PIPPIN History

[WalkOn]

Posted: 2/16/07 at 8:09pm

I've been listening to the cast recording for decades and have seen the televised version a thousand times... but..

I know nothing of its history. Whose ideas was it? What was the source material? Did Schwartz not like the original production?

Any PIPPIN experts out there?

Updated On: 2/16/07 at 08:09 PM

[tazber]

Posted: 2/16/07 at 8:16pm

Schwartz conceived and wrote the show in college. It was originally called "Pippen, Pippen". It Wasn't until after Godspell that he decided to have it produced again.
It wasn't a critical darling, but due to a massive TV promotion the show gained a following and I believe returned its investment. (not sure about the last part, I'll bet Margo knows.)

Updated On: 2/16/07 at 08:16 PM

[kyle.]

Posted: 2/16/07 at 8:31pm

I'm pretty sure I have heard that Schwartz hated what Fosse turned it into.

[purpleprince101]

Posted: 2/16/07 at 8:52pm

my parents saw the original as with the london production. they loved it and i always steel the playbill!

[Elphie3]

Posted: 2/16/07 at 8:52pm

"Pippin, Pippin" - Schwartz's college show, was originally invisioned as a mideval mystery playesque pastoral musical. The show originally ended where "Morning Glow" currently occurs, but after a suggestion from a well known producer, Schwartz rewrote the second act to explore what happens after Pippin killed his father.

After his success with "Godspell" the show (retitled "Pippin") recieved a Broadway production. Bob Fosse was brought on to helm the production, but there was major controversy between Schwartz and Fosse (it is rumored that the "annoying, young composer" in Fosse's movie "All That Jazz" was based on Schwartz.) Schwartz was still in his early twenties at the time, and he greatly disagreed with Fosse's retooling of the show (for example the song "With You" was written as a moving love ballad. When Fosse allowed the rest of the creative team into see his staging for the number, and Schwartz found that it had been turned into an orgy number he was very very upset.) Fosse ended up barring Schwartz from rehearsals. Ironically, Schwartz would later become the biggest supporter of Fosse's vision for the show.

The show was a hit, boosted by the television commercial (the first ever for a Broadway show.)

[WalkOn]

Posted: 2/16/07 at 8:53pm

A college project? Nice.

Posted: 2/16/07 at 9:14pm

The TV commerical is the important thing in this story: The show WAS NOT doing well. Fosse put together a TV commercial that used the vamp from "Glory" and a dancer doing some Fosse moves. At the end, the voice over said "This has been one minute from Pippin. For the other 89, come to the------- Theatre. Tickets available, blah blah blah."

Over night the tables turned and Pippin was a hit. Fosse altered the show to featured the dance from the commercial and before long, the audience was applauding the scene when the recognized it.

Despite it's bad rep I've always loved the show. It became a big hit and Morning Glow got some radio airplay. Motown put out the cast album and a second album of Motown Stars singing the score.

[BobbyBubby]

Posted: 2/16/07 at 9:19pm

That show owes everything to Fosse. Its an awful piece without him.

Posted: 2/16/07 at 9:29pm

Wow-- I don't know about that! I think the score is beautiful. The show can seem a little bit dated now with it's 70's vibe, but I'd love to see a revival that tosses out Fosse's choreography and starts over.

[South Fl Marc]

Posted: 2/16/07 at 9:49pm

I agree, Fosse turned a bland show into something spectacular .

[Craig]

Posted: 2/16/07 at 10:03pm

Joe - you left out another crucial detail about the TV Spot.

It was the first time a Broadway show shot a commercial.

[SDav 10495]

Posted: 2/16/07 at 10:13pm

Might one be able to find this commercial anywhere online? (No, it's not there.)

[purpleprince101]

Posted: 2/16/07 at 10:13pm

revival please

Posted: 2/16/07 at 11:00pm

Exactly Craig-- it truly changed the way Broadway was marketed.

Do you recall-- I seem to remember that the dance Fosse did for the commercial wasn't even in the show, and that when the Commercial caught on he re-did the number to include it. Do you remember?

[CurtainPullDowner]

Posted: 2/16/07 at 11:10pm

I thought it was the trio dance with Vereen and two of the female dancers, that WAS a part of the show.

[mattonstage]

Posted: 2/16/07 at 11:13pm

The college production was done at Carnegie-Mellon University. I did a show there in '84 and we used I believe the last remaining set piece from that production for ours. It was the King's throne. We lopped the back of it off and then noticed it said "Pippen, pippen" on it. oops.

[BobbyBubby]

Posted: 2/16/07 at 11:55pm

Changed the way Broadway was marketed? Is that a good thing?

[defyingravity11]

Posted: 2/17/07 at 12:02am

CurtainPullDowner, I thought it was originally in the show as well.

[jrb_actor]

Posted: 2/17/07 at 12:47am

Check out A Producer's Journey by Stuart Ostrow. He produced it.

Schwartz envisioned a show for children. Fosse clearly saw it the opposite way.

Also, Fosse and Ostrow and others HATED the video that is out. The video's producer was cheap and hacked the show to bits. Apparently, Fosse took the footage and edited his own video of that performance. It's somewhere and hopefully one day, it will be released, if possible.

I did the show in high school. I think it's an excellent piece of theatre--with or without Fosse. The score is wonderful. I think a revival would be kickass--and would be a great opportunity for one of our current choreographers and/or directors to reinvent the show.

[WalveMalve]

Posted: 2/17/07 at 12:56am

The original "Pippin, Pippin" was debuted with Scotch'n'Soda Theatre -- Carnegie Mellon's student run theatre company -- in 1967. This year, the organization is producing a 40th anniversary production of the musical in its more finalized form in April.

[CurtainPullDowner]

Posted: 2/17/07 at 1:04am

Did Pippen wear a mesh see thru shirt?

[MargoChanning]

Posted: 2/17/07 at 1:20am

FYI -- the dance number used in the commercial was dubbed "The Manson Trio" by Fosse. It looks like a fairly simple number, but a couple of dancers I've known who've done it say that it's a killer if you do it exactly as Fosse intended it (something to do with the balance it requires to do the subtle contortions).

[SeanMartin]

Posted: 2/17/07 at 7:04am

>> Did Pippen wear a mesh see thru shirt?

I dont think he wears it all the way through, but certainly in the scene where he visits his grandmother.

After reading this thread's anecdotes, I'm starting to see that ALL THAT JAZZ may superficially be based on his experience with mounting CHICAGO, but it's really about PIPPIN. Whoa.

[FosseForever3]

Posted: 2/17/07 at 9:31am

What brilliant marketing...using The Manson Trio to promote the show :) Margo is exactly right, that number is a balancing act and it's difficult to dance so tightly with two other people. I would kill to see that commerical...someday...somehow!!! :)

jrb: I love my Pippin video! I wonder why they hated it so much...just because it was cheaply made?

[D2]

Posted: 2/17/07 at 10:00am

I did the show in college, and our choreographer, Paul Solen, was in the original production. Not only is the trio known as The Manson Trio, the entire concept behind Fosse's production is that the Leading Player is a Manson-like character and all of the players are his followers, roaming the countryside looking for innocent victims to kill. Not quite the innocent pastoral Schwartz initially envisioned.

Updated On: 2/17/07 at 10:00 AM