HELLO, DOLLY! Sets August 25 Closing Date; Bette Midler to Return July 17- Page 6

[Elegance101]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 9:10pm

HogansHero said: " 1. The numbers on Peters do not suggest a market for other (lesser) Dollys.

2. Rudin has NEVER given a hint of interest in doing a Weissler/Chicago-style revolving door. In fact, it is quite clear he has sold the show as a star vehicle to an almost unprecedented extent.

3. Rudin has never evinced an interest in putting stage plays before an audience other than when they show up at the theatre.

Had this nonsense been posted by newbies, I'd understand, but it is coming from people who ought to know better."

I agree with your point on the star vehicle marketing, but then why didn't it just close when Bette left the first time if Rudin had no interest in furthering the run with other women? Maybe I'm misunderstanding you.

In regards to filming the show, was it filmed for Lincoln Center already and we're talking about a different thing? If not, do you believe Rudin doesn't even have interest in filming for archival footage?

Updated On: 4/20/18 at 09:10 PM

[natashalost]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 9:17pm

Did they ever consider getting an A-Lister Horace who would really bring in ticket sales and then get a Dolly who was a Broadway name, not necessarily a household name? 

This is probably a dumb suggestion but it's just a thought.

[Elegance101]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 9:25pm

I mean, it's not called "Hello, Horace!"

As mentioned above, it was designed as a star vehicle for Dolly. It's all about her.

But not a dumb suggestion at all! Other shows have a history of star-casting alternating roles, so I see where you're coming from.

[HogansHero]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 9:26pm

Elegance101 said: "I agree with your point on the star vehicle marketing, but then why didn't it just close when Bette left the first time if Rudin had no interest in furthering the run with other women? Maybe I'm misunderstanding you.

In regards to filming the show, was it filmed for Lincoln Center already and we're talking about a different thing? If not, do you believe Rudin doesn't even have interest in filming for archivalfootage?"

I think in Peters Rudin found a person he could market (as he did) as the great treasure of musical theatre. He was able to package her credibly in much the way he packaged Midler. This is not something that would be possible with (to pick the name most recently mentioned in this thread) Vanessa Williams. 

Regarding filming, I was referring to filming for commercial purposes, not archival.

[HogansHero]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 9:34pm

dmwnc1959 said: "But to call any of us idiots is unfair."

Of course. But it is a part of the delusion. Most people know nothing about the theatre, musicals, or the people who perform in such. Just as most people here know nothing about a lot of other things. Because people choose what to be interested in. To suggest that someone is an idiot for not keeping up with musical theatre is crazy talk. If everyone were as interested in the theatre as the active participants in this thread, tickets to Broadway shows would be unaffordable even for the 1%.

[DAME]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 9:37pm

HogansHero said: "Elegance101 said: "I agree with your point on the star vehicle marketing, but then why didn't it just close when Bette left the first time if Rudin had no interest in furthering the run with other women? Maybe I'm misunderstanding you.

In regards to filming the show, was it filmed for Lincoln Center already and we're talking about a different thing? If not, do you believe Rudin doesn't even have interest in filming for archivalfootage?"

I think in Peters Rudin found a person he could market (as he did) as the great treasure of musical theatre. He was able to package her credibly in much the way he packaged Midler. This is not something that would be possible with (to pick the name most recently mentioned in this thread) Vanessa Williams.

Regarding filming, I was referring to filming for commercial purposes, notarchival."

Except Bette is involved and she has successfully had her stuff filmed for broadcast before.  I don’t know anything.  But I wouldn’t be surprised if this was all planned from the get go. She is a very smart business woman.  He is also a very savy producer outside of the theater.

[ArtMan]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 9:41pm

Eliza2 said: 

I feel confident that at least 90% of the subscribers at my theatre have no idea who Betty Buckley is. And they don't care who is in the cast of any of the shows they buy tickets to. And they certainly don't know what Equity vs non-Equity means."

I completely agree with you.  The same would be said about my city.  If Hello Dolly would come to my city, which it isn't, the subscribers would buy tickets to it because of the show.  They don't know squat about equity or non equity or who even the star is.  We just had Beautiful in my city last week.  We had the understudy for Carole King at my performance.  (who was excellent).  The couple sitting next to me, who paid over $100 for each ticket were disappointed because they actually thought Carole King performed in the show.

[ArtMan]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 9:41pm

double post 


 

Updated On: 4/20/18 at 09:41 PM

[DAME]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 9:47pm

ArtMan said: "Eliza2 said:

I feel confident that at least 90% of the subscribers at my theatre have no idea who Betty Buckley is. And they don't care who is in the cast of any of the shows they buy tickets to. And they certainly don't know what Equity vs non-Equity means."

I completely agree with you. The same would be said about my city. If Hello Dolly would come to my city, which it isn't, the subscribers would buy tickets to it because of the show. They don't know squat about equity or non equity or who even the star is. We just had Beautiful in my city last week. We had the understudy for Carole King at my performance. (who was excellent). The couple sitting next to me, who paid over $100 for each ticket were disappointed because they actually thought Carole King performed in the show."

