Sondheim vs. Porgy & Bess - YIKES!- Page 3

[SonofRobbieJ]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 3:46pm

The only response Paulus, Parks and MacDonald should give is the show. If it works, it works. If not...then that's that.

[ljay889]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 3:46pm

Did Sondheim have these issues with Trevor Nunn's horrific production of A LITTLE NIGHT MUSIC, the one that was set in a deserted mortuary and had all the life and fun and energy of a funeral?

That argument is completely unqualified. The NIGHT MUSIC revival used Sondheim's complete score and Wheeler's complete book.

[AC126748]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 3:51pm

And it's worth noting that Sondheim is not trashing the production itself--at least not yet. He is responding critically to statements made by Ms. Paulus, Ms. Parks, and Ms. McDonald--most of which were regrettable, to put it mildly.

This is my favorite passage:

Then there is Ms. Paulus’s condescension toward the audience. She says, “I’m sorry, but to ask an audience these days to invest three hours in a show requires your heroine be an understandable and fully rounded character.” I don’t know what she’s sorry about, but I’m glad she can speak for all of us restless theatergoers. If she doesn’t understand Bess and feels she has to “excavate” the show, she clearly thinks it’s a ruin, so why is she doing it? I’m sorry, but could the problem be her lack of understanding, not Heyward’s?

It just goes to show the contempt that certain "directors" have for their audiences, and elucidates the fact that they know nothing about the material they are directing to begin with.

Updated On: 8/10/11 at 03:51 PM

[Roscoe]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 3:55pm

"That argument is completely unqualified. The NIGHT MUSIC revival used Sondheim's complete score and Wheeler's complete book."

Doesn't answer the question, though. Did Sondheim have these issues with Nunn's appalling travesty of a revival?

[AC126748]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 3:57pm

Appalling travesty, in your opinion. I fixed that for you.

[Roscoe]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:00pm

Yeah, right, in my opinion, whatever.

Still doesn't answer the question.

[leefowler]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:02pm

I think one of the things that irks Mr. Sondheim is that the title, "The Gershwin's Porgy And Bess", gives too much credit to Ira Gershwin. Almost all the book and lyrics to Porgy And Bess are by DuBose Heyward, and Sondheim has criticized Ira Gershwin's lyrics in the past.

Here's a quote from Sondheim, written about Heyward:

DuBose Heyward has gone largely unrecognized as the author of the finest set of lyrics in the history of the American musical theater - namely, those of Porgy and Bess. There are two reasons for this, and they are connected. First, he was primarily a poet and novelist, and his only song lyrics were those that he wrote for Porgy. Second, some of them were written in collaboration with Ira Gershwin, a full-time lyricist, whose reputation in the musical theater was firmly established before the opera was written. But most of the lyrics in Porgy - and all of the distinguished ones - are by Heyward. I admire his theater songs for their deeply felt poetic style and their insight into character. It's a pity he didn't write any others. His work is sung, but he is unsung.

[ljay889]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:02pm

Did Sondheim have these issues with Nunn's appalling travesty of a revival?

Still unqualified. Sondheim's issues with the Porgy & Bess revival are the rewrites. The NIGHT MUSIC revival wasn't rewritten. Given that he approved the transfer of the production, he obviously didn't have any major issues with it that were not solved during previews (lighting, etc).
Updated On: 8/10/11 at 04:02 PM

[allofmylife]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:03pm

While I, like most on this site, worship at the alter of Stephen Sondheim, I would point out the literally dozens of shows that have been huge, acclaimed hits on Broadway with a totally new book, including long running shows such as "Crazy for You" (and all Gewshwin music to boot!) and "Me and My Girl."

Let's see what it looks like before we call it ugly.

However, if they alter ONE NOTE OF THE SCORE.....)

[Roscoe]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:06pm

Not sure I see how it is unqualified. I can certainly see Trevor Nunn's attitude in making A LITTLE NIGHT MUSIC into a funereal exercise in GLOOM as being similar to Paulus' perceived attitude towards PORGY AND BESS.

[PalJoey]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:08pm

The issue here is not directorial visions/revisions. That's an entirely different discussion. An interesting one, but not this one.

The issue here is rewriting copyrighted works.

As upset as Paulus, Parks and MacDonald must be, I bet the Gershwin estate is SH*Tting bricks.

