Marc Shaiman responds to Michael John La Chiusa — Page 7
#152
Posted: 8/8/05 at 10:20pm
I haven't posted in a while folks, but I felt like I had to come back for this one.
As many of you may remember, I am not a fan of Hairspray. I find it to be uninspired and a far second to Water's movie. I've come to terms with the fact that I am in the minority here. While I find Mr. LaChiusa's article to be harsh, he makes several worthwhile points.
LaChiusa's comments do seem to come from some sort of jealousy. The musical is dead? I don't think so. For me, Guettel's Light in the Piazza alone proves that to be wrong. But I'm sure there are plenty out there who didn't care for Light in the Piazza, and plenty of composers who don't wish to write a show like it. I would never expect to see a show with the same emotionally complex score and dramatic plotline from Mr. Shaiman...nor would I expect to see it from Mr. Brooks. These are not the musicals that they seem to care for, so why would they, or should they write them?
Shouldn't Broadway have something for everyone? Shouldn't I be able to see new musicals by LaChiusa, Tesori, Sondheim, and Guettel while my friends who enjoyed Wicked, Hairspray and Spamalot see Mr. Shaiman's new musical comedy across the street? Wouldn't that be ideal?
Unfortunately this does not seem to be the case. When was the last time we saw a new LaChiusa musical or Guettel musical in a Broadway house? Wait...when was the last time we ever saw Guettel in a true Broadway house? Does everything with a little emotional depth have to be picked up by LCT to even get seen? This is where I believe the Broadway producers are failing us. And this is where I believe Mr. LaChiusa makes a good point.
I would be fine with Spamalot and Hairspray if only I knew the truly inspired and intriguing composers, like the previously mentioned, could get produced. I just wish everything in New York wasn't based on a cult movie or a spoof on previous musical theater. We are a recycled culture...and for some reason we have facination with remaking things. I mean simply look at your local movie listings. Wonka? Bad News Bears? Why do I need to see these remade. And why do I need to see a movie as a musical? Well I guess I don't...but when it's all that is being produced it sure does feel like my life line is being cut off. For the producers out there...I promise you there is an audience for new and exciting works. Please give these talented composers a chance! Stop playing it safe!
There's my rant. Now simply waiting for the responses from Mr. Shaiman.
P.S. As to not dragging his collegues into it...I do believe he dragged in Mr. Mitchell, Mr. Herman, and Mr. Waters.
As many of you may remember, I am not a fan of Hairspray. I find it to be uninspired and a far second to Water's movie. I've come to terms with the fact that I am in the minority here. While I find Mr. LaChiusa's article to be harsh, he makes several worthwhile points.
LaChiusa's comments do seem to come from some sort of jealousy. The musical is dead? I don't think so. For me, Guettel's Light in the Piazza alone proves that to be wrong. But I'm sure there are plenty out there who didn't care for Light in the Piazza, and plenty of composers who don't wish to write a show like it. I would never expect to see a show with the same emotionally complex score and dramatic plotline from Mr. Shaiman...nor would I expect to see it from Mr. Brooks. These are not the musicals that they seem to care for, so why would they, or should they write them?
Shouldn't Broadway have something for everyone? Shouldn't I be able to see new musicals by LaChiusa, Tesori, Sondheim, and Guettel while my friends who enjoyed Wicked, Hairspray and Spamalot see Mr. Shaiman's new musical comedy across the street? Wouldn't that be ideal?
Unfortunately this does not seem to be the case. When was the last time we saw a new LaChiusa musical or Guettel musical in a Broadway house? Wait...when was the last time we ever saw Guettel in a true Broadway house? Does everything with a little emotional depth have to be picked up by LCT to even get seen? This is where I believe the Broadway producers are failing us. And this is where I believe Mr. LaChiusa makes a good point.
I would be fine with Spamalot and Hairspray if only I knew the truly inspired and intriguing composers, like the previously mentioned, could get produced. I just wish everything in New York wasn't based on a cult movie or a spoof on previous musical theater. We are a recycled culture...and for some reason we have facination with remaking things. I mean simply look at your local movie listings. Wonka? Bad News Bears? Why do I need to see these remade. And why do I need to see a movie as a musical? Well I guess I don't...but when it's all that is being produced it sure does feel like my life line is being cut off. For the producers out there...I promise you there is an audience for new and exciting works. Please give these talented composers a chance! Stop playing it safe!
There's my rant. Now simply waiting for the responses from Mr. Shaiman.
P.S. As to not dragging his collegues into it...I do believe he dragged in Mr. Mitchell, Mr. Herman, and Mr. Waters.
