First Prerecorded Vocals- Page 2

[philly03]

Posted: 10/11/08 at 6:01pm

^^
"There were a few lines in Jekyll & HYDE that were pre-recorded from the Original Cast to use later. The wedding hymn at the end was recorded with Linda Eder, and is sometimes miscredited as Luba Mason or Coleen Sexton, although neither could hit the notes perfectly or sound the way that Frank wanted that short segment to sound. Some of hte "back-up" vocals (like at the end of the Alive Reprise) were prerecorded as well."

[dayao]

Posted: 10/11/08 at 6:09pm

The practice of dubbing and/or pre-recording on stage goes much further back than one would think:
The famous Irish tenor Chauncey Olcott began his performing career in the late 1890’s singing behind a scrim dubbing his predecessor, William Scanlon, a once great singer well past his prime who was unable to sing at a St. Patrick’s Day concert but did not want to disappoint the audience. Scanlon later returned the favour by publically proclaiming Olcott to be his logical successor and Olcott would go on to become the greatest Irish tenor at the beginning of the 20th Century.

As frontrowcentre2 pointed out, there are instances in a live show where dubbing is part of a gag or plot point, in which it is necessary to either dub the actor on stage with a pre-recording or live with an off stage singer.

The 1970’s musical, SOMETHING’S AFOOT, which was a spoof of the Agatha Christie Miss Marple murder mysteries, required a barrage of pre-recorded sound effects but also at the end called for a full chorus to sing the last line of the finale. Since by this time most of the cast had been dispatched and there were no choral numbers in the show, in the production on which I worked, we pre-recorded the entire cast singing this line, which was then doubled and tripled by the sound technician and was played to augment the members of the remaining cast on stage singing live. So in this case it was a combination of live and Memorex because it would have been ridiculously expensive to hire a full chorus to sing one line in the finale of the show.

In the non-musical comedy, LEND ME A TENOR, the plot calls for the character of Max to sing along with a pre-recording of the tenor he is replacing. Usually both Max and the tenor are pre-recorded. In the Southern California production I attended, James Anest, a real operatic baritone, played Max. Because of his fantastic vocal range which extends into tenor territory, Anest sang live on stage as Max with a pre-recording of his own voice as the tenor Max is replacing, sung just differently enough to give the illusion of two different singers.

As far as that soprano note in Phantom is concerned, even an average genuine operatic soprano could manage it while doing her nails at the same time; so could Musical Theater sopranos like Julie Andrews, Marguerite Piazza, Carol Lawrence, Florence Henderson and Ann Blyth. The fact that it had to be pre-recorded only manages to reveal the sad fact that we have so few singers of this caliber being employed in Musical Theater today. And yes, if the singer can hit the note live, she should and if she can’t, she should not be in the show.

[CATSNYrevival]

Posted: 10/11/08 at 6:33pm

Thanks, philly. I was actually commenting on that the first time you posted it. About how much I liked it... ?

[philly03]

Posted: 10/11/08 at 6:40pm

No, no! I was just trying to imply that the majority of posters on here just repeat what's already been said, and don't read what anyone else posts. No saying that's the case with you though!

[nobodyhome]

Posted: 10/11/08 at 8:03pm

To clarify a bit about Follies: The end of "Who's That Woman?" was pre-recorded because all of these women of a certain age in their forties and older had been dancing for four minutes or so and they were too winded to really sing out at the point when the number needed to climax.

[bertandrew2]

Posted: 10/11/08 at 8:15pm

Yes I remember the nytimes article about liza in The Act.....and isnt part of ONE in A Chorus Line recorded?

[metropolis10111]

Posted: 10/11/08 at 8:18pm

"LW seems determiend to destroy every bit of live theatre magic and replace it with "canned" product."

But its nice to know Sondheim did it first so does that me HE wants to destroy every bit of live theater or do we hold different standards for different people?

