Sweeney Todd Movie Review Thread- Page 15

[luvcaroline]

Posted: 12/28/07 at 5:14pm

Pippin, that is exactly how I felt about HBC's performance. The subtle gestures and expressions were just priceless and pitch-perfect for this role. (an often-mentioned example is her expressions during "Not While I'm Around," but of course there are many others). I think that a "broadway version" of this role would have been too exaggerated and would not have translated well to the big screen. Next to Julie Christie, this was the best performance by an actress that I saw this year.

[aeb]

Posted: 12/28/07 at 5:48pm

Something about HBC singing so wistfully about brightening up Sweeney's cold, barren room with daisies has just stuck with me for days. So beautiful and heartbreaking. To me that song encapsulated all the tragedy of the story and she made it so haunting and romantic, which is not a word applied easily to the stage version of Sweeney...she was remarkable.

[TomMonster]

Posted: 12/28/07 at 6:07pm

I agree that seeing the film a second time is a must. The first time all you can think about is what's been cut, or how they sound, etc.

The second time you can just enjoy it as a movie.

I loved it even more the second time!

[logan0215]

Posted: 12/29/07 at 2:34am

From T.O.N.Y Interview with Helena:

That makes for a fitting segue into asking what Broadway snobs think of your performance.
"People are going to think what they want. Both Johnny [Depp] and I kept singing high and enunciating sharply, but Tim discouraged that. He was like, 'Don’t do that Broadway thing!'"

Hmmmmm

[roquat]

Posted: 12/29/07 at 4:20pm

As several people have recommended, I saw the movie twice. Both times the theatre was fairly full, with varied demographics (from elderly people who had obviously seen the stage version to clueless teenagers.) Helena got precisely one laugh (of any kind) during both showings, and it was the same one--the post-Pirelli "Well, that's a different matter!" Not a sound during "Worst Pies", "By the Sea", "A Little Priest", or (what is arguably the most surefire laugh line in the show)--the post-"Epiphany" "Well, that's all very well, but what are we gonna do about him?"

There was also a palpable slump in energy during all of her songs at both showings, as one note after another wilted and fell into the chasms in between pitches. I noticed anew how static and claustrophobic most of the Sweeney/Lovett scenes and duets were (especially during "My Friends", which was also way under tempo.) An awful lot of Lovett slo-o-o-o-o-owly coming up behind Sweeney and putting her face next to his ear, as if the two of them were posing for stills for an Ingmar Bergman remake.

Other new questions---Why on earth did they keep "Wait" in its entirety? It's eminently cuttable--it would have been a kindness to Bonham Carter not to leave her vocal inadequacies so cruelly exposed for an entire lyrical solo. More to the point, why DIDN'T she cheer up Sweeney's tonsorial parlor as the money started coming in (with daisies, gillyflowers, or anything else?) If the barbershop had regained some of its former glory, the throat-slashings that take place there would have become both more horrifying and more domestic--we might have been shocked into laughter, instead of wondering why any sane Londoner would venture into that dark, dusty rat's nest for a shave.

Afterwards, there was a lot of "She really couldn't sing", "Well, she's the director's wife", etc., etc. And that's going to be the perception no matter how many times Sondheim insists he approved her casting. This movie had a chance to expand its appeal to people who don't go to movie musicals and who may never have heard of Stephen Sondheim. Because of Bonham Carter, I can't see that happening.

[roquat]

Posted: 12/29/07 at 4:33pm

On the plus side--no one protested or seemed surprised when the singing started (as has been reported happening elsewhere) and Alan Rickman was really wonderful. He's so perfectly cast as the Judge that I'm afraid his performance is being undervalued (as Meryl Streep sometimes is--the "he's good, as usual" kind of thing that actors HATE.) He gives the role the sinister lechery it needs, but with hints of real desperation and longing underneath, especially in his looks during the flashback scenes when he's trying (hopelessly, awkwardly) to court Lucy. He's less a calculating villain than a victim of his own passions. The high point of the movie remains, for me, "Pretty Women", when he and Depp realize they share the same addictions--that they are, in many ways (except for their styles and tactics) the same man. In his final scene, his eager smile when he thinks he's won Johanna ("Excellent, my friend!") is enough to cleave your heart in two.