Updated On: 8/8/05 at 10:20 PM
#153
Posted: 8/8/05 at 11:37pm
"I guess I'm partial now due to his (or hers?) sweet words regarding me, but if this SumOfAllThings person is really still in high school but writing so thoughtfully and with such balance and clarity, I have no choice but to retire!! I am SUCH an old fart!!"
You're not an old fart Marc! I've just been listening to a lot of Sondheim and South Park(you tend to use bigger words ala Sondheim and you need to get your point across ala South Park)
You're not an old fart Marc! I've just been listening to a lot of Sondheim and South Park(you tend to use bigger words ala Sondheim and you need to get your point across ala South Park)
BSoBW2: I punched Sondheim in the face after I saw Wicked and said, "Why couldn't you write like that!?"
#154
Posted: 8/8/05 at 11:57pm
BestOfBroadway, as I live and breath!
Wouldn't you be surprised BoB (maybe even disappointed?) to know I agree with practically every word of your entire post...as a matter of fact, who wouldn't? Except the part where you somehow decide I "don't care" for LIGHT IN THE PIAZZA. Um, sorry, I loved it. Twice.
But ya know, BoB ol' boy, not every producer out there is guilty of ignoring the "seemingly" less commercial pieces that come to their attention. Two years ago, a LOT of producers felt emotionally responsible to place "CAROLINE, OR CHANGE" on Broadway, where is unfortunately was (shockingly, I thought) met with just a bit too much indifference for it's long term survival.
And if it is what he wants, I pray Mr. LC. gets his kind of show up along side the rest of the lucky folk who can get the nightly thrill of watching and listening to an audience eat up their work on the cemetary he calls Broadway. There are many, many producers with BIG BUCKS out there. But they WILL have to be moved, emotionally, intellectually or (hopefully) both. I wish him all the lu...I mean, break a leg!
But there is still no excuse for unprovoked public condescending words and the statement of opinions as fact
Party on, BoB, party on!!
p.s. Oh, and if you read my posts, you will see I said I "tried" not to bring in any of the artists (artists being MY word, Lord knows not "his") that he 'took umbrage' with. And since he did not take Messrs. Herman or Waters to task (lucky THEM!), I 'invoked' the feelings they have shared with me. And Mr. Mitchell was delighted (as I knew he'd be) with his colorful description!
Now, can't we talk of SOMETHING else? At this point (and hour) even I am bored by the sound of my own voice!! (Not to mention the voices of a few others in here!!)
Wouldn't you be surprised BoB (maybe even disappointed?) to know I agree with practically every word of your entire post...as a matter of fact, who wouldn't? Except the part where you somehow decide I "don't care" for LIGHT IN THE PIAZZA. Um, sorry, I loved it. Twice.
But ya know, BoB ol' boy, not every producer out there is guilty of ignoring the "seemingly" less commercial pieces that come to their attention. Two years ago, a LOT of producers felt emotionally responsible to place "CAROLINE, OR CHANGE" on Broadway, where is unfortunately was (shockingly, I thought) met with just a bit too much indifference for it's long term survival.
And if it is what he wants, I pray Mr. LC. gets his kind of show up along side the rest of the lucky folk who can get the nightly thrill of watching and listening to an audience eat up their work on the cemetary he calls Broadway. There are many, many producers with BIG BUCKS out there. But they WILL have to be moved, emotionally, intellectually or (hopefully) both. I wish him all the lu...I mean, break a leg!
But there is still no excuse for unprovoked public condescending words and the statement of opinions as fact
Party on, BoB, party on!!
p.s. Oh, and if you read my posts, you will see I said I "tried" not to bring in any of the artists (artists being MY word, Lord knows not "his") that he 'took umbrage' with. And since he did not take Messrs. Herman or Waters to task (lucky THEM!), I 'invoked' the feelings they have shared with me. And Mr. Mitchell was delighted (as I knew he'd be) with his colorful description!
Now, can't we talk of SOMETHING else? At this point (and hour) even I am bored by the sound of my own voice!! (Not to mention the voices of a few others in here!!)
Updated On: 8/9/05 at 11:57 PM
#155
Posted: 8/9/05 at 12:17am
Lets talk about how Billy Ocean's Get outta my dreams get into my car is the most amazing piece of music (insert James Lipton's voice) ever written.
Okay maybe not but after hours of spanish homework it certainly feels like it right now.
Okay maybe not but after hours of spanish homework it certainly feels like it right now.
Updated On: 8/9/05 at 12:17 AM
#156
Posted: 8/9/05 at 12:19am
"(Not to mention the voices of a few others in here!!)"
Bitch....
