West Side Story Question

[Actinggbugg474]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 10:40am

Is it bad that I have more than a healthy amount of Bway knowledge, but I never got into West Side Story enough to even watch the movie.

I just got cast as Riff in a local production and I have no idea how big this part is. Any info on Riff's songs, part size, range, is helpful. I haven't really decided 100% if I want to do the prodcution, so I just want to hear everyone's thoughts on that part and the show.

THANKS!

Updated On: 6/13/07 at 10:40 AM

[BrodyFosse123]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 10:45am

Here's an easy shot but...RENT THE MOVIE!

[xxnewgirlxx]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 10:49am

Yes! Rent the movie. It's brilliant.

[Actinggbugg474]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 10:50am

Well I guess that does make sense! I just didn't to know whether to be excited or disappointed because I didn't get Tony .. (which is really the only character I know anything about).

I may head out and rent the movie shortly.

[chicolini]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 10:52am

Until you rent it, check out Stage Agent - it'll give a synopsis and some character info.


WSS stage agent site

[jaesdare]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 10:52am

Do you know Romeo and Juliet, if so he's the parallel to Mercutio. It's a great part, I think it is a more fun part that Tony (you can play a male ingenue anytime). Riff is exciting and gets to dance alot, you can have a super sweet death scene.

[Gothampc]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 10:53am

"I haven't really decided 100% if I want to do the prodcution"

I don't know the details of your production or town you live in or your aspirations as a thespian, but I would not turn down a production of "West Side Story" because everyone knows the show and it would look good on your resume. It really is an American classic.

[WickedToronto]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 11:43am

Riff is a great part.. I find it better than Tony, more exciting and more dancing. The only thing is that you die in the first act and you are not in the second.

[wickedrentq]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 12:04pm

"Is is bad that I have more than a healthy amount of Bway knowledge, but I never got into West Side Story enough to even watch the movie"

YES!

As others have said, and adding to it, Riff is without a doubt the best male part in WSS. I think the two most important parts are Riff and Anita--they're showy, and they can really make or break a production of WSS. Tony and Maria are just boring, ooh we're in love, sing, blah.

But if you do watch the movie, keep in mind, the movie switched Krupke and Cool, so Riff sings and is around for Cool, not Krupke.

Also, depending on whether your production cuts it or not (I hope they don't, I hate hwen they do!), you do get a cameo in the second act, in the dream ballet, where the dream turns into a nightmare and Maria and Tony can't stop you and Bernardo from killing each other.

[FosseForever3]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 12:16pm

^ wow I've never seen a production with the dream ballet, it sounds beautiful...how can they cut something that important from so many productions? hmph.

Riff is the best part in the show. If I were a guy, that would definately be one of my dream roles. Take it. Seriously, congratulations! Accept the offer.

[me2]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 12:20pm

There is also a copy of the libretto available, packaged with ROMEO AND JULIET. You could look that over in a library or bookstore.

Congrats!
Broadway Blog: Give Them What They Want / Za Ba Zoovee (Broadway vs. Pop)

[Jon]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 12:29pm

Riff actually does appear briefly in Act 2, during the "nightmare' section of the dream ballet, in which the rumble is re-enacted (in stylized dance fashion).

This is assuming that the production actually does the ballet as it is supposed to be done.

[WonderBoy]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 12:54pm

If they aren't using the original choreography I would stay away. Having played Riff, it is a phenomenal role and the best male role in the show.

[Actinggbugg474]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 1:22pm

Thanks for all the feedback everyone! It seems like an overwhelmingly positive response about the part .. so I'm pretty sure I'm gonna take it now!

Also ... I'm going to buy a recording of the show so I can get better acquainted with it .. what recording do you guys reccommend?

[Actinggbugg474]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 7:12pm

BUMP! (Just because I want to know which CD to buy)

[wickedrentq]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 8:17pm

OBC, no question.

Aside from the fact that the actual Broadway singers are immensely more talented than the dubbers, the OBC has some of the music the movie is missing, like the ballet, the effed up orchestrations, and for your purposes, Riff sings the wrong song.

"wow I've never seen a production with the dream ballet, it sounds beautiful...how can they cut something that important from so many productions? hmph."

