The Thread for HAMILTON Fans/Obsessives [SPOILERS AHEAD]- Page 9

[Glittergrrl]

Posted: 10/6/15 at 8:40pm

dramamama611 said: "The VERY first one?  That seems unfathomable

 

 

 

Glittergirl.....may I say I'm shocked?  (But grinning!)

 

"

I know! It took me a bit to warm up, but now I'm hooked.  I'm probably going to buy myself a ridiculously overpriced ticked before xmas as a gift to myself, so I can see it again.  

[Jace2017]

Posted: 10/6/15 at 10:00pm

Alysha Deslorieux was/is on as Eliza tonight! Anyone seeing it? 

[Showface]

Posted: 10/6/15 at 10:45pm

So, I really only listned to the ending of "Room Where it Happens", and a little bit of "My Shot", and I was already pretty hooked.

But, then I listened to "You'll Be Back", "Alexander Hamilton", "The Schuyler Sisters", "Satisfied",and a few other small songs, and I am completely amazed, and I am totally in awe of this score. I haven't even listened to the entire thing yet! 

I thought "Room Where it Happens" was going to be my favorite, but now "The Schuyler Sisters", "You'll Be Back", and "Alexander Hamilton" are tied with it!

 

I'm just so glad that LMM is looking to film this with this cast before the year is out, and perhaps it can be broadcast on PBS. I'll surely be catching this on tour!

 

The Tony race in the original musical categories is over, though... :)

[nicnyc]

Posted: 10/7/15 at 2:54am

Anyone see Alysha Deslorieux play Eliza in HAMILTON tonight?  Would love to hear about her performance...

[Pootie2]

Posted: 10/7/15 at 1:01pm

Just a random bit I ran across--I didn't know of any other appropriate place to mention it, so I figured "the Hamilton thread" would be fine: Lin Manuel Miranda and his family have become the profile picture of HONY. https://www.facebook.com/humansofnewyork

[promisespromises2]

Posted: 10/9/15 at 5:43pm

Does anyone know why the character of Benjamin Franklin isn't in Hamilton?  I was just thinking about history while listening to the cast recording and the only place he is really mentioned is in "Satisfied" when Angelica raps, "It's Ben Franklin with a key and a kite.  You see it, right?".

 

Now, I've been out of elementary school for quite some time, but didn't Benjamin Franklin have a MAJOR role as a Founding Father?

Or am I just completely missing something.

[nicnyc]

Posted: 10/9/15 at 6:17pm

If I remember correctly, Lin tweeted sometime around July that he had partially written one number for Ben Franklin but that they never found a place for it in the show.  He did say that he finished writing it so that it would be there in case some future production wanted it.

I have also been out of elementary school for quite some time but I believe Franklin had several missions to England and then was Ambassador to France during much of the events highlighted in Hamilton.  He was  delegate in the Second Continental Congress but contracted gout and did not participate other than making a couple key revisions to Jefferson's draft.  He is always considered MAJOR because he's the only Founding Father who is a signed the 4 most important founding American documents: Declaration of Independence, the Treaty of Alliance with France, the Treaty of Paris and the US Constitution - but I think the Hamilton-centered story certainly works without his inclusion.

 

[macnyc]

Posted: 10/9/15 at 6:20pm

Also, wasn't Franklin in Philadelphia during this time period?

[nicnyc]

Posted: 10/9/15 at 6:40pm

Macnyc, yes - I think you are correct. I should have realized that my memory is too poor - I was bound to forget something big...  Even when he was here, he was in PA not NY.  When he was the delegate, etc - he represented Pennsylvania, he was heavily entrenched in PA for most of his life - but he was in England & France during a chunk of the Hamilton time too.

[promisespromises2]

Posted: 10/9/15 at 6:59pm

You guys are awesome, thanks for answering!  I know if the many sociological contributions that he has made (Social Work major here), I just didn't realize he was geographically all over the place. 

[NJ_BroadwayGirl]

Posted: 10/9/15 at 8:30pm

I also see Hamilton as viewing the Revolutionary War (and aftermath to an extent) through young men's eyes.  Ben Franklin was 50 years older than Hamilton or Burr and 40 years older than Jefferson. I think it's perfectly fine without him and it might feel forced if he showed up.

[VintageSnarker]

Posted: 10/9/15 at 11:50pm

This is a bit random but I was at the NY Historical Society for the Al Hirschfeld exhibit and noticed a small area focused on Alexander Hamilton off to the side. It mentions the musical (just in passing) and features a letter he wrote to Eliza. On the opposite side of the room mixed with the other assorted pieces are replicated dueling pistols and a death mask of Burr.

 

I just thought I'd mention it for the real obsessives.

[GroupAGroup1]

Posted: 10/10/15 at 12:27am

Been listening to the cast album repeatedly, and maybe someone can explain something to me:

"Wait For It" is a really frustrating song because, to me, it isn't saying anything.

It seems to be a song about Burr's inability to see a master plan in life ("And if there's a reason / I'm still alive / When so many have died..." "And if there's a reason / He seems to thrive / When so few survive...") - but he's going to FIND OUT that master plan and use it to his perfect advantage, because otherwise, you're just flying in the face of a dark, dark world that "doesn't discriminate / Between the sinners and the saints." In other words, before you make your move, you gotta know what it's for.