[NY_Broadway2]

Posted: 12/29/07 at 4:48pm

I really liked the movie as a whole. I did feel like it was sort of like Sleepy Hollow but that's just the look of the film. I thought Depp did a great job with his performance. All of my friends who I saw it with (btw they are not theatre people) were really impressed with him. I wish they would have kept more of the beggar woman in the film and they cut a good portion of the beadle out as well. I didn't really like HBC's singing but here's one thing I think they could have done to improve it. They should have made her louder. Maybe it was the theater I was in I'm not sure, but I couldn't hear her over the music half the time. Luckily, I knew a lot of the words otherwise I wouldn't have been able to understand what she was saying at all. I thought the best singer was the little boy who played Tobias. He was great! And did anybody else think the girl who played Johanna looked a lot like Christina Ricci in Sleepy Hollow? It freaked me out.

[Wayman_Wong]

Posted: 12/29/07 at 11:20pm

For people who don't like musicals, I don't think the casting of Helena Bonham Carter makes any difference whatsoever. They aren't gonna go. It's silly at this point to argue over who should've been cast. The reality is: Bonham Carter got it, and had Sondheim's blessing. If you want to disagree with the composer, feel free. Sondheim's the first one to say Bonham Carter didn't have the best voice, but he was won over by her acting. I thought she paired up beautifully with Johnny Depp, and found her eyes so expressive. I so admired the fact that she didn't attempt to copy Lansbury and made Mrs. Lovett her own.

I also wanted to add my kudos to Alan Rickman, and especially how he plays his final scene with Todd. He acts almost like a schoolboy when Todd tells him that Johanna has learned her lesson and wants him back again. His eagerness to believe Todd has helped him win back Johanna is so important, or else why would Turpin choose to sit in that barber chair for a shave?

I also can't say enough about Ed Sanders. It's so refreshing to see an actual boy play Toby. He's got such a sweet and plaintive voice, and I love the family tableau of him, Todd & Mrs. Lovett.

[luvcaroline]

Posted: 12/30/07 at 12:00am

I am passionate about this movie, and it's great to see it discussed so much on this board (more than any other recent movie musical). I am enjoying reading everyone's opinions about it.

I saw the film in a full house today, and HBC got several laughs in many different points in the movie, not just after the Pirelli killing. It's interesting that there are so many divergent opinions here about her performance. I thought that she was devastating in the role, even moreso than I had before (this was my 3rd viewing). I found that I could rarely take my eyes off of her when she was on the screen, just waiting to see her reactions. I now can't imagine anyone else playing Lovett on screen.

[Lenexajones]

Posted: 12/30/07 at 12:14am

I finally saw it this afternoon [along with a dozen others in a fairly empty theater]and loved, loved, loved it! I had high expectations but it far exceeded them. I was very skeptical about HBC going into it, but found that her acting more than made up for her thin voice. The fact that they were untrained singers took it away from the typical musical where we all stop while they sing a pretty song. It felt very natural. I could have done with a lot less blood [which really bothered my wife] but loved the rest of the production values. Interesting point about why they did not fix up Sweeney's place once the money started rolling in. I too wondered why anyone would step foot in the place... I went home and started up the original cast recording and found that it really made it a different show. Much more of an old music hall kind of show. I saw the revival in NY last year and still have a soft spot for that. It made my focus on the music. The film made me focus on the story. I like the fact that the same piece can have such divergent interpretations. It highlights the genius of Sondheim.