I tried to talk about Idina in a mud wrestling match, but I was met by queeriticism
Bitch....
I tried to talk about Idina in a mud wrestling match, but I was met by queeriticism
#157
Posted: 8/9/05 at 1:05am
Well I just got back from the LA gay rodeo, and I see more rears being slapped here than I saw the entire weekend, and honey, those were some tight rears in those levis.
Theatre is all about PASSION. It's refreshing to see someone like Marc so passionate about theatre. On the other hand, Mr. La Chuisa comes across as biter and destructive to me. Maybe he just needs a really good bitchslapping...
Theatre is all about PASSION. It's refreshing to see someone like Marc so passionate about theatre. On the other hand, Mr. La Chuisa comes across as biter and destructive to me. Maybe he just needs a really good bitchslapping...
#158
Posted: 8/9/05 at 1:27am
Marc,
Ive seen 'Piazza' more times than you
xo.
C
Ive seen 'Piazza' more times than you
xo.
C
#159
Posted: 8/9/05 at 1:37am
just for that I'm gonna have them remove the wheelchair access!!
#160
Posted: 8/9/05 at 1:43am
ooo
But who has seen Hairspray more?
Not counting rehearsals...I mean actually sat in the theatre - and watched (and didn't take notes)....
But who has seen Hairspray more?
Not counting rehearsals...I mean actually sat in the theatre - and watched (and didn't take notes)....
#161
Posted: 8/9/05 at 1:49am
Wow good question Thenadier!
If you wanted to try to make it a tad fairer or closer, we should keep it to only the NY production, since even though I know Mistress saw a bit in LA, my guess is Marc's seen a bunch more performances outside of NY, that would at least make it closer.
And if you did take away wheelchair seating at Piazza, you'd most likely be stuck having to carry Mistress to a regular seat for the 28th...I dunno, threaten to run you over or with her arm thingies that can be used as weapons, which she has threatened or offered to me quite a few times...
If you wanted to try to make it a tad fairer or closer, we should keep it to only the NY production, since even though I know Mistress saw a bit in LA, my guess is Marc's seen a bunch more performances outside of NY, that would at least make it closer.
And if you did take away wheelchair seating at Piazza, you'd most likely be stuck having to carry Mistress to a regular seat for the 28th...I dunno, threaten to run you over or with her arm thingies that can be used as weapons, which she has threatened or offered to me quite a few times...
"If there was a Mount Rushmore for Broadway scores, "West Side Story" would be front and center. It snaps, it crackles it pops! It surges with a roar, its energy and sheer life undiminished by the years" - NYPost reviewer Elisabeth Vincentelli
Updated On: 8/9/05 at 01:49 AM
#162
Posted: 8/9/05 at 1:56am
Ah yes - B'way only.
#163
Posted: 8/9/05 at 2:06am
I can't believe I just read this whole thread in one sitting.
After reading the original article, I feel that I was insulted by being a fan of these "faux musicals." I do believe in free speech, but I don't think it was wise of Mr. LaChiusa to insult a theatre community that decides if one of his shows is a success.
Anyways, I have nothing new to add, but I do agree with everything Marc has said. and I echo what Sumofallthings has said (btw sum, you're my new hero)
haha and I'd be in support of some mud wrestling in Shubert Alley. of course it would have to be when I am in nyc.
After reading the original article, I feel that I was insulted by being a fan of these "faux musicals." I do believe in free speech, but I don't think it was wise of Mr. LaChiusa to insult a theatre community that decides if one of his shows is a success.
Anyways, I have nothing new to add, but I do agree with everything Marc has said. and I echo what Sumofallthings has said (btw sum, you're my new hero
) haha and I'd be in support of some mud wrestling in Shubert Alley. of course it would have to be when I am in nyc
.
"Chicago is it's own incredible theater town right there smack down in the middle of the heartland. What a great city! I can see why Oprah likes to live there!" - Dee Hoty :-D
#164
Posted: 8/9/05 at 2:16am
(walks up to the microphone)
Michael Arden makes me harden. Thank you.
(walks away)
Michael Arden makes me harden. Thank you.
(walks away)
Bill Finn rocks. Woot.
#165
seriously Marc, if you want to carry my fat ass that badly, all you have to do is ask- no rebuilding of Lincoln Center required.
as for Hairspray, I lost count quite a while ago, but I think Im at around 50 or so visits. Seeing it 2.5 times in one week last month was fun!
Posted: 8/9/05 at 2:59am
seriously Marc, if you want to carry my fat ass that badly, all you have to do is ask- no rebuilding of Lincoln Center required.
as for Hairspray, I lost count quite a while ago, but I think Im at around 50 or so visits. Seeing it 2.5 times in one week last month was fun!
