Musicals that SHOULDN"T be done in high schools...but have...- Page 5

[j.t15]

Posted: 7/22/18 at 1:24pm

Rocky Horror

Les Mis

West Side Story

[John Adams]

Posted: 7/22/18 at 1:34pm

It's always nice when school productions can impress their audience as seeming "professional", but (IMO, more so in Arts Education, than some other academic subjects) I don't feel like that should be the first, or most important priority.

In general, teachers have the opportunity to present training and subject matter that is beyond a student's comfort/competency level. If a teacher does not challenge a student beyond their current level, there is no growth - they just remain competent at a stagnant level of achievement.

Will a high school boy be completely believable as Tevye? Maybe - maybe not. But SO not the point. By offering the opportunity to play the role, the student has the gift of being able to stretch him/herself beyond their current level of competency.

Will they make mistakes? Fall flat on their faces? Completely "bomb"?

Well... yes. That's a VERY important part of the process; like learning to ride a bike. Should only those who have the balance and physical stability to jump on a bicycle, and remain upright be allowed to ride a bike? Of course not. Falling down is a very important part of the growth process.

In my view, it's not the students who participate in productions beyond their years that should be discussed or judged.

I think it's more important to look at the adults who are guiding them in their process. Personally, I always think it's a good idea to allow students to participate in material that's beyond their current understanding or competency level - as long as they have competent guidance from the adults who surround them in that process.

Updated On: 7/22/18 at 01:34 PM

[freewilma]

Posted: 7/22/18 at 1:41pm

This is a terrific piece by Howard Sherman on factors high schools should consider today when picking their productions. http://www.hesherman.com/2017/10/18/keynote-school-theatre-can-be-more/

[raddersons]

Posted: 7/22/18 at 3:44pm

I think there are some shows that are about adult problems and aging that should be avoided (Follies, Company, Falsettos) but otherwise, if all or most of the characters are supposed to be adults or teenagers, I think it's fair game for a high school. 

[dramamama611]

Posted: 7/22/18 at 4:55pm

This thread was a hoot to read thru.  Is it wrong that I've produced many of the shows people listed here in the last ten years?   Lol.

 

As a whole, I don't think there are too many shows that should be off limits and that it's up to each individual community/school to determine that.  That being said, I've never been told I couldn't do a show.  

Updated On: 7/22/18 at 04:55 PM

[Scarlet Leigh]

Posted: 7/22/18 at 5:55pm

MagicToDo82 said: "Everytime I see a high school doing Cabaret, I get a little queasy."

^^^THIS! I once saw a local KIDS theatre group do Cabaret. Like, 95% of the company were between the ages of 12-18. The only "older" actors were two 20 somethings that played Fraulein Schneider and Herr Schultz. It just.... blew my mind that they thought it was a good idea.

[edmundog2]

Posted: 7/22/18 at 6:12pm

Speaking as a high school theater teacher, I would say there are very few shows that SHOULDN'T be done in high schools. I can only think of three categories.

1 - Sexuality. This is not just rude jokes, people. Lots of the shows y'all have claimed are "too sexy" are able to be done with just some different costumes and choreography. But there is the occasional show where the sexuality is too present to avoid. Pippin is doable. Chicago is doable. Rocky Horror isn't. Cabaret... is borderline. Honestly, a woman director would probably be able to get away with that, but I don't think I could, nor do I want to.

2 - Adult situations - Not sex, the way it's normally used. But I think a director would be doing a disservice to do a show about adult problems that the kids can't relate to. Company or Avenue Q for instance.

3 - Shows intended to have adult and child cast members. This goes for Oliver, Annie, Matilda, any of those things. YOU JUST DON'T HAVE THE HEIGHT RANGES. I only got away with James and the Giant Peach because I had a particularly short kid with a powerhouse voice. 

[dramamama611]

Posted: 7/22/18 at 6:45pm

That list takes a lot of shows out of consideration.

Posted: 7/22/18 at 9:05pm

the truth is there are very few good musicals that are really appropriate for kids. Good theater is not usually geared with kids in mind but with working through very complicated social issues.  But high school kids need to start learning about these complicated issues before college, let them do complicates shows it's just acting and pretending.

