#51
Posted: 6/10/11 at 10:32pm
SaDM2, I agree with that point of view, too.
This one is complicated for me.
This one is complicated for me.
"Why I No Longer 'LIKE' Tracy Morgan" — Page 3
#52
Posted: 6/10/11 at 10:35pm
It's not complicated for me. If a comedian got up on the stage one night and did twenty minutes on how he planned to assassinate the president he'd be detained by the secret service and there would be real consequences to that.
You can't be a comedian or public figure and spew hate and use the excuse that you were just joking. And if you ARE joking and that is your idea of humor you need to be prepared to accept what comes along with that point of view.
You can't be a comedian or public figure and spew hate and use the excuse that you were just joking. And if you ARE joking and that is your idea of humor you need to be prepared to accept what comes along with that point of view.
#53
Posted: 6/10/11 at 10:35pm
I agree that it's good- and needed- that comedians test boundaries. There are a number of them who continually do- and have a greater message in doing so or reveal things about society through irony or other comedic devices. But what was Morgan trying to say with his act? The reports suggest that it was scarcely a joke.
I don't really understand how Morgan managed to grasp hold of a career this long. His stuff on 30 Rock is truly only funny because of the writing itself, and he's easily the least interesting character.
I'll continue to watch 30 Rock- I see no reason to pull my support for a program that employs so many other talented people who are openly supportive of the LGBT community.
I don't really understand how Morgan managed to grasp hold of a career this long. His stuff on 30 Rock is truly only funny because of the writing itself, and he's easily the least interesting character.
I'll continue to watch 30 Rock- I see no reason to pull my support for a program that employs so many other talented people who are openly supportive of the LGBT community.
"...everyone finally shut up, and the audience could enjoy the beginning of the Anatevka Pogram in peace."
#54
Posted: 6/10/11 at 10:37pm
"So I guess my bottom line is: I want comedians to test the boundaries; I want them to shock; I want them to be unafraid . . ."
I guess i just missed the point where stabbing gay kids and telling gay kids to shut up moaning about getting bullied is meant to be funny.
I guess i just missed the point where stabbing gay kids and telling gay kids to shut up moaning about getting bullied is meant to be funny.
Namo i love u but we get it already....you don't like Madonna
#55
Posted: 6/10/11 at 10:40pm
I agree. I really do. I guess I'm trying to work out to what extent I object because it relates to me, and to what extent it's simply objectionable.
But as I said: My initial reaction was 100 percent "That's no okay." But now I'm examining my response to the apology. Is it enough? Do I think there's a darker, unresolved thing there that I still need to protest?
And I don't know.
But as I said: My initial reaction was 100 percent "That's no okay." But now I'm examining my response to the apology. Is it enough? Do I think there's a darker, unresolved thing there that I still need to protest?
And I don't know.
#56
Posted: 6/10/11 at 10:40pm
Comedians should test boundaries. With jokes.
#57
Posted: 6/10/11 at 10:44pm
And, bottom line, jokes should be funny. At the end of the day, that's the ultimate test.
#58
Posted: 6/10/11 at 10:47pm
I fully realize that a "joke" is a subjective term. It's like pornography, I know it when I see (or hear) it. But hate speech and talking about stabbing your children is not a joke. I can't fathom people arguing that it is.
#59
Posted: 6/10/11 at 10:52pm
You're right, Jordan. And as I hope I made clear, I'm not arguing that. I was offended too.
I guess the situation is making me explore, in my own mind, the larger issue of comedic license. But I don't actually have any worked-out thoughts to contribute to that discussion, so I think I'm done.
I'm glad the issue came up so publicly, and I'm glad he apologized.
I guess the situation is making me explore, in my own mind, the larger issue of comedic license. But I don't actually have any worked-out thoughts to contribute to that discussion, so I think I'm done.
I'm glad the issue came up so publicly, and I'm glad he apologized.
#60
Posted: 6/10/11 at 10:57pm
I'm... glad he apologized, yes. But I can't help be bothered by how obviously generated by an agent or press person it is. Fey seemed more bothered by his remarks than he did. But I guess that makes sense.
"...everyone finally shut up, and the audience could enjoy the beginning of the Anatevka Pogram in peace."