Please don’t get me wrong.  But what does that say about that couple ?  The bitchy poster might have a point.

[Miles2Go2]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 9:49pm

DAME said: "HogansHero said: "Elegance101 said: "I agree with your point on the star vehicle marketing, but then why didn't it just close when Bette left the first time if Rudin had no interest in furthering the run with other women? Maybe I'm misunderstanding you.

In regards to filming the show, was it filmed for Lincoln Center already and we're talking about a different thing? If not, do you believe Rudin doesn't even have interest in filming for archivalfootage?"

I think in Peters Rudin found a person he could market (as he did) as the great treasure of musical theatre. He was able to package her credibly in much the way he packaged Midler. This is not something that would be possible with (to pick the name most recently mentioned in this thread) Vanessa Williams.

Regarding filming, I was referring to filming for commercial purposes, notarchival."

Except Bette is involved and she has successfully had her stuff filmed for broadcast before. I don’t know anything. But I wouldn’t be surprised if this was all planned from the get go. She is a very smart business woman. He is also a very savyproducer outside of the theater."

It would appear her interests are not entirely Rudin’s. She made significant $$$ for starring in the show, regardless of whether it recouped. If she was an investor too then that aligns her interests closer with his, I suppose. I have a hard time believing that the creative and production teams planned from the get-go for this to be a limited run. Depending on which rumor mill you listen to, the show has just recently recouped or has yet to recoup. So putting business smarts and savvy production skills to the aide, it would appear this show is closing earlier than all involved had hoped. Question: does Rudin typically not announce when his shows have recouped? 

[SmokeyLady]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 10:00pm

dmwnc1959 said: "Eliza2 said: “I feel confident that at least 90% of the subscribers at my theatre have no idea who Betty Buckley is. And they don't care who is in the cast of any of the shows they buy tickets to. And they certainly don't know what Equity vs non-Equity means."

SmokeyLady said: “They are idiots.”



I’ve got people who work in my office who have never heard of Bernadette Peters. I asked one of my co-workers today if they’d ever heard of the show “Hello, Dolly!” and they seriously answered/asked if it was about Dolly Parton.

And I personally had never heard of Betty Buckley before the tour was announced.

A good chunk of America truly enjoy the quality, official Broadway National Tours that come through their towns. And yes, the ones that aren’t official or are non-Equity, well, maybe they don’t know the difference or what that means. I do, but only since I became a regular here.

Americans who do subscribe to see these Broadway National Tours, as if it were almost an afterthought, trust absolutely the producers of the shows to put in experienced actors and actresses to give standout performances. It’s not that they don’t care who’s in the cast. Maybe the ticket holders don’t know who the performers are by name. It’s that they, we, are paying to see a high quality show, a Broadway National Tour, and expect, hope, and dream to be entertained by something amazing. It’s one night to escape.We want to walk away knowing we’ve accomplished that.

However, none of this makes us, them, or me, idiots. We just haven’t spent our lives, or a significant part of our life, devoted to Broadway entertainment. I’ve only been watching shows for 27 months. I’m a beginner compared to many of you seasoned veterans. When I saw “The King and I” I had never heard of Laura Michelle Kelly. I know who she is now. Same for many of the other 18 shows I’ve seen, however I’ve tried to educate myself beforehand now with asking questions here.

But to call any of us idiots is unfair.



"

Please get a grip.  I know that 99.9% of the world has no idea who these people are or what equity or non equity is.  

[DAME]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 10:04pm

Miles2Go2 said: "DAME said: "HogansHero said: "Elegance101 said: "I agree with your point on the star vehicle marketing, but then why didn't it just close when Bette left the first time if Rudin had no interest in furthering the run with other women? Maybe I'm misunderstanding you.

In regards to filming the show, was it filmed for Lincoln Center already and we're talking about a different thing? If not, do you believe Rudin doesn't even have interest in filming for archivalfootage?"

I think in Peters Rudin found a person he could market (as he did) as the great treasure of musical theatre. He was able to package her credibly in much the way he packaged Midler. This is not something that would be possible with (to pick the name most recently mentioned in this thread) Vanessa Williams.

Regarding filming, I was referring to filming for commercial purposes, notarchival."

Except Bette is involved and she has successfully had her stuff filmed for broadcast before. I don’t know anything. But I wouldn’t be surprised if this was all planned from the get go. She is a very smart business woman. He is also a very savyproducer outside of the theater."

It would appear her interests are not entirely Rudin’s. She made significant $$$ for starring in the show, regardless of whether it recouped. If she was an investor too then that aligns her interests closer with his, I suppose. I have a hard time believing that the creative and production teams planned from the get-go for this to be a limited run. Depending on which rumor mill you listen to, the show has just recently recouped or has yet to recoup. So puttingbusiness smarts and savvy production skills to the aide, it would appear this show is closing earlier than all involved had hoped. Question: does Rudin typically not announcewhenhis shows have recouped?"

I was referring to the filming.   I am sad it is closing .  