I remember reading something about Robbins even admitting it wasn't perfect...let me take a glance through my Making of WSS Book to see if it's in that one...

Nope, must have been one of the numerous WSS books I've read from libraries, but it was something about Robbins feeling insecure...I think particularly about the schirzo which is the part that occurs right before Somewhere, where Maria and Tony are running and searching to get away from everyone...can't remember anything more specific.

But, here's what the book says about the ballet, mainly quoting the libretto's description:

"Tony expands their wish-fulfillment fantasy into the opening verse for 'Somewhere,' which is sung as a dream ballad and accompanied by a ballet. As he sings, 'the walls of the apartment begin to move off, and the city walls surrounding them begin to close in on them.' Then choreography becomes highly expressive of the intristic drama behind the emotions: 'the two lovers begin to run, battering against the walls of the city, beginning to break through as chaotic figures of the gangs, of violence, flail around them.' They do break through, and suddenly they are in a purer world -- one of 'space, air, and sun.'

This startling transition to a sun-basked innocence in soft pastel colours produces a mood of warm joy. This is the first time that we actually see the sun in the story, and this 'miracle' is celebrated by a gentle love dance to an offstage female voice's singing of 'Somewhere.' The particular lyric of this song articules the lovers' optimistic belief that they will find 'a new way of living' and 'a way of forgiving,' but the very fact that there is as no yet identifiable place or time for such a blessed existence imbues the dream moment with poignancy. Just as the lovers succeed in prompting the rival gangs to join in a winding procession through a 'would-be world,' there is 'a dead stop.' 'The harsh shadows, the fire escapes of the real, tenement world cloud the sky, and the figures of Riff and Bernardo slowly walk on. The dream becomes a nightmare; as the city returns, there are brief re-enactments ofr the knife fight, of the deaths. Maria and Tony are once again separated from each other by the violent warring...they can not reach each other.' There is chaotic confusion and blackness before 'they find themselves back in the bedroom, clinging to each other desperately.'

This dance is also really important to Broadway history, as its the first that the actors playing the characters are allowed to participate in the dream ballet--remember Laurie and Curly are replaced in their dream ballet. This was due to as much Carol Lawrence as Jerry Robbins, because Carol was a ballet dancer and she kept telling that to Jerry, who initially had replacement Maria/Tony dancers, but he finally relented and allowed Carl and Larry to dance it.

So why is it cut? The only reason I can think of is that some people may feel that it's not necessary to the story, at least on the surface level, that Somewhere expresses the sentiment needed on its own. And I guess if they can get rid of one of millions of incredibly hard dances scenes, they do? I mean at one point Maria and Tony are carried off, and one day Carol fell, and was in serious danger of injuring herself, maybe productions don't wanna take this risk?

It's terrible that it's cut, because it's certainly essential to the show on just a slightly deeper level. Dancing aside, Bernstein's music for this sequence is brilliant, and the musical transition from the dream world to the nightmare is just...amazing. And Somewhere is the leitmotif integrated most into the score, arising from the Maria melody by lowering the first note a half-step, and is hinted at and heard in almost all of Tony and Maria's songs, and if everything aside from Somewhere is cut, than the ending of the whole sequence is lost, which is very important, as it juxtaposes the original "ri-a" melody with the "Some-where melody," and the sequence ends the exact same way the Balcony Scene did, and the music that ends the entire show. It just disturbs some of Bernstein's beautiful connections and parallellisms.

And yeah, the dance is probably good too

(Forgive me, I recently got to write a 17-page paper on Bernstein's score for WSS.)

[vfd88]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 8:33pm

wickedrentq-wow, thanks for the wonderful explanation! I can see that paper was well researched.

[wickedrentq]

Posted: 6/13/07 at 8:44pm

It's hard to stop myself from writing those 17 pages...and about...30 others...about the brilliance of WSS on here sometimes.

But if anyone's ever up for any sort of discussion (which should prob be specific given how much I can say), I would love nothing more than to discuss this genius show, my favorite, and in my opinion, maybe the best to have ever appeared on Broadway.

