HONEYMOON IN VEGAS struggling on Broadway- Page 7

[indytallguy]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 7:09pm

"... and wait for the spring to happen, thats not irrational in my opinion! Producers do that all the time."

While producers no doubt have done this for other shows, if I am recalling those shows generally showed some momentum and improvement at the box office which Honeymoon in Vegas hasn't really done much of.

So for me, that's why I'm not sure your argument is completely rational given the relevant data. A significant amount of research has been done about why decision-makers often continue to spend money even when it does not appear to be in their best interests. Human beings are irrational and that often appears in their financial decisions.

[HogansHero]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 7:27pm

Pinto-dude, this is not a difference of opinion. Nothing you say is tethered to the facts, the data, the number. You know, the kind of things rational people look to when making points.

[haterobics]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 7:29pm

To be fair, this was the same end result on us trying to convince him bisexuality was real, which seems even easier to prove than HIV not doing well financially... at least you would think it would have been easier.

[HogansHero]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 7:39pm

next up: climate change?

I was spared the bisexuality thread.

[Phillypinto]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 7:46pm

what are you guys trying to prove? That the show is gonna close soon? Lets see whats gonna happen with this.

[Pootie2]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 7:52pm

Phillypinto, the fact that you've been digging your heels in about a show you haven't even seen and resorted to a bunch of all-caps screaming posts with multiple punctuation marks shows that you're the one who's desperate to prove something. Your counters about "many other shows have--" are empty because you yourself never provide the counter-data. Just what you're trying to prove, though, I have no idea.

Also, the sunken costs fallacy is pretty rampant for this industry, I suppose.

[indytallguy]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 7:59pm

I can't wait for the sequel: Bisexuals Honeymooning in Vegas.

[Phillypinto]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 9:00pm

I saw it at Paper Mill, just haven't gotten a chance to see it on Broadway yet cause I'm away at school. The thing that just pisses me off is the fact that people just keep saying that its gonna close! its gonna close! and my point is that not all shows that lose a lot of money close so soon. Look at On The Town for crying out loud! Thats all. Im really looking forward to seeing what happens with this show. Hopefully it stays open through the spring

Updated On: 2/2/15 at 09:00 PM

[HogansHero]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 9:23pm

Pinto, if you had simply said (as many others have) I like this show and hope it runs, none of this endless thread would have happened. But you have repeatedly tried to go a step beyond that and make irrational assertions comparing this to other shows that have stayed open. It has been explained to you repeatedly that the numbers and timing of Honeymoon are worse than any other show and that, for that reason, running through the spring-something that will require someone to dig over a million dollars out of their pocket to support this show's ongoing losses-is illogical. So when you say "not all shows that lose a lot of money close so soon," you are letting your enthusiasm run amok because no show that loses this much money on this timeline doesn't close, unless someone insane keeps it open. That's not open to debate, because the numbers are the numbers and the data is the data. So please continuing hoping someone crazy wants to lose ANOTHER million dollars so it stays open through the spring, but please do not try to suggest that it is rational and that others do it, because it is not and they do not. And I do not know if On the Town will make it till spring or not, but I will say that if we were having the same discussion about that show, I would have said the same thing I have said.

[Phillypinto]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 9:28pm

yea exactly, and apparently On The Town is staying open til the spring. I stand by everything i have said. No matter what those god damn numbers are, unless Honeymoon In Vegas announces closing soon, you're wrong because you keep saying that its gonna close! Well guess what, it hasn't!

Updated On: 2/2/15 at 09:28 PM

[ebontoyan]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 9:38pm

Yes On the Town is not closing anytime soon. While they are losing money week after week, an usher has said that with no big stars the overhead is pretty low and therefore can keep open longer. As for what I think of On the Town that is for another thread. lol I wonder if that is the same situation in Honeymoon in Vegas?! Maybe Tony Danza has waived his fees if he is a producer of the show and this is a vanity project?! I am just speculating of course so plz no one jump on me!

[Kad]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 9:52pm

" No matter what those god damn numbers are, unless Honeymoon In Vegas announces closing soon, you're wrong because you keep saying that its gonna close! Well guess what, it hasn't!"

That... doesn't make anyone wrong. We'd be wrong if we all said, "the show is going on Wednesday," and then that didn't happen.

People are saying its closure will be inevitable, and sooner than later. And it will be. It is an unsustainable production at this point, and unless someone is pouring *literally* millions of dollars into it by themselves, it cannot stay open three more months till Tony nominations.