#61
Posted: 6/10/11 at 10:59pm
He apologized. Take it as you will. Why do people think they deserve anything else from him or anyone else that makes a public apology. Forced follow-up actions are simply pointless. If one doesn't think something was enough, then let your voice be louder on its own and not dependent on the perpetrator.
"Hey little girls, look at all the men in shiny shirts and no wives!" - Jackie Hoffman, Xanadu, 19 Feb 2008
"Hey little girls, look at all the men in shiny shirts and no wives!" - Jackie Hoffman, Xanadu, 19 Feb 2008
#63
Posted: 6/11/11 at 1:07am
Neither rant is acceptable, and if your point is that the gay person would be attacked more than Morgan, I don't think that's necessarily true.
Ask Michael Richards about that, and I know he's not gay, but the point is that it's completely (and justifiably) unacceptable for a comedian to make race jokes during his routine. With the exception of a couple of gigs for his old pal Larry David, Richards hasn't worked at all since that rant. Yet, we're being told to accept Morgan's apology and just move on. What's the difference?
Ask Michael Richards about that, and I know he's not gay, but the point is that it's completely (and justifiably) unacceptable for a comedian to make race jokes during his routine. With the exception of a couple of gigs for his old pal Larry David, Richards hasn't worked at all since that rant. Yet, we're being told to accept Morgan's apology and just move on. What's the difference?
#64
Posted: 6/11/11 at 6:25am
it's completely (and justifiably) unacceptable for a comedian to make race jokes during his routine.
That's not really true. Michael went off and lost it shouting the N word over and over. That's not making a race joke. Watch Mo'nique on The Queens of Comedy and count how many times she makes fun of white people. Race jokes are par for the course and generally accepted as funny to a point. Gay jokes are the same way. I think there is a personal limit to what people can take, but generally, it's accepted. When it crosses from humor to hate, that's when things change.
There are comedians who have audiences who LOVE when they use the N word or throw around f*g or d*ke. Like this time with Tracy, it's when someone who doesn't love it experiences it that it gets public attention. How long do you think Tracy was telling these same jokes and spewing such hate before one of his audience members had the balls to speak about it? The writer said several people walked out of his show, but I haven't read their accounts of why.
That's not really true. Michael went off and lost it shouting the N word over and over. That's not making a race joke. Watch Mo'nique on The Queens of Comedy and count how many times she makes fun of white people. Race jokes are par for the course and generally accepted as funny to a point. Gay jokes are the same way. I think there is a personal limit to what people can take, but generally, it's accepted. When it crosses from humor to hate, that's when things change.
There are comedians who have audiences who LOVE when they use the N word or throw around f*g or d*ke. Like this time with Tracy, it's when someone who doesn't love it experiences it that it gets public attention. How long do you think Tracy was telling these same jokes and spewing such hate before one of his audience members had the balls to speak about it? The writer said several people walked out of his show, but I haven't read their accounts of why.
Pretty pretty please don't you ever ever feel like you're less than f**ckin' perfect!
Updated On: 6/11/11 at 06:25 AM
#65
Posted: 6/11/11 at 7:37am
With the exception of a couple of gigs for his old pal Larry David, Richards hasn't worked at all since that rant. Yet, we're being told to accept Morgan's apology and just move on. What's the difference?
Richards was a has-been at the time he made his rant, and Morgan is currently on a critically-acclaimed, popular television show. That's the difference. If Morgan was just some guy who was on Saturday Night Live a decade ago he'd be persona non grata too.
Richards was a has-been at the time he made his rant, and Morgan is currently on a critically-acclaimed, popular television show. That's the difference. If Morgan was just some guy who was on Saturday Night Live a decade ago he'd be persona non grata too.
"You travel alone because other people are only there to remind you how much that hook hurts that we all bit down on. Wait for that one day we can bite free and get back out there in space where we belong, sail back over water, over skies, into space, the hook finally out of our mouths and we wander back out there in space spawning to other planets never to return hurrah to earth and we'll look back and can't even see these lives here anymore. Only the taste of blood to remind us we ever existed. The earth is small. We're gone. We're dead. We're safe."
-John Guare, Landscape of the Body
#66
Posted: 6/11/11 at 10:07am
#67
Posted: 6/11/11 at 11:05am
Absolutely horrific. The press release was just bland and totally did not rectify the damage that was done by his disgusting comments. Thoroughly disappointed in him...