But the climactic line in each chorus doesn't parse. "And if there's a reason / I'm by her side / When so many have tried / Then I'm willing to wait for it..." Just saying that you're "willing to wait" for a grand reason is such a passive, bland, inactive way to end that thought, you honestly don't understand what he's talking about.

The song is curiously uncentered; the language (even throughout most of the song) is so unspecific that it seems to keep circling around a point without ever making one. Yes, "wait for it" is used as an effective leitmotif throughout the rest of the show - but in the actual character-defining song, it doesn't seem to say anything.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 10/10/15 at 12:43am

Did you miss the part where he says he's not standing still, he's lying in wait?

[GroupAGroup1]

Posted: 10/10/15 at 12:51am

EDIT:

 

You know what, my mistake, I actually did miss the "I'm lying in wait" line - and yes, it's important, but given its importance, it should be given more than a single line that's somewhat buried by the orchestra.

 

The whole song feels discursive in that way: ideas show up, and then disappear in the next line/set of lines, like Lin-Manuel threw a lot of things in and then didn't shape them.

Updated On: 10/10/15 at 12:51 AM

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 10/10/15 at 1:00am

Well, it's the whole key to the song and his action for the rest of the play.  He's telling you the passive voice you are criticizing should not be confused with passivity, but rather strategic planning.

[GroupAGroup1]

Posted: 10/10/15 at 1:08am

If that's the case, then it's bad songcraft: why should the key part of your song be reduced to the second half of one line in a bridge that's loud enough that an audience might not hear it?

 

And the line in the chorus is "passive" mainly in terms of language. It's not a strong end to the sentence, and it doesn't fit what he's leading up to in terms of emotion. It's a little like saying, "I swear, if you come anywhere near her again, you'll be unhappy."

Updated On: 10/10/15 at 01:08 AM

[HogansHero]

Posted: 10/10/15 at 1:12am

Group--have you looked at the genius.com annotations on the song? 

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 10/10/15 at 1:14am

Hamilton is a show that obviously rewards multiple listenings and probably viewings.  It's no great crime against the craft if you are still discovering things, or having them pointed out to you, after your first listen.  Plus, the "I'm not standing still..." line is the climax of the tension in the song.  It's sounds like you've been so focussed on everything that came before it that you just have ignored the build to that line.

 

Everything the character does in the show from that point on is waiting for a strategic time to take action.

[GroupAGroup1]

Posted: 10/10/15 at 1:16am

HogansHero -- Yeah, been enjoying those for the last few days :) Admittedly I haven't looked deep into the "a deeper look at history" parts of that page, but I haven't found anything too enlightening.

[NJ_BroadwayGirl]

Posted: 10/10/15 at 8:52am

Wait For It is really important to moving along the plotline of the show. It's the - hey audience, in case you haven't figured it out by now - Hamilton will do anything to get ahead and Burr is going to be frustrated by that for years. Musically it's beautifully layered and powerful and I don't find it confusing at all.
 

I don't find the song to be uncentered. He comes back to the "if I'm still here there must be a reason" sentiment each verse. Burr is worried that he hasn't accomplished anything but reminds himself that if he got the girl, he's still alive despite his parents and friends dying, then there must be damn good reason for his existence and he knows it will come. We've seen already that his character is more passive in terms of being afraid to speak out boldly.

Also, "I'm not standing still I am lying in wait" is not hidden in this song. It's a very climactic segment There's a build up to it with the previous lines in a pattern of Burr speaking and chorus response:
"I am the one thing in life I can control" 
"I  am inimitable I am an original"
"I’m not falling behind or running late"
"I’m not standing still I am lying in wait"

 

I think Burr believes he will behave like Hamilton when he finds reason to - when he figures out his passion he will go after it with all his heart and soul because it's been waiting for him. Hamilton goes after everything hard and seems to make his own rules but Burr is going to wait for the right thing.

[Kad]

Posted: 10/10/15 at 9:19am

The whole song is steeped in dramatic irony, anyway- the only time in the show Burr acts decisively, rather than opportunistically, is challenging Hamilton to the duel. And that event is ultimately the thing Burr is now remembered for- and arguably more important than being the third Vice President in a time in which the office was extremely weak and under a president who actively stifled him.

Updated On: 10/10/15 at 09:19 AM

[karen24]

Posted: 10/10/15 at 11:03am

VintageSnarker, thanks for that heads-up about the Hamilton-related stuff at the N-Y HS. I'd actually been wondering if they had anything on display right now. I'll have to look for it next time I'm there; I love that museum.

They had a Hamilton exhibit back in 2004/2005 and there are still some interactive things on their Web site which are quite interesting, including some information about the pistols. Somehow the originals wound up with JP Morgan Chase and I believe they're on display somewhere in their offices, but not for the general public (I think they were loaned to the 2004 exhibit.)

 

http://www.alexanderhamiltonexhibition.org

[asdl;fkahs]

Posted: 10/10/15 at 10:14pm

I'm hoping to do the lottery for tomorrow's second show--does anyone know whether Lin-Manuel will be in the 7:30 show? I know he doesn't do Sunday matinees, but I don't know what the policy is for a weird two-show Sunday like tomorrow. 

[ChiTheaterFan]

Posted: 10/10/15 at 10:57pm

Lin does evening shows. Direct from the horse's tweet:  https://twitter.com/lin_manuel/status/652995442838474752