#26
Posted: 11/7/11 at 12:26am
Agreed. Mormon totally flew over this girls head. There's a lot more of a message there she realized.
Pulizer Prize for Drama - 2011 — Page 2
#27
Posted: 11/7/11 at 12:58am
I still can't believe Next to Normal won.
Any show with "You've got some nerve Henry, and I'm just all nerve" - stupid. it is full of predictable rhymes and characters that aren't that interesting. I think it has a great story to tell, but I just don't think that was the best showcase for it.
I don't think Mormon deserves to win. It was funny, but nothing groundbreaking. I don't care that it's a hit. I saw it, and I thought it was just "eh."
I'm not sure who should win. I liked "Good People," but it didn't do anything for theater. It was written with a sitcom-y style. It had great performances, but it was sort of like "poor people are good too," which Roseanne accomplished years ago. Other Desert Cities doesn't sound any better.
Where are the people who are pushing form and style? Everything is so sitcom-y.
Any show with "You've got some nerve Henry, and I'm just all nerve" - stupid. it is full of predictable rhymes and characters that aren't that interesting. I think it has a great story to tell, but I just don't think that was the best showcase for it.
I don't think Mormon deserves to win. It was funny, but nothing groundbreaking. I don't care that it's a hit. I saw it, and I thought it was just "eh."
I'm not sure who should win. I liked "Good People," but it didn't do anything for theater. It was written with a sitcom-y style. It had great performances, but it was sort of like "poor people are good too," which Roseanne accomplished years ago. Other Desert Cities doesn't sound any better.
Where are the people who are pushing form and style? Everything is so sitcom-y.
#28
Posted: 11/7/11 at 1:20am
I don't think the Pulitzer should be awarded strictly to pieces that "push form and style." If the "form" is revolutionary, but doesn't really convey messages effectively, then I don't think it should win the Pulitzer. The example that comes to mind is Rodgers and Hammerstein's "Allegro." It experimented with form a lot (for its time), but it didn't work as a piece of theater.
I like your imperturbable perspicacity.
#29
Posted: 11/7/11 at 1:30am
SondheimFan5, every single criticism you had of Book of Mormon is true for Next to Normal, and they won. Enough people lost respect for the award after Next to Normal that I doubt the few left would be all that upset by Book of Mormon.
And Women on the Verge having a better score? Really? With Model Behavior, it's mediocre at best. Without Model Behavior, it's completely forgettable.
And Women on the Verge having a better score? Really? With Model Behavior, it's mediocre at best. Without Model Behavior, it's completely forgettable.
Like a firework unexploded
Wanting life but never knowing how
Wanting life but never knowing how
#30
Posted: 11/7/11 at 1:35am
Ripped Man, I would have bought the writers of NtN a drink if they could have just successfully rhymed a line. I didn't even hear that much. Maybe you know the show better than I do, but I only remember one rhyme consistent rhyme the whole show. Mormon isn't perfect at this, but it's a lot better.
#31
Posted: 11/7/11 at 1:39am
They're both different beasts. I like Next to Normal for what it was trying to do, but I didn't love it. And that also has a lot to do with Ripley, et. al.
pinoyidol2006 - I agree. I didn't mean tot say we should, but I tend to like plays that are more theatrical in tone/style, then something like God of Carnage that can be so easily translated to another medium.
pinoyidol2006 - I agree. I didn't mean tot say we should, but I tend to like plays that are more theatrical in tone/style, then something like God of Carnage that can be so easily translated to another medium.
#32
Posted: 11/7/11 at 2:32am
Personally, I thought NEXT TO NORMAL's win was a travesty and would love to see THE BOOK OF MORMON take the Pulitzer this year. It may not reinvent the wheel, but its charms lie in the subversive wit beneath its sunny traditionalism. It's smart, inventive, hilarious, and even deep. Deeper than a one-dimensional dysfunctional family melodrama with a generic rock score, in my opinion.
I'll be seeing SONS OF THE PROPHET and OTHER DESERT CITIES shortly, so curious to find out how they stack up. And wasn't GOOD PEOPLE thought of as well-crafted but slight? I can't imagine they'd let Lindsay-Abaire take it again.
I'll be seeing SONS OF THE PROPHET and OTHER DESERT CITIES shortly, so curious to find out how they stack up. And wasn't GOOD PEOPLE thought of as well-crafted but slight? I can't imagine they'd let Lindsay-Abaire take it again.
#33
Posted: 11/7/11 at 4:01am
(stares at a lot of people who missed the reason why NTN won the pulitzer)
which would be subject matter.
which would be subject matter.