[LePetiteFromage]

Posted: 10/11/08 at 8:30pm

Updated On: 5/1/09 at 08:30 PM

[best12bars]

Posted: 10/11/08 at 9:43pm

dayao---Thanks so much for your post. It was wonderfully informative, and I LOVE that you know all about Olcott and Scanlon. Very cool! (I'm sure you've seen "My Wild Irish Rose" too.)

I will say one thing about "Phantom" however. It's not that the note itself is so very high that Christine has to pre-record it. You're right, the note itself is high, but it's attainable by any "really good" soprano of the day.

But in that particular song where she answers his "sing for me" call... she has to sing very high for almost a full minute. The notes in that section never go below her highest upper register. And as any singer will be quick to point out, that's the fastest way to blow out your pipes. I could easily imagine her hitting a few good high notes in an aria. But this is a prolonged concentrated section, where the singer is never given a chance to "come down to earth."

I completely understand why this section is prerecorded.

And the other reason why the earlier part of the song is prerecorded has to do with the use of body doubles on stage. They are all working off of a pre-recorded track to create the illusion that the Phantom and Christine are suddenly appearing in different sections of the theatre (and the set) seamlessly. It's pretty impressive when you first see it, and it's done purely for that illusion.

[TheatreFreak05]

Posted: 10/11/08 at 9:44pm

A lot of dinner theaters have canned music anyway, so many times they will "sweeten" the music by recording all of the ensemble parts.

[frontrowcentre2]

Posted: 10/11/08 at 10:00pm

But its nice to know Sondheim did it first so does that mean HE wants to destroy every bit of live theater or do we hold different standards for different people?

Well start by comparing apples to apples. Sondheim did not produce or direct FOLLIES. In the end it was Michael Bennett, not Sondheim, who opted to pre-record the ending of "Who's That Woman." It had nothing to do with Sondheim.

Andrew Lloyd Webber through his Really Useful Group produces most of his shows. He calls the shots. If any element is not fully up to standard he alone is responsible. So why would a composer create a score where the big money note is impossible to sing and must be pre-recorded? Why would man who insists on the latest technological advances on stage refuse to allow his recordings to be done digitally? Why does he let the spectacle drive the show instead of the story and characters? Why can't he find a decent lyricist? The mere fact that he feels it necessary to pre-record a few lines here and there is just the tip of a very dark iceberg. You want more examples?

In 1991 he produced a revival of JOSPEH that yielded a London cast recording. When the show opened in the U.S. a new cast album was made but recycling the exact same orchestral tracks. Same with the Canadian cast album. Individually each one sold more than enough copies to have justified using the full orchestra. The insistence on using the same orchestral track meant that absolutely no changes could be made to the recorded content.

Yes, I have my biases. I much prefer a piece of theatre that does not feel like a pre-manufactured brick. Too many of the new shows smack of that “product” feel. Broadway has always had them, but usually they were either flops or also-rans. Now they are not only hits but also smashes that run decades. People point to their box-office as an indication of quality. No. It is an indication of popularity, and that’s all.

[sondheimgeek]

Posted: 10/11/08 at 10:39pm

I completely agree Frontrowcentre.

And as for Christines note, a pre-recorded track is useful, helpful, and often times needed, but musical theatre wasn't created to use pre-recorded tracks. If it makes it sound better and helps to preserve a voice by all means do it, but it's just a shame that pre-recorded tracks are the only option.

And the attack against Frontrowcentre was completely uncalled for and rude. I'm sure the poster just wants to rile a few people up, but Frontrowcentre is one of the most knowledgable and kind posters on this board. I always learn something new from his posts.

[Mattbrain]

Posted: 10/11/08 at 10:44pm

The French musical spectacles use not only prerecorded vocals for the chorus but prerecorded music. The ensemble only dances and lipsynchs.

[Princeton78]

Posted: 10/11/08 at 10:53pm

The big note in the opening/title number of the original production of "Company" was prerecorded. I'm not referring to the Roundabout revival in '95 or the Doyle revival (which shortened the note dramatically). In the original production the second go around of "We loooooooove," which was held for roughly 40 seconds was definitely prerecorded.