Updated On: 6/11/11 at 11:05 AM
#68
Posted: 6/11/11 at 11:06am
I don't know about Chris Rock, but I'd sure love to live in a world where the guy headlining a new Broadway play knows how to act.
#69
Posted: 6/11/11 at 11:16am
Oh Chris just stop already. How long before Tony Perkins comes out defending Tracy? Bryan Fischer? I am sad that this is not getting even more attention than it is. He apologized and the message to the GLBT community is basically,"get over it!"
Michael Richards has really not worked since his racist rant(excluding his brief stint on Curb Your Enthusiasm) I am glad Tina Fey spoke out and NBC but I was hoping it would have been more forceful. Two weak responses to something so ugly and Alec Baldwin's response being,"Oh Tracy", really disturbs me. I am not sure if I will even watch 30 Rock next season. Love the show but I can't look at this guy anymore without thinking what a homophobe he is. I see the cast working with him and I assume they are okay with it as well.
So what do we now? Contact NBC's advertisers? Get a Facebook page going and petition for NBC to fire Tracy? They fired Charlie Sheen so why not Tracy? What's next? Perhaps we just go back into the corner and forget about this come September when the new season starts.
I assure you,if Tracy does not have to do anything else after all this a new trend will follow. Comedians will say hateful things like this and the routine will begin. Hell, when they write their jokes they will write out an apology beforehand in case they are criticized. Why nothing happened back in 2009 when this occurred is a mystery. I don't recall hearing about it then(I would have thought I would have remembered and acted on such a slur)SO the fact that he did it again shows that did not see anything wrong with what he said until he was criticized and probably saw the $$$ he could lose if he did not apologize.
Tracy Morgan is insincere and releasing an apology through his publicist is not enough. He was not even man enough to go on some talk shows and make his apology in public. What a F*&%#@ coward!
I'm disappointed in Tina's and NBC's weak response. I hope the gay community turns up the heat. AT this point I want to see him fired from 30 Rock.
Michael Richards has really not worked since his racist rant(excluding his brief stint on Curb Your Enthusiasm) I am glad Tina Fey spoke out and NBC but I was hoping it would have been more forceful. Two weak responses to something so ugly and Alec Baldwin's response being,"Oh Tracy", really disturbs me. I am not sure if I will even watch 30 Rock next season. Love the show but I can't look at this guy anymore without thinking what a homophobe he is. I see the cast working with him and I assume they are okay with it as well.
So what do we now? Contact NBC's advertisers? Get a Facebook page going and petition for NBC to fire Tracy? They fired Charlie Sheen so why not Tracy? What's next? Perhaps we just go back into the corner and forget about this come September when the new season starts.
I assure you,if Tracy does not have to do anything else after all this a new trend will follow. Comedians will say hateful things like this and the routine will begin. Hell, when they write their jokes they will write out an apology beforehand in case they are criticized. Why nothing happened back in 2009 when this occurred is a mystery. I don't recall hearing about it then(I would have thought I would have remembered and acted on such a slur)SO the fact that he did it again shows that did not see anything wrong with what he said until he was criticized and probably saw the $$$ he could lose if he did not apologize.
Tracy Morgan is insincere and releasing an apology through his publicist is not enough. He was not even man enough to go on some talk shows and make his apology in public. What a F*&%#@ coward!
I'm disappointed in Tina's and NBC's weak response. I hope the gay community turns up the heat. AT this point I want to see him fired from 30 Rock.
'There are three sides to every story. My side, your side, and the truth. And no one is lying. Memories shared serve each one differently'
-Robert Evans-
#70
Posted: 6/11/11 at 11:30am
In this case, I have to agree with you. Normally I wouldn't say that someone being fired is a good idea but as a community at this point in time we can not and should not have to deal with hate speech and the advocating of violence against us coming from high profile entertainers who hide behind calling it "entertainment". There is free speech In this country and I am all for it but like everything, there needs to come a point where there is such a thing as "too far". I don't see any difference between what he's been saying and what those freaks at Westboro say every day. Hate is hate and it needs to be addressed accordingly and not by a tweet or a statement from a publicist.