[That Groovy Guy]

Posted: 6/14/07 at 12:02am

"I just got cast as Riff in a local production and I have no idea how big this part is. Any info on Riff's songs, part size, range, is helpful. I haven't really decided 100% if I want to do the prodcution.."

"It seems like an overwhelmingly positive response about the part .. so I'm pretty sure I'm gonna take it now!"

I'm sorry, no offense, but IMO it seems to me like a little bit of a poor attitude to have.

[CATSNYrevival]

Posted: 6/14/07 at 12:29am

Not that anyone will agree with me after wickedrentq's wonderful history lesson, but I think you should get the 2 disc Jay Records studio cast. It's better if you're in the show to rehearse with because it has all of the dance music.
Amazon.com

[Actinggbugg474]

Posted: 6/14/07 at 9:46am

That Groovy Guy:

How is that a poor attitude?

I didn't know a whole lot about the show or the part .. and before I clear my schedule to commit myself of 3 months of 3, sometimes four rehearsals a week, I want to make sure it is something I really want to do. I've never turned down a part before, I just wanted to have an idea of what I was getting into because I gave the directors a final answer.

I don't see how that is a poor attitude. After watching the movie and reading about the show I am very flattered and honored to have been given the role ... however, when I first made this thread yesterday, I didn't know whether to be happy about the part, or to disappointed about it, because I knew nothing about the show.

Thanks for all the responses .. I'm really looking forward to the show. I'm actually glad I'm not Tony now because I get a chance to step away from my typical "male romantic lead" casting.

[glimpseofstocking]

Posted: 6/14/07 at 10:58am

Congratulations on getting the part, Actinggbugg! wickedrentq pretty much covered everything, but I would definitely get the OBC recording.

[FosseForever3]

Posted: 6/14/07 at 11:17am

wickedrentq - sweet explanation! Thanks alot.

Posted: 6/14/07 at 11:31am

congrats!!! riff is a brilliant part. a great actor is vital to the success of the part, and dont worry. riff is a big part. (and more fun than tony, in my opinion!)

[wickedrentq]

Posted: 6/14/07 at 10:48pm

That's silly CATS, I totally see where you're coming from and though I love the OBC and highly prefer it to the movie, it is a shame that the whole amazing orchestral score isn't provided and certain aspects cut. (And I'm embarassed to admit that I didn't know about this recording! So there ya go. How are the singers? I mean, no one can replace at least Larry Kert for me, but I'm definitely open to a CD with Bernstein's full amazing orchestrations. Do you know if it's the exact original orchestrations with no cuts/changes?)

I would say no one would agree with you if you suggested getting the movie CD, because I would have no choice but to tell the story about how when the dude who reorchestrated it for the movie first let them be heard for everyone at a special party, and he called Bernstein up to hear them, calling him a genius, honoring him, etc...Bernstein was so pissed at the butchered orchestrations that he stormed out of a party thrown in his honor. Ha! I love that man. Yeah, movie orchestrations = very bad.

Just to give you one example (you see what I mean about how much I love talking about and discussing WSS and how hard it is to get me stop once I've started...), there's so many important connections between all the songs of Tony and Maria, which starts with Something's Coming and Maria. Now, the movie keeps intact most of the connections--the Maria melody arising from the bridge section in Something's Coming (or whistling down the river, somewhere in there), and the inverse of the beginnings--the 3 notes that begin Maria are the inverse of the same three notes that begin Soemthing's Coming (in a different key). ((both are tritones, the one ultimate most important element of the entire WSS score, worked into every song, which is historic in itself since it used to be referred to as what in Latin means "the devil in music")) But okay, so one important thing the movie screws up--the end note of Something's Coming, in the OBC is a note that just trails off, is waiting to be resolved, just as Tony is waiting for something to come at the dance, and the inversion serves to finally resolve the end of Something's Coming in the beginning of Maria, therefore the music demonstrates fate, that indeed Maria was what Tony was waiting for, as she is what resolves his note. The movie changes the last note, and makes it resolved, completely removing the significance of it in the above mentioned ways. Blasphemy!

And this really has nothing to do with what anyone said or what the thread's been about...oops...yeah, I do that with West Side Story...it's bad...I should try to stop...