#34
Posted: 11/7/11 at 5:14am
Yeah TheHappyPhantom clearly you do not remember the show well because the score is FULL of true rhymes, FULL of them.
The N2N backlash after they won the Pulitzer was/is interesting. I think the show as a whole is [cliche]greater than the sum of its parts[/cliche] so I don't know how relevant pointing out a few odd lines will be. A fully original, American "powerful rock musical that grapples with mental illness in a suburban family and expands the scope of subject matter for musicals" is a great summary of the show's merits.
The N2N backlash after they won the Pulitzer was/is interesting. I think the show as a whole is [cliche]greater than the sum of its parts[/cliche] so I don't know how relevant pointing out a few odd lines will be. A fully original, American "powerful rock musical that grapples with mental illness in a suburban family and expands the scope of subject matter for musicals" is a great summary of the show's merits.
Give me claws and a hunch, just away from this bunch.
Updated On: 11/7/11 at 05:14 AM
#35
Posted: 11/7/11 at 7:30am
(stares at a lot of people who missed the reason why NTN won the pulitzer)
Actually, the reason that Next To Normal won the Pulitzer is because the Pulitzer board wanted it to. It wasn't even on the shortlist that the drama committee presented to the board. There are many who find the show's treatment of a delicate subject distasteful and possibly dangerous.
Actually, the reason that Next To Normal won the Pulitzer is because the Pulitzer board wanted it to. It wasn't even on the shortlist that the drama committee presented to the board. There are many who find the show's treatment of a delicate subject distasteful and possibly dangerous.
"You travel alone because other people are only there to remind you how much that hook hurts that we all bit down on. Wait for that one day we can bite free and get back out there in space where we belong, sail back over water, over skies, into space, the hook finally out of our mouths and we wander back out there in space spawning to other planets never to return hurrah to earth and we'll look back and can't even see these lives here anymore. Only the taste of blood to remind us we ever existed. The earth is small. We're gone. We're dead. We're safe."
-John Guare, Landscape of the Body
#36
Posted: 11/7/11 at 8:32am
The Book of Mormon is such a brisk, entertaining show that I think some people miss that it tackles some heady issues in succinct and incredibly skillful ways. Elder Price's whole arc is about discovering the meaning of faith and how religion really should be used in one's life. In "Hasa Diga," you witness the culture clash of two missionaries learning that the book they are armed with cannot help the real world problems the villagers are facing. "I Am Africa" is an incredibly sharp takedown of Western imperialism and the empty platitutdes of self-serving "We Are The World"-type pop songs. There is a well-defined discussion of metaphor versus literalism with regard to how to interpret religious text. And at the end of the show, you watch a new religion being born, complete with its own Messiah story and dogma.
There is more going on in The Book of Mormon of substance than in some Pulitzer-winning musicals like Fiorello! or How to Succeed in Business, for all of their virtues. And I think Mormon is smarter and more provocative than a lot of the safe, easy, reassuring and decidedly middlebrow plays that have won the award over the last 20 years or so.
There is more going on in The Book of Mormon of substance than in some Pulitzer-winning musicals like Fiorello! or How to Succeed in Business, for all of their virtues. And I think Mormon is smarter and more provocative than a lot of the safe, easy, reassuring and decidedly middlebrow plays that have won the award over the last 20 years or so.
Begin at the beginning and go on till you come to the end: then stop.
Updated On: 11/7/11 at 08:32 AM
#37
Posted: 11/7/11 at 8:58am
I thought OTHER DESERT CITIES was a contender last Pulitzer year.
This year, I'd put my money on Richard Nelson's SWEET & SAD.
Wouldn't be surprised to see BY THE WAY, MEET VERA STARK as a finalist.
Are CHINGLISH, STICK FLY, THE MOUNTAINTOP, THE INTELLIGENT HOMOSEXUAL'S GUIDE blah blah blah... eligible? Or maybe something regional, like DETROIT?
GOOD PEOPLE, MOTHERF**KER WITH A HAT, 4000 MILES and SONS OF THE PROPHET were all good, but Pulitzer? Really? I'd definitely rather see a BOOK OF MORMON win.
If THE LYONS or WE LIVE HERE are finalists, I'll puke.
Wish they could give a retro Pulitzer to THE NORMAL HEART.
This year, I'd put my money on Richard Nelson's SWEET & SAD.
Wouldn't be surprised to see BY THE WAY, MEET VERA STARK as a finalist.
