer formulating his technique.

I just don't think the role is of Tony caliber. I've never felt that way and I've seen Jones, Kert and a slew of others.

On the other hand, Pierce made his performance seem effortless and natural. A well-deserved win in an otherwise predictable season.

When they start giving Tonys for being cute on stage and nice at the stage door, Esparza might stand a chance

[JRybka]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 4:52pm

I have to say that Raul is one of those artists you either love or hate. Literally 1/2 the people I talked to about Raul love his voice and the other 1/2 HATE it. I am sure that the Tony voters probably feel the same. Plus it is David's show at Curtains and maybe they felt that was the best thing to honor for the show.

[gustof777]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 4:56pm

Tom- you probably will disagree but I thought that the best part of Esparza's performance was that it was Bobby like you've never seen. His was disturbingly human and while maybe didn't come across the best at the Tony's his Being Alive in the theater was one of the most amazing songs I've seen. Definilty of Tony Award Caliber.

[ruthiefan_felix]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 5:00pm

I was havin an argument with a friend who's a Raul supporter.

I personally think that anyone on the list was as worthy to win the Tony as David or Raul. But this is not a perfect world right? It's a competition? As Ellen said in the Oscars, only one of them is gona win and the rest is gona lose.
Im not even sure why we're arguing this... when the board gives it to the ones we like, we go 'YEAH! the Tonys are great!' But when they don't, we go, 'oh the Tonys suck, he suck, they suck, everything suck about the person winning, they shudve given it to the one I love! It's not fair!'
I think as a performer, they should work as hard as they can and not what awards they will get out of it! Awards or not awards, they should still be grateful to be nominated (which I am sure all of them do!) Cuz that's what I call a professional performer and with or without awards, I'll respect them!

God.. Im talking as if Raul actually was mad that he didn't get the award! haha!

[LaCageAuxFollesFan2]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 5:13pm

Some of these arguments are completely crazy, for the mere fact that if some of you are comparing actual performances, if Raul Esparza were to loose, it was Michael Cerveris who gave a heartfelt, neuanced, tony worthy performance and not David Hyde Pierce. Some of those earlier arguments on this thread are just nuts.

[freeadmission]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 11:00pm

Tkt2Ride - There's a difference between "from the gut" in character and "oh ****, this is a big note so I'm gonna take a big breath" and everyone sees it. I think Raul (though not to the same hyperbolic extent) was doing the latter. I'm not saying everyone should always looked comfortable and relaxed when they're singing, but that it doesn't look like the singing itself is the difficult part.

And as for the hypothesis/theory thing . . . please. My title may not fit the scientific definition of "theory", but it fits the colloquial one.

(And isn't it "Send in the Clowns"? Or are we thinking of entirely different songs?)

ruthiefan - We're not arguing; we're (as Tkt would have it) hypothesizing.