OBCR of FOLLIES remixed and remastered!- Page 2

[3bluenight]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 2:33am

I just ordered mine as well. the orchestrations in the right girl are so throbbing and frenetic. I'm so excited.

[binau]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 2:49am

"Delightful. Too bad they didn't record any extra material. I would love to have a good recording of the Bolero (better than the soundboard), played at the right tempo. That Paper Mill version is funereal."

Are we sure that the Paper Mill version is not the right tempo? The OBC tempos are quite fast (e.g. BUDDY'S EYES is faster than it was written) and didn't we conclude the Soundboard was sped up?

[justoldbill]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 2:57am

No, I don't think that has been concluded at all. If the sound board tape (which may well be Sondheim's archive tape) was speeded up, would the music still be in the original keys?

No.

[ljay889]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 3:20am

I'm pretty sure we did conclude that the soundboard was sped up with age. There's no way the Prologue was played that fast.

[justoldbill]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 8:40am

So much for logic. The music IS still in the original keys, and having owned said recording for over thirty-five years, I can testify age is not a factor. Having seen the original production four times, there is no reason to assume the speed of the performance would not vary somewhat from night to night, especially if it was known the performance was being taped (legitimately off the sound board) for archival purposes. The big concern that night would be to get the entire performance onto one reel.
This, in fact, did not happen. The original tape ran out before the end of the exit music.

Updated On: 7/13/12 at 08:40 AM

[EricMontreal22]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 2:19pm

"In any case, the recordings of those Angel releases never sounded as good as their respective original CD releases, such as THE MUSIC MAN and THE UNSINKABLE MOLLY BROWN, or especially the Capitol R&H soundtrack releases. "

The first CD release of Music Man--at least the one I have--used the 60s release with extra stereo reverb that I find unlistenable, personally. I also find the Angel releases of Forum, Funny Girl and especially Zorba are big improvements on the earlier CD releases, but that may be a matter of taste.

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 3:55pm

Placed my order. Thanks, Bruce! Been a huge fan for a long time. Please tell me you're doing Twang!! Pretty please? Or at least the full Man of La Mancha London recording.

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 4:01pm

So much for logic

It's gonna be fun to see that one come back to bite.

[My Oh My]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 4:23pm

I may be the only person on earth who has never heard the original cast album of Follies in its crappy, unremastered form.

But I just listened to the "Losing My Mind" sample of the remastered version and while I have no reference point to say how good the remaster is, I can say that listening to it took me right back to when I saw the final performance of the revival last month. I was seated 3rd row, orchestra center and this remaster reminded me of that distinct experience hearing the show live. I'm nuts about orchestration, moreso than most orchestrators, LOL, and for a recording to capture the orchestra so well and for the mix to remind one of a live performance is saying a lot. Thank you.

I will order myself a copy this instant!

Now, where can I hear samples of the nasty, unremastered version? My ears are especially sensitive to crappy mixes and they twitch manically, lol. Vocals panned hard-left and right? Dear God, what's the name of this so-called original recording engineer? Sheesh!

[broadwaybabywannabe2]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 4:36pm

just ordered my copy...THANKS FOR POSTING THIS!

the SONDHEIMMANIAC

[EricMontreal22]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 5:09pm

My Oh My, Amazon should have samples from the Amazon release (which to be clear, was remastered, though it's debatable how well--what's so brilliant about this one is that it was also *remixed* from the original 8tracks, not just cleaned up--since those issues with the bad panning, etc, were all down to the original mix and the Angl remaster merely cleaned up that existing mix, the way the majority of remasters do--Bruce can probably be more clear,and he already has been, but there is a difference).

August can't come quickly enough.

[My Oh My]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 5:19pm

Oh, trust me, I know the difference, hehehe.

I've never heard of pros panning vocals hard-left or right for the duration of anything, much less a whole song, so was just curious who was responsible for that original mix.

I think even a deaf person knows not to pan something hard-right or left, lol.

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 5:31pm

I don't have the musical or technical background to understand half of what ya'll are talking about, but the samples speak for themselves.

I'm in.