#71
Posted: 6/11/11 at 11:33am
I don't think Tina Fey's response was weak at all. I thought it was spot on.
#72
Posted: 6/11/11 at 11:35am
I did as well. In my post I was referring to Jordans and Baldwins responses.
#73
Posted: 6/11/11 at 11:46am
I kind of feel like the 30 Rock folks don't much "LIKE" Tracy Morgan, either as much as they "TOLERATE" him. Baldwin's tweet could easily be taken as a passive-aggressive eyeroll and Tina Fey's comment..."Oh, he's too much of a tired, self-centered douche to do something as gauche as hate an entire group of people". Well!
"Impossible is just a big word thrown around by small men who find it easier to live in the world they've been given than to explore the power they have to change it. Impossible is not a fact. It's an opinion. Impossible is not a declaration. It's a dare. Impossible is potential. Impossible is temporary. Impossible is nothing.”
~ Muhammad Ali
#74
Posted: 6/11/11 at 11:49am
I felt Tina's response was to safe. I wish she had condemned him as a person more. Telling us this is not the Tracy she knows is great and all but he in deed did say what he said.She should have called on him to do more. For God sake, he said he would KILL HIS SON IF HE WERE GAY! STAB THE N-----! Tina, you need to be forceful!!!
Praise him for apologizing but remind him he needs to do more to make things right.She and Alec are the writer and executive producer. They should be more concerned and their response tells me they are not that worried about this. I feel they think this will all blow over by fall. I'll say it again. He should be fired.Tracy did not even respond until the story made the news. If he released a statement the next day before it got out that night be one thing. However, Tracy has said this before. This is how he feels.So, it's foolish to think his apology is sincere. He is trying to save his job at this point. He could care less. Tina should tell him to get out there,go on the talk shows,apologize,do something more or your fired.Truth is,Tracy makes the network and the show too much $$$ so they have to publicly condemn him.
If Michael Richards said what he said when Seinfeld was still on what would have happened?
Praise him for apologizing but remind him he needs to do more to make things right.She and Alec are the writer and executive producer. They should be more concerned and their response tells me they are not that worried about this. I feel they think this will all blow over by fall. I'll say it again. He should be fired.Tracy did not even respond until the story made the news. If he released a statement the next day before it got out that night be one thing. However, Tracy has said this before. This is how he feels.So, it's foolish to think his apology is sincere. He is trying to save his job at this point. He could care less. Tina should tell him to get out there,go on the talk shows,apologize,do something more or your fired.Truth is,Tracy makes the network and the show too much $$$ so they have to publicly condemn him.
If Michael Richards said what he said when Seinfeld was still on what would have happened?
'There are three sides to every story. My side, your side, and the truth. And no one is lying. Memories shared serve each one differently'
-Robert Evans-
Updated On: 6/11/11 at 11:49 AM
#75
Posted: 6/11/11 at 12:00pm
I think Tina Fey's response was perfect because it was so very Tina Fey. She managed to keep her humor while making a strong statement of support for the GLBT community. Plus, her veiled threat about his job security regarding all the gay people Moran works with was kinda genius.
I'm guessing Alec Baldwin my feel he doesn't really have a leg to stand on when criticizing someone who said gross things that have found their way to the public sphere.
Morgan can say whatever he wants. He's well within his rights to say these things publicly and privately. And I generally support any comedian's right to work as broadly and edgily (is that a word??) as possible. Chris Rock actually does a brilliant piece of standup based on the word 'Faggot'. I would never, ever want to restrict what words a comedian can use. But how they use them? The First Amendment only means the government can't do anything to suppress his speech. But we have every right to protest his work and use our power (our voices, our money) to make clear that this is unacceptable.
I'm guessing Alec Baldwin my feel he doesn't really have a leg to stand on when criticizing someone who said gross things that have found their way to the public sphere.
Morgan can say whatever he wants. He's well within his rights to say these things publicly and privately. And I generally support any comedian's right to work as broadly and edgily (is that a word??) as possible. Chris Rock actually does a brilliant piece of standup based on the word 'Faggot'. I would never, ever want to restrict what words a comedian can use. But how they use them? The First Amendment only means the government can't do anything to suppress his speech. But we have every right to protest his work and use our power (our voices, our money) to make clear that this is unacceptable.
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