[luvcaroline]

Posted: 12/30/07 at 12:18am

I thought that the action of Sweeney Todd took place in just a few days. So maybe there wasn't enough time to "fix up the place?" Still, I can see how customers would be a little uneasy walking into that place, lol.

[FOAnatic]

Posted: 12/30/07 at 12:21am

I wonder why the Beggar Woman's assault on Anthony was included on the soundtrack but not in the film.

Does anyone know if it was filmed?

[sabrelady]

Posted: 12/30/07 at 1:02pm

I suspect there will be a lot of extras on the DVD.
Note: In a (short) interview in New York Magazine Burton states that the Ballad of Sweeney Todd was recorded but that when they started filming they couldn't find away to make it work (pax)
Hey I'd buy the DVD for that alone!

[roquat]

Posted: 12/30/07 at 7:52pm

The Beggar Woman's assault on Anthony ("how'd ya like to split me muff") was filmed, I believe, and then cut. The editing is very odd at that point--she starts inching her fingers up Anthony's jacket, and then she's suddenly scurrying away and his face looks slightly stricken for an instant.

Updated On: 12/30/07 at 07:52 PM

[logan0215]

Posted: 1/1/08 at 7:52pm

I thought that the action of Sweeney Todd took place in just a few days. So maybe there wasn't enough time to "fix up the place?" Still, I can see how customers would be a little uneasy walking into that place, lol.

I never gotten the impression that it was only a few days.

There are lines in "Kiss Me" that denote at least a few days ("he plans to marry me Sunday", but I would think that everything up to that point (Sweeney's arrival, setting up shop, Pirelli) all happened over some stretch of time.

Could be wrong, never really thought about it.

I just remember in the 2005 revival, 1st to 2nd act showerd a clear change due to the booming business of Mrs Lovett's Meat Pies which upgraded her wardrobe (and cleavage... and skirt length) and made me think more time had passed.

Updated On: 1/1/08 at 07:52 PM

[RockabyeHamlet]

Posted: 1/1/08 at 9:34pm

I finally saw the movie and it was better then i figured, but not as good as I had hoped. I have seen the show many, many times over the years and was expecting mot to be surprised by anything.

The moment that actually made me gasp was in the courtroom scene with Judge Turpin. When I saw the inital previews, I thought maybe they had changed it, so we saw Barker's conviction. When Turpin does the whole dialouge and the camera pans and we see that he has just sentenced a child to hang, that left me speechless. On that note, Rickman was one of my absolute favorite parts of the movie. He was so spot on and downright evil, that I was left wishing he was given at least a Golden Globe nomination. I have never hated the charecter of Turpin so much as when I saw Rickman play it.

Tobias was the other spot on casting in the movie. Having Toby being played by someone age appropriate was refreshing, and Sanders had a voice that arguably topped most of the adults on the screen. When we see Tobias at the end of the film, he is wearing an expression that eerily resembles Todd.

Depp was good as Todd, and considering I haven't liked anything he's been in, he was enjoyable. Carter seemed to have diction problems in her lines, but made some very nice acting choices, esp. in her scenes with Toby.

I abbsolutly hated the direction of Depp in the "By the Sea" sequence. Since the entire scene is so visual and exsists solely in Lovett's mind, it seemed odd that in her fantasy, Todd would not be any more receptive toward her.

[zooxanthellae]

Posted: 1/1/08 at 10:10pm

I think even though it was her fantasy, she knows Sweeney would always be that way... I guess its a reality thats so known to her that it would even be incorporated in her fantasies... and really she loves Sweeney even like that (in reality) so it would be only fitting for him to be like that in her fantasy.

I don't know thats how I think about it at least.

[BWNUT]

Posted: 1/2/08 at 11:59am

I've heard of this show but this is the first time I saw it either on stage or film. Is it just me or did anyone else had trouble understanding half of what Mrs. Lovett was saying and singing? I eventually just gave up trying to decipher the dialogue and lyrics and stopped listening to her. It just ruined the whole movie for me.