[dmwnc1959]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 10:09pm

SmokeyLady said: "Please get a grip. I know that 99.9% of the world has no idea who these people are or what equity or non equity is."

Honey, I’m not the one who just admitted to basically calling 99.9% of the world “idiots”. 

 

[Miles2Go2]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 10:13pm

DAME said: “I am sad it is closing.”

Me too. 

[SmokeyLady]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 10:18pm

dmwnc1959 said: "SmokeyLady said: "Please get a grip. I know that 99.9% of the world has no idea who these people are or what equity or non equity is."

Honey, I’m not the one who just admitted to basically calling 99.9% of the world “idiots”.

"

Well they are Blanche.  THEY ARE!  Have you seen who our president is?  Have you seen what has happened in Europe?  Have you seen what is going on in Syria?  Have you seen  the cuts in Carousel?   The world is full of idiots.  

[HogansHero]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 10:32pm

DAME said: "Except Bette is involved and she has successfully had her stuff filmed for broadcast before. I don’t know anything. But I wouldn’t be surprised if this was all planned from the get go. She is a very smart business woman. He is also a very savyproducer outside of the theater."

This is not her call. And what stage show of hers has been filmed for broadcast? 

 

[ArtMan]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 11:07pm

I think that Dame was referring that many of her past concerts had been filmed, especially for HBO.

[GeorgeandDot]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 11:09pm

So sad to see this one go. I was hoping this production would run for years. I also hope they film and air this absolutely masterpiece revival.

[DAME]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 11:14pm

HogansHero said: "DAME said: "Except Bette is involved and she has successfully had her stuff filmed for broadcast before. I don’t know anything. But I wouldn’t be surprised if this was all planned from the get go. She is a very smart business woman. He is also a very savyproducer outside of the theater."

This is not her call. And what stage show of hers has been filmed for broadcast?

"

No one said it was her call.  I clearly said I don’t know anything. Drop the attitude.  Just a fan here enjoying the chit chat . She had 3 of her arena shows broadcast on HBO.  Her Vegas show was also released.  She has also had one movie released of a tour.  

[HogansHero]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 11:34pm

@DAME, no attitude. I was just responding to what you said. They are both smart and savvy but I feel confident he is not going to film it for release. Her return may well have been planned, at least since before she left. I'm sure it was at least discussed and that the offer was on the table.

[DAME]

Posted: 4/20/18 at 11:51pm

HogansHero said: "@DAME, no attitude. I was just responding to what you said. They are both smart and savvy but I feel confident he is not going to filmit for release. Her return may well have been planned, at least since before she left. I'm sure it was at least discussed and that the offer was on the table."

Cool. 

Updated On: 4/20/18 at 11:51 PM

[10086sunset]

Posted: 4/21/18 at 12:20am

HogansHero said: "Evans2 said: "Hogan, care to be slighty more specific?"

Sure.

1. The numbers on Peters do not suggest a market for other (lesser) Dollys.

2. Rudin has NEVER given a hint of interest in doing a Weissler/Chicago-style revolving door. In fact, it is quite clear he has sold the show as a star vehicle to an almost unprecedented extent.

3. Rudin has never evinced an interest in putting stage plays before an audience other than when they show up at the theatre.

Had this nonsense been posted by newbies, I'd understand, but it is coming from people who ought to know better."

Hogan, you really nailed these points. You are right on the money.

[bear88]

Posted: 4/21/18 at 2:14am

Perhaps it's because I have no emotional attachment to the musical, or this revival, but the closing announcement doesn't seem surprising at all. 

HogansHero has summed things up well. The revival was sold as Hello, Bette and it was boffo box office. The musical without Midler has performed very respectably, but it's not a must-see show. And it would only have gotten worse over time. Revivals just seem to have a limited shelf life, no matter how much people like them.

I admit to being very curious about the revival's profitability at this point but apparently there has been no announcement or reliable information. 

Closing the show in late August saves money for the upcoming tour, where people won't be insisting on Bette Midler, Bernadette Peters, or even Betty Buckley. A four-week run or two-week run of Hello, Dolly in cities across the country will do very well.

I won't wager money on this, but I suspect there won't be a filmed, commercial release of this revival. There's not enough money in it to be worth the trouble, I suspect. And if Rudin wanted a filmed production, he had months to arrange that. He didn't, and made sure Midler was kept off the Tonys. For those who love the production, I hope I'm wrong.  

[Elegance101]

Posted: 4/21/18 at 3:26am

bear88 said: "I won't wager money on this, but I suspect there won't be a filmed, commercial releaseof this revival. There's not enough money in it to be worth the trouble, I suspect. And if Rudin wanted a filmed production, he had months to arrange that. He didn't, and made sure Midler was kept off the Tonys. For those who love the production, I hope I'm wrong."

To be fair, the Tonys were more of a business decision, to keep a shroud of mystery around the show. If the show were closed (along with the tour), that would no longer be a factor.

But, yeah, I have doubts that it will filmed for commercial purposes.

[geoffreyC]

Posted: 4/21/18 at 3:36am

They are wise to shut her down now.  let's face it, this show has been done to death, enough.