[bk]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 6:04pm

The panning was popular in the early days of stereo - it stopped being popular in the late 1960s, probably even before. The producer of the original Follies mix was responsible for how it was mixed - one day, and not well.

I can only tell you, as you can probably hear in our audio samples, this is more than just a minor step up - I'm hoping it will be a revelation to everyone - you're going to hear things with such clarity and detail, and orchestrations that were buried in the original mix. Someone mentioned Losing My Mind - if you listen to the intro you will, at long last, hear the piano part that should be playing with the violins - the piano part was completely missing in the original mix for the entire song - gone, not buried, just gone. The panning is now normal, but it's the clarity that will astonish, I think - it sure astonished me. I actually turned to my engineer at some point and said, "After all these years of thinking this was a stinky recording (not the mix, the recording itself), who knew it was actually recorded well, and then completely screwed up in the mix. Both previous CD masterings were off the two-track album masters - there was only so much they could do and they didn't do it especially well .

[explorer]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 6:12pm

Oh my love for Follies. Just ordered my copy before it sells out & it will!!

[EricMontreal22]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 6:22pm

It's interesting that Dick Jones did that--I guess he really was rushed (or trying to do something more theatrical with poor results), as there aren't issues with that extreme panning with other Jones' produced albums I know (off the top of my head, Forum, Funny Girl and Zorba). But as BK said I certainly have encountered it before--particularly in the early days of stereo (I also have an LP of the OBCR of Company that's mixed for quadrophonic speakers and, maybe that's why, but it suffers from a lot of that too--though I know even the original CD release had some of that which Shepherd rectified when he did the extensive remix in the 1990s for the remastered version--you can tell which version is which because before that remaster, the opening busy tone signal didn't match the orchestral echo of it in pitch, something he changed for the remaster--).

Re Losing My Mind--it always bugged and puzzled me why you can ONLY hear the violas in the intro to it (which stands out even more, because some of the other recordings--I think the Londona nd maybe the Concert one dropped the violas almost entirely from the intro).

[bk]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 6:37pm

Funnily, I put on Funny Girl last night and in If a Girl Isn't Pretty the entire first part of the song is hard-panned to the right - not just one voice but all of them - it's terrible.

[EricMontreal22]

Posted: 7/13/12 at 9:33pm

HAHA I should pull it out--I have no doubt you're right. Liberson, of course, was much smarter with stereo right from the start--for the most part very early Columbia stereo recordings like West Side Story and Candide still sound terrific.

[Wicked Fanatic]

Posted: 7/14/12 at 2:02am

bk you'll be glad to know that the remastered version was plugged by Stephen Sondheim tonight at SCFTA where he appeared with ASCAP's Michael Kerker "In Conversation" and Sondheim compositions sung by Christine Ebersole and Brian Stokes Mitchell. Christine's "Losing My Mind" was wonderful but I still prefer Dorothy Collins' of those that I've heard.

[bk]

Posted: 7/14/12 at 3:42am

I was there. :) It was actually Michael Kerker who plugged it and it was very sweet of him to do so.

[Scripps2]

Posted: 7/14/12 at 3:59am

"Please tell me you're doing Twang!! Pretty please? Or at least the full Man of La Mancha London recording."

By all means do Twang but don't that recording of Man of La Mancha - it's the only rare vinyl I have left.

[justoldbill]

Posted: 7/15/12 at 1:30am

I still live in hope for-
Riverwind - Original Cast
Androcles And The Lion - TV Soundtrack
Merry Christmas, 1975 - Harvey Schmidt
Two Film Scores For Solo Piano - Harvey Schmidt
Movie Music In A Small Texas Town (4 vols.) - Harvey Schmidt
I'm Old Fashioned - Inga Swenson

Updated On: 7/15/12 at 01:30 AM

[bk]

Posted: 7/16/12 at 2:15am

Hope springs eternal and eternal springs hope.

[devonian.t]

Posted: 7/16/12 at 6:54am

And how about The Secret Diary of Adrian Mole???

[devonian.t]

Posted: 7/16/12 at 7:02am

Oh, and those samples are a revelation! I've ordered my copy!