[roquat]

Posted: 1/2/08 at 1:26pm

I actually worked on a production of SWEENEY in the late 1990s where the idea of the child criminal was used (a girl in our production; she also played the role of a child who comes into Sweeney's shop with a customer, preventing him from killing said customer.) I'm thinking of suing the movie's producers...

[shadow44]

Posted: 1/2/08 at 4:56pm

From what I have read from people who have seen the film in different theaters, she is hard to understand in theaters with poor sound systems and very understandable in theaters with good sound systems. Maybe you can find another theater with a more modern sound system.

[Scarywarhol]

Posted: 1/2/08 at 5:39pm

I'm surprised how most of the discussion has centered around HBC.

Personally, I loved her. I understood everything fine and she got huge laughs all three times I've seen it.

And I can't remember a better or more heartbreaking moment in any film as that shot of her closing and locking the door on Toby.

[AngusN]

Posted: 1/2/08 at 5:43pm

I'm afraid Helena ruined the film for me, I wanted to walk out after 30 minutes. Her attempt at singing was pathetic and as many people have already pointed out, she was hardly audible. I know that she is a good actress, however, that is not enough in a musical. If it is, why film it as a musical. There are many actresses talented enough to do the part justice and to be honest, it's not as if Helena is a big name - she's not an actress that people flock to see. A HUGE disappointment. One of the worst performances I've seen in a film. Updated On: 1/2/08 at 05:43 PM

[Scarywarhol]

Posted: 1/2/08 at 5:49pm

I guess it's odd that I disagree with people about the singing, since I so spritedly detest Gerard Butler in Phantom mostly because of his lack of singing ability. Because that was made as a grandiose, over-the-top musical, whareas her performance matched the film. It's like acting to fill a room--you make huge movements if you're in a big house, but this was so up close and claustrophobic that a real singer probably would've been too much. Perhaps I would have trouble hearing Helena some of the time if I weren't so familiar with the lyrics, but I don't really see the problem with her audibility.

As a theater fan, I can see why some people are complaining, especially after Angela Lansbury, etc. As a movie fan, I think she's pretty much perfect.
Updated On: 1/2/08 at 05:49 PM

[artscallion]

Posted: 1/2/08 at 6:39pm

Saw it for the third time today. The first and third times were in a theatre that had the volume at a noticeably lower volume. It did feel a little whispery and mumbly. In the other theatre it all sounded just right and I didn't miss a thing. Even HBC's singing sounded right and strong enough. The sound system definitely makes a difference.

Is that a fault of the movie or the theatre? Probably both.

Regarding the boy being sentenced to be hung, the stage script indicates this is to be a "very young boy" though it doesn't seem that one is ever cast, even in the original production. Probably because of the difficulties that come with casting children in stage shows, especially in such minute roles.

[roquat]

Posted: 1/2/08 at 10:33pm

It wasn't the fact that Helena Bonham Carter isn't a singer. It's the fact that her voice had absolutely no personality--it was the same irritatingly high, unmodulated tone throughout. She couldn't act through song, as has been claimed. Nicole Kidman's singing voice in MOULIN ROUGE was barely passable (and studio-mixed to death) but she managed to get several variations into her limited instrument--adding coy little rasps and growls during "Diamonds are a Girl's Best Friend", thinning her tone out to a near-whisper for the romantic suffering of "Come What May." Watch Helena in the climactic scene of SWEENEY--her "I love you/I'd be twice the wife she was" isn't about passion or desperation or pain--it's about straining hopelessly for notes. (I think that's why Depp killed her--to get away from that SOUND.)

I must confess, when people on this board refer to her "acting", I don't know what they're talking about. She's the most vague, listless film star I've ever seen--in movie after movie she wanders around in some private haze. Her eyes never connect with anyone else; she always seems to be reading the lines directly out of the script, for the first time.