[NewZealander]

Posted: 7/22/18 at 10:01pm

oh grandmother its 2018. and mamma I am a big girl now

[BroadwayMan5]

Posted: 7/23/18 at 1:17am

I think provocative musicals that may have some sexual content (Spring Awakening, Rent) can be more appropriate for high school students than musicals like Company or Follies, where it would be incredibly hard for teenagers to play roles that require some serious life experience to actually even understand, much less perform. That said, I think it varies a lot on the community and there are plenty of communities out there still where a Spring Awakening or Rent is still a bad idea.

[dramamama611]

Posted: 7/23/18 at 3:34am

Considering that people under 18 cant do simulated sex acts, its a pretty good reason NOT to do Spring Awakening.

And my students will never do Rent - but thats because I immensely dislike it.

[asoftplacetoland]

Posted: 7/23/18 at 4:33am

A local (very white) private school did “Once on This Island” a couple years ago and they had maybe two black people in the cast. They had to change the entire dynamic and made it “rich and poor” instead of “dark and light skinned.” LOL, totally not saying that it’s wrong for high schools to do OOTI. It’s just certain high schools shouldn’t... Like, know what you’re working with, people...

[dramamama611]

Posted: 7/23/18 at 7:19am

Lots of schools do that...with full approval of the creators. And, if you aren't overly familiar with it, the audience doesnt think twice.

LMM had said its ok that white schools do ITH, and expects, someday, for Hamilton to be played by whites and even women in the leading roles, in schools.

[MrsSallyAdams]

Posted: 7/23/18 at 8:36am

High School Musicals in my town were performed for the parents rather than the students. Parents were more comfortable with shows being PG. we did Guys and Dolls and Craxy for You. Those shows have more sexual content than people realize. Both feature strip teases after all. I believe there was one complaint about a meekly staged "Naughty Baby" for being too "racy" but no one complained about "Take Back Your mink."

I've seen a high school production of "City of Angels" that cut the book to ribbons. Great roles for women but every profane or sexual line was rewritten. It was as though the shows villain, Buddy Fidler, had gotten his hands on the script. A fully clothed and rewritten "Lost and Found" was particularly bizarre.

"And though my daddy says to turn me in / why don't you hide me here instead?"

[a12la]

Posted: 8/10/18 at 5:41pm

deleted Updated On: 8/14/18 at 05:41 PM

[bwaylinds]

Posted: 8/10/18 at 5:55pm

An all boys Catholic school in my area did a production of Cabaret. I personally thought it was phenomenal but the strict Catholic parents were....less pleased

[WW_LV]

Posted: 11/22/21 at 12:40pm

VERY old thread but it's a topic that comes up in my circle from time to time.

(Context - I'm a granddad and my grandkids are still several years from HS, but we do talk about changing attitudes etc)

I suspect there are in fact many plays that are problematic for HS for various reasons.  Difficulty, message, particular scenes or situations etc.

But I very much agree the kids can't be expected to do "safe" plays all the time.  Yet many of the "safe" plays ARE very rewarding to do.

To me, the controversial elements of a given play need to be truly important in the story, and the story should be important to the kids as well as the parents.

That said, I've come around to shows like Spring Awakening and Heathers.  The sexuality that makes it controversial DOES make a point important to the story AND the story is important to teens and their parents.

Other shows have controversial elements that can easily be modified without affecting the integrity of the story.  An example I spoke of on this website many months ago is the Minksy scene in Gypsy.  Defenders of Gypsy for HS correctly say it's "NOT about a stripper".  To that point, that sequence of scenes shows that she went from clumsy and unsure to a very confident burlesque star independent of her overbearing mother.  We don't need to see a realistic demonstration of the techniques Gypsy used to make that point. 

To me, that’s simply gratuitous by definition.  Unnecessary, inappropriate, unjustified.  Sure, it's PG13, but to have parents/teachers applaud (in part) a HS kid’s ability to appear as sexually arousing as the actor in the pro version defines why it should be modified (as I've learned several HS do).