[Neverandy]

Posted: 10/12/08 at 12:47am

Frontrow-I agree with you. Although I believe that some of what you say about Joseph is incorrect. I believe that Donny Osmond's version of "Close Every Door" is orchestrated differently and is also in a different key than the Michael Damien and Jason Donovan versions.

[misto625]

Posted: 10/12/08 at 2:06am

I believe that in the original production of "Bye Bye Birdie," the beginning of "Telephone Hour" was prerecorded. Many recent Broadway shows have used prerecorded vocals when the ensemble has to sing directly after a difficult dance section.

[Paul W. Thompson]

Posted: 10/12/08 at 3:12am

Wow, "Bye, Bye, Birdie." Really? That early? The previous earliest instance mentioned is one note by Barbara Harris in "The Apple Tree." Assuming that "Sweet Charity" is just a rumor, not fact.

[TheatreFreak05]

Posted: 10/12/08 at 4:31pm

What parts of Cats were prerecorded?

[Jon]

Posted: 10/12/08 at 4:40pm

I don't know about pre-recording in CATS, but the Broadway production had a "Cats Chorus" - a group of singers situated backstage with the orchestra to "augment" the ensemble numbers, since the onstage Cats were often too exhausted from dancing to sing with any power.

[Pianist3912]

Posted: 10/12/08 at 5:04pm

Just to clarify the Phantom example, the whole song is prerecorded. The first two verses are prerecorded because while the doubles are on the "travelator" onstage doing the disappear-appear effect, the real Phantom and Christine are being harnessed into/preparing for the boat. The final part of the song is prerecorded like someone else said, because of the intensity of the notes in that "cadenza:" it can be pretty hard to sing that last minute or so. I'm assuming the 3rd verse, or everything else between those two sections is pre-recorded just to keep it uniform, and not have the orchestra panicking over click-tracks.

Oh, and for the record, both Sarah Brightman and Patti Cohenour (alt. Christine) in the first cast sang the song live, and if my memory is correct, Dale Kristien did on occasion out in LA during the 1NT.

[ljay889]

Posted: 10/12/08 at 5:14pm

In the original production the second go around of "We loooooooove," which was held for roughly 40 seconds was definitely prerecorded.


- Judging by the OBC, it is hardly 40 seconds. About 15-20. And it shouldn't have been that hard to hold live; the singers would have had to stagger their breathing.

[misto625]

Posted: 10/12/08 at 6:15pm

I would also be surprised if Cats had some prerecording because the Cats Chorus has always been part of the Broadway production. I assume for the current tour the swings are singing backstage.

I have wondered if Chorus Line uses prerecording during the rehearsal of "One" as well, or if it's just the off-stage singers doing the lines via voice-over. I just the saw the tour so the show is fresh in my mind.

I don't know about Gwen Verdon using prerecording, but I do believe that the recent revival prerecorded the second part of "She's a Brass Band" after the dance break.

[nobodyhome]

Posted: 10/12/08 at 6:30pm

"Judging by the OBC, it is hardly 40 seconds. About 15-20. And it shouldn't have been that hard to hold live; the singers would have had to stagger their breathing."

Onstage, it was approximately 30 seconds. I'm not positive it was pre-recorded though. I kind of think I did read somewhere that it was pre-recorded, but I can't find where it was. So I'm not sure. I think that perhaps it was just that the Vocal Minority took over after a certain number of bars and then the onstage cast came back again after a bit of rest.

I'm wondering why the beginning of "Telephone Hour" would have had to be pre-recorded. Because the singers were too far away from the floor mikes? Or some other reason? Or is this just an incorrect rumor?

[LadyRosecoe]

Posted: 10/12/08 at 6:53pm

The Company bit is actually staggered notes, you can hear others dropping out while others continue going to power that portion through. On the soundboard, this is definitely clear and on the original cast recording, I feel like it is significantly shorter. It was initially done so the elevator could have time to lower, right? I don't know if that's the case, but I heard that somewhere.

[Jon]

Posted: 10/12/08 at 7:16pm

Yes, all 13 characters (everyone exceptRobert) were riding the main elevator during that note.