And I don't think this is an animus on the part of Sondheim for Ira Gershwin. I think Ira Gershwin himself corrected people when they diminished DuBose Heyward's contributions.

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:09pm

At this point, I sort of want them to alter the score a bit just to watch the pandemonium that will ensue. Hell, they should add a nightmare ballet in Boston and then cut it for Broadway. That'll REALLY get some blood boiling.

[ReggieonBway]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:09pm

Frankly, the new title is much more accessible than the old. Sondheim, brilliant though he may be, underestimates just how little the audience on mass knows about Porgy & Bess. The name "Gershwin" carries weight and will thus make money - the name "Porgy & Bess" inspires very little recognition outside of the theatre community.

I'm still excited for the production.

[The Distinctive Baritone]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:10pm

DAMN. If my idol ever wrote a letter lIke that about me to the NYT I'd be bedridden. Thankfully, the ladies he called to task probably have enough self-confidence to handle it.

That said, while I think rewriting a classic show is a bit heretical, sometimes it actually is an improvement, i.e. Cabaret.

[AC126748]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:10pm

Roscoe, the question is unqualified because unless Sondheim feels the exact same way that you do about that production, then your line of reasoning is faulty and meritless.

[jv92]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:11pm

Re: Sondheim and Ira Gershwin

I don't have my copy in front of me, but in FINISHING THE HAT, didn't Sondheim say Ira Gerhswin's lyrics were "earthy and friendly" and that his LYRICS ON SEVERAL OCCASIONS was a good book. I think his criticism was fairly mild compared to the flogging that Alan Jay Lerner got.

And yes, I think PJ is right. Ira often pointed out that there were three authors of PORGY-- the brothers and Heyward.

[Roscoe]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:11pm

Ultimately, if the Gershwin estate has a problem with it, they can put a stop to the production. Did they not know what was going on?

[SeanMartin]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:14pm

IMHO, here's the unstated message from the director and company:

It's not black enough.

Let's put that on the table instead of dancing around it. It's pretty obvious this is what's really going on, and I have little doubt this is what the director means when she says characters like Bess arent "well rounded".

JUST MY OPINION. But I think it's a pretty safe one.

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:15pm

I'm sure the Gershwin estate knew precisely what was going on. They just forgot to ask Sondheim how he felt about it.

[Kad]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:15pm

When I see the phrase "the ____ estate", I imagine a vast mansion in the country full of monocled men and high-collared women receiving letters about productions across the country and doing spit-takes at whatever they contain.

[tazber]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:15pm

Their goal is apparently to turn a classic into "fast food theater". Easily digestible and no thought required.


I'm totally cool with that. It's their staging. It's not necessarily the production I would want to see, but I don't think all the pearl clutching is warranted.

As someone said earlier (Sean maybe?) Porgy And Bess will be here long after this production is gone.

[Roscoe]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:19pm

"Roscoe, the question is unqualified because unless Sondheim feels the exact same way that you do about that production, then your line of reasoning is faulty and meritless."

AC, the question is unqualified in your opinion. I fixed that for you.

[Owen22]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:20pm

Frankly, I'm just happy someone is bringing up the raping of dead musical theatre writers' books for musicals.

[tazber]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:25pm

Haha! Me too, Kad!

[best12bars]

Posted: 8/10/11 at 4:26pm

I kinda see Roscoe's side of this, but using a different example ...

For A Little Night Music, Trevor Nunn didn't come out and say, "I can fix everything that's wrong with this piece," and then start attacking the original design, the size of the orchestra, the earlier version of The Glamorous Life, the staging of the dinner scene, and say "these were all terrible, and I can make them better."

If he had, Sondheim would have taken issue with his arrogance, right?

Not necessarily, and this is where I see that Roscoe's point about having a bit of a double standard is accurate, as far as Sondheim is concerned.

With the film adaptation of Sweeney Todd, not only did they change many things, which Sondheim supported and approved, "because it's a different medium and it must be adapted for that medium," BUT ... Tim Burton went so far as to say in interviews (watch the DVD if you doubt me) that he never cared for choral singing, so he cut all of it. Crowds of people shouldn't sing together, because it's not natural. He began to name other things that he wanted to "fix" in the story ... and Sondheim didn't object strongly and publicly to the director's arrogance then, did he? Nope. He was congenial instead and played "nice."

That's' a double standard.