Actors with alternates who won Tonys

[givesmevoice]

Posted: 3/4/13 at 11:20pm

A friend and I are discussing whether the Matildas will be nominated/win for Tonys this season, since the Billy boys' win was a little controversial. I'm personally torn on the issue, but we got to talking about actors who technically shared a role with an alternate but still won.

So, when Patti LuPone won her Tony for Evita, was there controversy over the fact that she only did six shows a week? What about Daisy Eagan or Lea Salonga? (although Lea Salonga did seven shows a week)

[jetts7]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 12:01am

I know that put of the two original Michael's in Billy Elliot, only one of them was nominated which I found weird because they both did 4 shows a week.

[perfectlymarvelous]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 12:03am

I think that happened because David Bologna was Michael on opening night and the producers didn't petition for the two boys to be considered for the Tony together. If I remember correctly, they had to petition the Tony committee to nominate all three Billy boys together, since obviously all three of them didn't perform on opening night.

[RippedMan]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 12:10am

I'm gonna guess that the only Matilda nominated will be the one they brought from London. She performed on the first preview, and probably will be on for opening.

[WiCkEDrOcKS]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 12:27am

^ I highly doubt that. I'm sure the producers will petition all four, just as they did in London for the Oliviers and just as the aforementioned BILLY team did.

[dramamama611]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 12:31am

They will definitley petition for the girls to be nominated together.


And while I understand it for children's roles, I think its ridiculous. When you nominate them all (or both) you are really asking the ROLE to be considered, not the actor/performance.

[CATSNYrevival]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 12:36am

^Agreed. Plus, last time with Billy Elliot, the voters were not required to see all 3 Billys. Clearly, the award was just for the role.

Updated On: 3/5/13 at 12:36 AM

[AEA AGMA SM]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 12:37am

"I'm gonna guess that the only Matilda nominated will be the one they brought from London. She performed on the first preview, and probably will be on for opening."

None of the four girls were brought over from London. The girl who went on tonight, Oona Lawrence, is a New York native according to her bio on the show's website.

[HeyMrMusic]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 12:51am

To defend the Tony committee for a second, they saw each of the Billys and deemed each performance equal in quality, and therefore this would be considered a single performance played by three actors. I mean, yes, it's not a totally strong argument, but that's why it went down that way. It's not nominating the role...exactly.

Lest we forget that Alice Ripley and Emily Skinner shared a nomination for playing two different characters in a musical where said characters spend the whole show trying to be individuals.

[perfectlymarvelous]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 12:55am

I think Alice and Emily being nominated together is completely different than the Billy boys/the Matilda girls being nominated together. I believe the argument for Alice and Emily was that their performances were, essentially, a unit: you couldn't have one without the other, and obviously they were onstage together the whole time. That was a unique situation, and it's different than nominating multiple children for a large role that they share.

I think it will be interesting to see how the situation with the Matilda girls plays out...I definitely think they'll be nominated but I'm not sure they'll win after the backlash from the Billy boys winning.

[givesmevoice]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 12:56am

But Alice Ripley and Emily Skinner weren't sharing their role with someone. Wasn't the argument that they couldn't give their individual performances without the other?

Also the Von Trapp children were all nominated for Best Featured Actress for the original Sound of Music.

[IdinaBellFoster]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 12:58am

^ What an awkward resume moment for the Von Trapp boys later in life.

[HeyMrMusic]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 2:21am

Michael Mulheren and Lee Wilkof were never separated in Kiss Me, Kate and yet were nominated separately at the Tonys.

And Alice Ripley was able to perform the role when Lauren Kennedy stepped in for Emily Skinner multiple times.

I know every situation is different, but let's be real, Daisy and Violet are two separate characters. If Alice and Emily were a unit, then the Billy boys were a unit who just happened to not perform at the same time. (Which, I know, is the point of the this thread, nominees with alternates, so I'm sorry for my threadjack.)

[Leadingplayer]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 3:24am

"So, when Patti LuPone won her Tony for Evita, was there controversy over the fact that she only did six shows a week? What about Daisy Eagan or Lea Salonga? (although Lea Salonga did seven shows a week)"


Not really because they did most of the performances and were clearly advertised as the main star. (although Terri Klausner--Patti's original alternate...felt otherwise)

Updated On: 3/5/13 at 03:24 AM

[The Distinctive Baritone]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 8:10am

Theater awards are stupid. That said, if I ever get nominated for a Tony, I'll be pissed if I have to share the nomination with someone, lol. It's like being a Tony nominee with an asterix.