#166
Posted: 8/9/05 at 3:05am
I can't believe this thread didn't really catch my attention till now.
I think the most important thing to take from LaChiusa's essay is found here: “All sense of invention and craft is abandoned in favor of delivering what the audience thinks a musical should deliver…There is no challenge, no confrontation, no art — and everyone sighs with relief.”
-in my opinion there is nothing wrong inherently with borrowing source material or anything like that, but I think what we need is for more producers to take a RISK, push the envelope of the musical form. Musical theatre has so many possibilities, and while I don't think shows like Beauty and the Beast are the "death" of musical theatre they are part of stasis. Even shows that nowadays I find to be crappy like Oklahoma when produced today because they seem so archaic and commercial at the TIME were transforming and artistically DIFFERENT.
And to the people who were talking about the profit/not for profit situation -every composer wants his stuff on Broadway, and that's not just a "wanting to make money thing"; it's also a "wanting people to see your work" thing, and you're more likely to get people to see your material if it's on Broadway.
That said, Marc's reply was fair, and of course funny, with a lot of truth behind it. I would love it put in a more essay form, 'cause then you could more easily compare them as essays about what musical theatre should be, an always fun argument, but whatev. Do what ya want, Marc ;0)
I think the most important thing to take from LaChiusa's essay is found here: “All sense of invention and craft is abandoned in favor of delivering what the audience thinks a musical should deliver…There is no challenge, no confrontation, no art — and everyone sighs with relief.”
-in my opinion there is nothing wrong inherently with borrowing source material or anything like that, but I think what we need is for more producers to take a RISK, push the envelope of the musical form. Musical theatre has so many possibilities, and while I don't think shows like Beauty and the Beast are the "death" of musical theatre they are part of stasis. Even shows that nowadays I find to be crappy like Oklahoma when produced today because they seem so archaic and commercial at the TIME were transforming and artistically DIFFERENT.
And to the people who were talking about the profit/not for profit situation -every composer wants his stuff on Broadway, and that's not just a "wanting to make money thing"; it's also a "wanting people to see your work" thing, and you're more likely to get people to see your material if it's on Broadway.
That said, Marc's reply was fair, and of course funny, with a lot of truth behind it. I would love it put in a more essay form, 'cause then you could more easily compare them as essays about what musical theatre should be, an always fun argument, but whatev. Do what ya want, Marc ;0)
-Anyone want to turn anarchist with me?"Bless you and all who know you, oh wise and penguined one." ~YouWantItWhen????
#167
Posted: 8/9/05 at 3:38am
number of performances of LaChuisa musical on Broadway: 110
number of performances of Shaiman musical on Broadway: 1240
number of performances of Shaiman musical on Broadway: 1240
#168
Posted: 8/9/05 at 12:07pm
what an asshole. and for the record, i think Andrew Lippa's Wild Party is clearly superior to mjl's.
Mind is Mantra.
#169
Posted: 8/9/05 at 12:15pm
Wax Lion loves you BillFinn.
Love,
Wax Lion
Love,
Wax Lion
#170
Posted: 8/9/05 at 12:22pm
When I went to Hello Again I got a headache, when I went to Hairspray I got laid afterwards, 'nuff said.
Unfledge them of their...perriwigs, And they appear like bald-cootes, in the nest.
Beaumont, Knt. Malta, (1616).
#171
Posted: 8/9/05 at 12:32pm
Wow, if only I got royalties on THAT!!
well, that is a FANTASTIC review!! Can we put the on the marquee???
"When I went to see HAIRSPRAY I got laid afterwards" - Box Five, BWW
I am calling the marketing department PRONTO!!
well, that is a FANTASTIC review!! Can we put the on the marquee???
"When I went to see HAIRSPRAY I got laid afterwards" - Box Five, BWW
I am calling the marketing department PRONTO!!
#172
Posted: 8/9/05 at 12:34pm
Hell, Wax Lion got laid DURING the show. You can't stop the beat...you really can't.
Love,
Wax Lion
Love,
Wax Lion
#173
Posted: 8/9/05 at 12:37pm
Damn. Maybe I should go see Hairspray again - such testimonials!
A work of art is an invitation to love.
Updated On: 8/9/05 at 12:37 PM
#174
Posted: 8/9/05 at 12:40pm
*frantically dials Telecharge for one seat on the aisle*
#175
Posted: 8/9/05 at 12:42pm
Eddie - you double your chances if you aren't on the aisle. Think m'boy - you'd have someone on each side of you!
"A little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men" - Willy Wonka
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