As opposed to the Dead Girl Walking Scene in Heathers.  Sure, it's also uncomfortable to see a HS kid give up her virginity (by implication - not simulation) BUT many HS students DO face similar situations.   And we are applauding the depiction of her desperation – NOT the sexuality we are watching.

And Spring Awakening?  From what I understand it deals with the dangers of poor/no sex education.  A very pertinent subject.

So to me, as long as the sexuality is not graphic and not gratuitous (that is, serves a purpose in advancing a critical point) I have no objection. 

(But there's nothing wrong with NON-controversial plays either!)

[Sutton Ross]

Posted: 11/22/21 at 12:45pm

High school kids are tired of doing the same virginal crap and want actual, real world subjects that are relevant today. And that's okay. It will sell tickets regardless because parents support their kids, hopefully. 

Thank you for your wonderful thoughts, your Grandkids have an awesome Grandfather! 

[WW_LV]

Posted: 11/22/21 at 1:19pm

Thank you for that compliment!

[pmensky]

Posted: 11/22/21 at 1:27pm

I think it’s awesome when high schools do shows that are inappropriate. I went to a school where they wouldn’t let us do Grease because of Rizzo’s pregnancy scare, but they had no issue with an entire white cast in yellow face doing The King & I. The sports teams are still known as the “Chiefs.” They thought they were being progressive when they switched from being the “Indians.” 

[HeyMrMusic]

Posted: 11/22/21 at 1:41pm

A couple weeks ago, a coworkers told me about their sibling doing a middle school production of The Rocky Horror Show years ago. I thought that was hilariously inappropriate.

[WW_LV]

Posted: 11/22/21 at 1:46pm

I'm surprised they didn't change it to "Native Americans" or Indigenous People" and say they are culturally sensitive!

I get what you are saying, but I don't agree with the wording.  I object strongly to ANYTHING inappropriate by definition.  I don't' want my grandkids to grow up defiant etc

But I don't' think you meant that.  I think you may have meant "things that people on the surface feel are inappropriate." 

Like Heathers / Spring Awakening / and even Gypsy.  They AREN'T "inappropriate" just because they have controversial elements.  Again, IF the controversial elements make an important point, I support it. 

If it's controversy with no theatrical reason other than to be ":just the professionals" then it strikes me almost as defiance - which I think is a bad message for a school sanctioned event.

My opinion of course - I do understand to some extent of letting the kids be a bit "edgy".  It's just that there are plenty of plays where that edginess serves a purpose beyond the edginess itself.

Cabaret is an interesting example.  Why do it in High School other than the fact it's famous and the director themselves want to do it?  Some might think that's reason enough - I personally don't when there are MANY famous plays with mature parts that carry a pertinent message.

I'm really not sure Gypsy does anymore - I've had that discussion with people.  I'm not against it - as long as the HS kid isn't stripping like the pro version (especially given we in effect morph into the Minsky audience).  But others object even if modified because in effect it seems to celebrate or at least commend the character for her success in "sex work". 

It WAS the right choice for her given the times and her lack of education.  But the counter argument questions if the school provides that context.  Or might any student feel "hey - I've got a computer with a webcam.  Instant empowerment and independence!"

That MAY be overthinking - and yet I DO see that point.

[Sutton Ross]

Posted: 11/22/21 at 1:51pm

WW_LV said: "Thank you for that compliment!"

Absolutely! Enjoy the holiday season! 

 

[WW_LV]

Posted: 11/22/21 at 1:53pm

Regarding middle school Rocky Horror.

I actually saw a promotion for a middle school production of Gypsy.  Now interestingly enough I can no longer find it - maybe it was taken down and maybe never produced.

But I recall it said "you'll be surprised at how many songs you know!".  Again, the idea seems to be because it's famous (and old/PG13) it's perfectly OK?

They also said "the sexuality will be toned down".  Well, I'd HOPE so!  But at the least, a grade school kid will be billed as the Queen of the Striptease" and will sing about making men "feel good" and wanting their "spirit to climb".  

How would ANY parent be OK with their barely teen daughter going back to school subject to (likely) being teased (or worse) for that?  

Updated On: 11/22/21 at 01:53 PM