Thank God the Gypsy Robe is now the legacy Robe — Page 2

VintageSnarker said: "I get what you're saying and I think it's complicated. Basically, has the word evolved enough or been divorced enough from its original connotation to be used in this other context. Even though I see the new use as innocent, the way you do, it's hard to argue that it has. For example, take the words "idiot," "moron," "imbecile," etc. which in the past used to be used as part of a psychological scale evaluating intelligence. I know some people think that it's ableist to still use these words and disability rights advocates argue that they're still harmful. I think that's a reach. But the word "****"? While I also think it's fallen out of fashion enough to join those other words, I personally don't use it because it has been used recently enough with negative connotations that it is still hurtful to people."

Here's what I would propose instead:

As part of the legacy of the Gypsy Robe, I would suggest that for every ceremony, there be a voluntary collection taken by cast members. That collected money would (could) be matched by Actors' Equity, and the entirety of monies be donated to the Roma Peoples Project, as a sign that although the Theater Community has adopted the word in a completely different context, we support their cause to be freed from racial stereotyping or slur.

The word "gypsy" does not belong to the Roma peoples. It's a slur that was thrust upon them. The donations should not be viewed as "purchasing" the word from them, as (quite rightfully) they are a people that does not deserve to be wrongfully associated with, nor take ownership of the slur.

Rather, I would hope that the regular contributions, as an addition to the legacy of the Gypsy Robe, might be seen as a sign that good CAN come from bad, and that (altruistically) the Theater Community completely supports the Roma peoples' cause, and hopes that the Roma peoples can see that when the Theater Community (if not the rest of the world) uses the word "gypsy", it is used with nothing less than affection, pride and kinship. ...and that those affections are extended to the Roma peoples when we use the word.

My hope would be that the Roma peoples understand that the Theater Community knows and appreciates the hurtful history behind the word, and does not use it in our context without remembering them.

Updated On: 7/14/18 at 05:12 PM

Sauja said: "This simple, respectful change has brought out a lot of ugliness in the community. Change is hard, and if you are being told something you’ve always done without malicious intent is offensive to some people, it takes work to fix that. And people don’t like extra work. But imagine making the argument that we don’t have to stop doing blackface because it’s “tradition.” Imagine demanding that Show Boat start with the original N-Word lyric rather than the changed version because “it’s a classic.” Progressive movements progress. What was once “harmless” can become offensive. Or always was but can be brought to the forefront of our knowledge. If we can’t ask that our artists be on the front lines of positive social change, who should we be asking?"

I understand your argument, but the examples above are all "static" - meaning that there is no evidence regarding how those specific examples have positively evolved into something different, creating a more positive situation. 

For that reason, I feel the use of the word, "gypsy" is in a category all its own. Regarding the word, specifically, a social change HAS happened for the better (IMHO). Again - I restate that all the wrong reasons (cultural white-washing, especially) created the change. Yet again, I use the word, "bizarre". 

This name change was absolutely the  right  decision.  Broadway will survive.  

Updated On: 7/14/18 at 06:03 PM

The Distinctive Baritone said: "If everyone could please refrain from using the phrase “Your privilege is showing” that would be great. It’s becoming a cheap way to shut someone up."

Even if we don't agree on this particular topic (which is fine), thanks for that!

 

Sondheimite said: "BREAKING NEWS:

OLD MEN COMPLAIN RATHER THAN FACE RACISM!!!"

Which would be fine if the theatrical definition of "gypsy" were an example of racism... Is "Chorus Boy/Girl" now a race? I did not know that...

Updated On: 7/14/18 at 06:53 PM

Your privilege is showing. 

John Adams said: "Kad said: "It’s impossible to divorce the historical connotation of a slur from a revised usage. Especially in this case, where American actors essentially reclaimed a slur that wasn’t ever theirs to begin with- slur that implies disreputable nomadity. It doesn’t matter that American actors decided to ironically or affectionately adopt it- it is still rooted there.

It’s the same reason why people don’t use “jew” as a verb. It may not be *literally* antisemitic but its use is directly linked to antisemitism."

I respectfully disagree.

Earlier, I wrote, "Here's a word that I have only known to be affectionate and a source of pride." That is because my age (I wasn't born when the word "gypsy" was first coined in Europe, nor lived through the early 20th-century era when it was commonly used with its negative connotation in the US)and geographical location prevented me from having a full, socially consciousunderstanding of the word.

I DID, however watch the Tony Awards the yearApplausewas nominated, and discovered the word "gypsy" in that context.

It only takes one generation of social ignorance to what's gone on before to create change (for better or worse).

I agree that it's still "rooted there", but if the roots go unnoticed by those who have no reason, cause or connection to them, they are invisible.

I can only offer myself as an example. I had absolutely no reason/incentive (and "incentive" is the better word) to research the etymology/history of the word "gypsy" as a young man, who grew up without the Internet. Why would I?

It DOES matter that "American actors decided to ironically or affectionately adopt it". That is the reason for the change in the word's connotation and emotional affinity (at least in the US)."

Being ignorant of a word’s origins doesn’t excuse its use once you discover the meaning. I have a hard time believing that you would possibly tell an offended Romani person, “oh, it’s okay, it is not really a slur when I say it.”

Its use came out of its use as a slur. It is still erroneously used to label the Romani people, even in the US. It is still used in popular culture that way. 

And honestly- how many working actors in 2018 refer to themselves as “gypsies” outside of the Robe or Gypsy of the Year? It smacks of a midcentury sensibility that no longer exists.

Updated On: 7/14/18 at 10:52 PM

Steve C. said: "^ very respectfully, I agree with JA's thoughtful post"

 

Me too.