Are CHINGLISH, STICK FLY, THE MOUNTAINTOP, THE INTELLIGENT HOMOSEXUAL'S GUIDE blah blah blah... eligible? Or maybe something regional, like DETROIT?
GOOD PEOPLE, MOTHERF**KER WITH A HAT, 4000 MILES and SONS OF THE PROPHET were all good, but Pulitzer? Really? I'd definitely rather see a BOOK OF MORMON win.
If THE LYONS or WE LIVE HERE are finalists, I'll puke.
Wish they could give a retro Pulitzer to THE NORMAL HEART.
Updated On: 11/7/11 at 08:58 AM
#38
Posted: 11/7/11 at 9:03am
Detroit was a finalist last year.
Begin at the beginning and go on till you come to the end: then stop.
#39
Posted: 11/7/11 at 9:08am
How was Other Desert Cities a contender last year? It didn't officially open until January 2011.
"You travel alone because other people are only there to remind you how much that hook hurts that we all bit down on. Wait for that one day we can bite free and get back out there in space where we belong, sail back over water, over skies, into space, the hook finally out of our mouths and we wander back out there in space spawning to other planets never to return hurrah to earth and we'll look back and can't even see these lives here anymore. Only the taste of blood to remind us we ever existed. The earth is small. We're gone. We're dead. We're safe."
-John Guare, Landscape of the Body
#40
Posted: 11/7/11 at 9:13am
I thought that might be the case, Smaxie. And INTELLIGENT HOMOSEXUAL had an earlier production, I know. There seems to be a lot of that this year. Rules are that a play must have had its premiere during the 2011 calendar year. Hmmm...
Updated On: 11/7/11 at 09:13 AM
#41
Posted: 11/7/11 at 9:17am
You're correct, AC126748 — OTHER DESERT CITIES officially premiered in January, making it a 2011 contender. I happily stand corrected! :)
#42
Posted: 11/7/11 at 10:02am
I agree that Book of Mormon is much more profound that some give it credit. I find it to be a surprisingly deep discussion of religion, racism, charity, etc. And, it delivers this in the best way possible--by making people laugh.
#43
Posted: 11/7/11 at 12:02pm
I'd be fine with Mormon winning. I think it's a pretty creative send-up of traditional book musicals, with a lot of surprises and some serious heart.
#44
Posted: 11/7/11 at 12:12pm
Well said, Smaxie! I completely agree.
#45
Posted: 11/7/11 at 12:15pm
What bothered me most of about Book of Mormon was how it tried to be too neat at the end. It sort of made all of the points that it had going for it in the rest of the show a little too Disney-fied, like they didn't want you to go out of the theater feeling uncomfortable.
#46
Posted: 11/7/11 at 12:52pm
There is more going on in The Book of Mormon of substance than in some Pulitzer-winning musicals like Fiorello! or How to Succeed in Business, for all of their virtues. And I think Mormon is smarter and more provocative than a lot of the safe, easy, reassuring and decidedly middlebrow plays that have won the award over the last 20 years or so.
Are you the show's press rep, or something?
Are you the show's press rep, or something?
We serve their food,
We carve their meat,
We tend to their house,
We polish their
Silverware.
#47
Posted: 11/7/11 at 12:56pm
I read the ending as being ironic. I don't think Trey and Matt and Bobby were being serious that tomorrow will be a "bigger, better latter day."
I like your imperturbable perspicacity.
#48
Posted: 11/7/11 at 1:05pm
Are you the show's press rep, or something?
Does someone need to be involved with the show to write something smart and thoughtful about it?
Does someone need to be involved with the show to write something smart and thoughtful about it?
"You travel alone because other people are only there to remind you how much that hook hurts that we all bit down on. Wait for that one day we can bite free and get back out there in space where we belong, sail back over water, over skies, into space, the hook finally out of our mouths and we wander back out there in space spawning to other planets never to return hurrah to earth and we'll look back and can't even see these lives here anymore. Only the taste of blood to remind us we ever existed. The earth is small. We're gone. We're dead. We're safe."
-John Guare, Landscape of the Body
#49
Posted: 11/7/11 at 1:09pm
I think that my feeling on the ending had something to do with how quickly they wrapped up the General's plot. I thought that victory was a little too neat, which made the end seem to have the same tone.
#50
Posted: 11/7/11 at 2:41pm
My hope is that SONS OF THE PROPHET takes it. What a beautiful play... I enjoyed it so much on Saturday evening.
"I know now that theatre saved my life." - Susan Stroman
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