The whole point of commercial theatre is to turn a profit, and if you can't turn a profit, you cut your losses as soon as you can. There's no greater "plan" involved. And, frankly, if the producers of this show wish to gamble on Tony nominations saving the show- at which point the show would have been running for over 5 months at a loss weekly- they're really bad producers.

[GiantsInTheSky2]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 10:02pm

"'Do you know how many producers have used that strategy and have been very successful?'

Name three shows where that worked."

According to Pinto, the answer would be, "On the Town, On the Town and On the freaking Town!!!"

"you're wrong because you keep saying that its gonna close! Well guess what, it hasn't!"

That doesn't make their predictions wrong...it could...still close...so, nobody can really be "wrong" here. Didn't you JUST say that this was a matter of different opinions? That doesn't make them wrong. Jesus.

Updated On: 2/2/15 at 10:02 PM

[ggersten]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 10:13pm

Little Women seems comparable to HMiV or HINV. First preview December 7, 2004 - 55 previews later, it opens on January 23, 2005. It does not get a good review from the NY Times. And, it limps along until it takes a deep dive in April. Sutton Foster gets a Tony nomination, but that's it and it closes on May 22 after 137 performances (which is more than any JRB show has had). It was at the Virginia/now August Wilson with seating capacity of around 1200. And Little Women had a new Tony Winner in Foster and based on a beloved book. And a big Act One Closer....



Little Women Numbers

[Kad]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 10:15pm

An auspicious record to model a run off of, certainly.

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 10:18pm

Just call it Honeymoon!

Updated On: 2/2/15 at 10:18 PM

[HogansHero]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 10:21pm

Pinto: "No matter what those god damn numbers are."

Now that's pretty much the definition of irrational right there, no?

ebontoyan: not gonna jump on you, but I will jump on that usher a bit. OTT hardly has low overhead. It has a huge cast, a huge orchestra and sits in the largest most expensive to operate theatre on Broadway. Proving once again: never listen to ushers. The show has a nut of $650-675k and is pulling revenue of less than that in each of the last four frames. (This week, a lot less.)

[philly03]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 10:26pm

I would love these producers to produce a Frank Wildhorn show! It could run longer than the original Jekyll & Hyde!

[Phillypinto]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 10:28pm

you guys are saying that it is gonna close soon!! That is the point you are trying to make, but you can't prove that!!

[massofmen]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 10:42pm

Updated On: 2/2/15 at 10:42 PM

[GiantsInTheSky2]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 10:43pm

No we can't prove it Pinto but we can make educated guesses based on history, numbers, facts and logic, rather than blind hope!!

Updated On: 2/2/15 at 10:43 PM

[Phillypinto]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 10:46pm

I don't have blind hope, thats the producers of Honeymoon In Vegas. Im just telling you whats gonna happen, and nobody wants to believe me lol

Massofmen, put your message back up, it was funny

Updated On: 2/2/15 at 10:46 PM

[VintageSnarker]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 10:48pm

So February is going to be my lottery month. I've been putting off seeing a ton of shows that I wasn't very enthusiastic about in order to see various shows and concerts that I was more enthusiastic about and now it's time to take a chance on getting tickets to everything else. Hedwig (I was waiting for JCM), On the Town (I haven't really been grabbed by any of the promotional materials), Honeymoon in Vegas (the mixed word of mouth put me off), and If/Then.

Right now HIV is at the bottom of the priority list along with trying that On the Town mobile lottery from time to time. But if it's really going to close in the next few weeks I might have to re-evaluate things. How serious are those rumors? Because honestly, I think I'd still rather see Hedwig and If/Then.

[ggersten]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 10:53pm

Phillypinto - I haven't gone back and read everyone's statements, but the sense is that this is a show, in a rational world, that should close. But, if the producers are not rational or have very veru deep pockets and lots of money they are willing to lose - or have some other reason (like Danza financing a vanity project for himself - ala Hot Feet), then the show will not close. I do believe the producers may have budgeted for slow months - and felt that the NYTimes rave would be enough - but I don't think they budgeted for the sales to be this slow.
You are actually the only one who is saying what will happen, when you have no more idea than the rest of us. You believe the producers will keep the show open at least until May when the Tony nominations come out - but that belief may not make it so.

[ebontoyan]

Posted: 2/2/15 at 10:55pm

Hedwig and If/Then are good choices. I didn't like On the Town when I saw it a few weeks ago (we left at intermission) and I am just staying away from Honeymoon in Vegas. Have you considered On the Twentieth Century?! I am watching that at the end of Feb. Have been listening to the OBCR and loving it!!!