[After Eight]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 8:26am

Barbara Harris (The Apple Tree), Uta Hagen (Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf) had alternates for matinees.

[HeyMrMusic]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 8:30am

Many in design/creative categories share a nomination with one or more. A Tony is a Tony and a nomination is a nomination no matter whom you share it with. Tell me you wouldn't be ecstatic to be nominated/win if you had to share it.

[AC126748]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 8:46am

Ripley was nominated for the Drama Desk for SIDE SHOW and Skinner wasn't. The real reason the producers petitioned so heavily for them to be nominated together was that they feared Skinner wouldn't be nominated due to missing so many performances.

[jnb9872]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 9:08am

Let's not forget that the two lead actors from SIZWE BANZI IS DEAD, John Kani and Winston Ntshona, not only were nominated but won a shared Tony for their performances.

There's a history for it, I think individual instances are individually valid (or not), but it's a pretty interesting legacy the Tony's have.

[trentsketch]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 9:29am

Daisy and Violet are distinct characters, but they physically cannot exist in the play without each other. That's the crux of the argument. How effective would Ripley/Skinner's performance have been if Skinner/Ripley wasn't pressed up against her, literally supporting her, throughout the entire show? The characters are two distinct people sharing one physical body at all times onstage. Can you really say one deserves the award more than the other?

And discounting Skinner's performance because her understudy went on a lot doesn't change the argument. Her understudy didn't do opening night and the producers didn't petition the understudy to be nominated instead because of Skinner's absences. The Drama Desk was most likely an anomaly caused by Skinner's illness. Had she physically performed the part enough, she probably would have been nominated as well.

The only issue I have with the Ripley/Skinner joint nomination is that some people on Wikipedia keep changing pages for every show that ever had two people nominated in the same category. No, Idina Menzel and Kristin Chenoweth being nominated for playing two completely separate characters in Wicked is not the same as grouping a duo that never leaves each other's side as a single nomination in leading actress.

As for alternates winning Tonys, what about the special Tony award to the revival cast of La Boheme in 2002-03? That was a rotating cast that was honored with a Tony Award for Excellence in Theater.

[givesmevoice]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 10:09am

Many in design/creative categories share a nomination with one or more. A Tony is a Tony and a nomination is a nomination no matter whom you share it with. Tell me you wouldn't be ecstatic to be nominated/win if you had to share it.

Oh, I absolutely would be ecstatic to be nominated/win if I had to share it! But I think the design and creative awards are different because your collaborative work is being seen at every performance, whereas the Billy boys are performing at separate shows but nominated as one. (I don't think I explained that very well.)


I didn't know that about Sizwe Banzi Is Dead, so that's an interesting note. But I think there's a difference between two actors whose performances are deemed inextricably linked (thus a joint nomination) and performers sharing a role (and each performing 2-3 times a week).


Also I'm in favor of something like a Tony Award for Excellence in Theater for actors who are sharing a part.

[AC126748]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 10:19am

The Drama Desk was most likely an anomaly caused by Skinner's illness. Had she physically performed the part enough, she probably would have been nominated as well.



It absolutely had to do with Skinner missing so many performances. Many Drama Desk members never saw Skinner perform--I heard this directly from a friend of mine who's a voting member. The producers feared that the same thing would happen at the Tonys and petitioned for a joint nomination. Whether or not they SHOULD have been nominated together on merit, the move was purely political.

[Playbilly]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 2:33pm

If the actress who plays Daisy excels, and the one who plays Violet stinks, why should they both get nominated because they are "a unit" or can't perform without the other? Makes no sense. All performances, in some respect, depend on co-stars. Should there only be ensembles? Nope.

[Leadingplayer]

Posted: 3/5/13 at 11:51pm

What is the story behind the actors from Sizwe Banzi getting a joint Tony? How were those roles considered links.

[givesmevoice]

Posted: 3/6/13 at 1:18am

^ My guess is that since it was a two person play, the argument was made that they simply could not have given the performance they did without the other. But I'm sure someone else knows the actual argument the producers made.