West Side Story Revival Details - Page 3

[msmp]

Posted: 10/28/19 at 1:06am

Call_me_jorge said: "msmp said: "ljay889 said: "Apparently most of the book is being cut."

Kinda curious how they managed to get the Bernstein estate to sign off on all these changes (assuming the rumors are true) given how fiercely protective they are of his work. Unless there's been a significant change in who the trustee administering the estate is, that's the most surprising part of all of this."

If the cuts only pertain to the book wouldn’t they only need the permission from the Laurent estate? Or both?

"

There's been talk that they've cut songs ("I Feel Pretty" and/or altered the score as well, so that would definitely require the Bernstein estate's participation. I think you're right that if it is just the book, it'd only be the Laurent estate, though (unless, I suppose, the book cut altered a song/reprise somehow).

[Ledaero]

Posted: 10/28/19 at 2:53am

LuPita2 said: "Besides the negative stuff on social media, there's been virtually no buzz about this production. Are people here genuinely excited to see this?"

I'm stoked for this production. West Side Story was created and viewed as a piece of experimental theatre back in 1957, so it's only appropriate that Von Hove tackles it for today's audience. I have no idea what it'll be, but it'll be something different and interesting. I'm sure it'll be far better than what will likely be a very vanilla remake that Spielberg is directing.

And as for Amar politics, the average ticket buyer will have no idea about any of it. Us theatre people make up (I would guess) 5% of ticket sales on Broadway. Majority are tourists who have likely never seen a piece of theatre in their life, let alone know some niche information on a ballet dancer's poor actions. They're just looking for a musical to cross "Go to a Broadway show" off their NYC list, and West Side Story is a name some will recognize and be intrigued enough to buy. Yes, the NYTimes and other news outlets had some articles on Amar, but once again the average viewer is not reading any of that. If this flops, it won't be because of him.

[bwayphreak234]

Posted: 10/28/19 at 7:56am

ljay889 said: "Now this new revival, this is definitely NOT going to be West Side Story. I have a feeling it’ll make theOklahoma revival look traditional."

I was thinking the same thing... At least Oklahoma! didn't touch the text or score...

 

[ljay889]

Posted: 10/28/19 at 11:08am

bwayphreak234 said: "ljay889 said: "Now this new revival, this is definitely NOT going to be West Side Story. I have a feeling it’ll make theOklahoma revival look traditional."

I was thinking the same thing... At least Oklahoma! didn't touch the text or score...

"

Exactly!

[Archosaur Cladogram]

Posted: 10/28/19 at 7:02pm

On the West Side Story Instagram page today, two stories were posted of the rehearsal sheet music for "Tonight (Quintet)". Bernado's part is still in English, and on the second story you can see in the credits where it says "(Based on original orchestrations by Leonard Bernstein)" does that mean the orchestrations are similar?

[wish i were here2]

Posted: 10/28/19 at 7:06pm

bwayphreak234 said: "ljay889 said: "Now this new revival, this is definitely NOT going to be West Side Story. I have a feeling it’ll make theOklahoma revival look traditional."

I was thinking the same thing... At least Oklahoma! didn't touch the text or score..."

 

I feel like they're going to try to make this seem like it's going to be more of an Oklahoma!-esque revival, when in actuality its going to be more like a Carousel-esque revival. 

[SouthernCakes]

Posted: 10/28/19 at 7:55pm

I imagine a lot of blank space and video close ups. And the choreography will be the big drastic change.

[Dancingthrulife2]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 1:01am

I wonder what Daniel Fish might’ve done with the material. WSS fit his version to put on something that reflects on a community’s need for an outsider to stay together. It comments on xenophobia more aptly than Oklahoma! in terms of the script by focusing on the desperation and struggle of the outsiders more. In terms of something in between, I still think fondly of the Signature Theatre (Arlington) production. I wish more NY audience could’ve got to see it. Still, I look forward to the upcoming production as long as van Hove’s approach is more substance than gimmicks.

[JBroadway]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 8:44am

I understand why so many people are comparing this to Oklahoma, but it’s important to remember that this revival was announced (with Van Hove’s involvement) well before the Oklahoma revival got any sort of real attention. It had played at Bard, and announced its St. Ann’s run, but that’s it - definitely no talk of Broadway or Tony Awards at that point.

Plus, Van Hove has been doing work like this for a long time. Probably a lot longer than Daniel Fish, and if not, then at least a lot more in the public spotlight. And Daniel Fish’s work on Oklahoma was very much drawn from the European style of theatre-making, a category within which Van Hove has been a major player for well over a decade. I’m not calling Daniel Fish derivative, but I am saying we DEFINITELY shouldn’t be implying that Van Hove is derivative of Fish.

I just think that while it’s natural to think of this revival in relation to the Oklahoma revival, it’s important to remember that this production of WSS is not trying to copy, or ride the coattails of Oklahoma.

And on a separate note: to those of you who are saying that making cuts to the book would make this “not West Side Story” - do you feel that way about 95% of Shakespeare productions from the past 20 years? Or many Sondheim revivals, for that matter? And if they are making cuts, what do you expect them to do, call the show something else? Despite having the same score, plot, characters, themes, and much of the same dialogue as West Side Story? The purist mentality is truly mind-boggling to me.

[everythingtaboo]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 9:56am

The OP should really rename this thread to "West Side Story Revival Speculation" because there's really no true detail of anything yet. 

[JSquared2]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 10:37am

SouthernCakes said: "I imagine a lot of blank space and video close ups. And the choreography will be the big drastic change."

You should work on developing a better imagination.

 

[SouthernCakes]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 11:11am

Is that an attempt at humor?

[trpguyy]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 12:57pm

everythingtaboo said: "The OP should really rename this thread to "West Side Story Revival Speculation" because there's really no true detail of anything yet."

Some of the speculation is quite accurate. 

Updated On: 10/29/19 at 12:57 PM

[HogansHero]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 1:06pm

everythingtaboo said: "The OP should really rename this thread to "West Side Story Revival Speculation" because there's really no true detail of anything yet."

Thank you. The pitiable pre-angst here is pure gossip-driven, not to mention that how any truth in that gossip resonates - the only thing that actually matters - is by definition imponderable. What we know is that we have a brilliant and imaginative director (that not everyone loves) and the most exciting choreographer to arrive here since I guess Bill T. Jones knocked our socks off in Spring Awakening. Which for some reason brings to mind a Mr. T quote that is probably best left unstated.

[ljay889]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 1:11pm

JBroadway said: "I understand why so many people are comparing this to Oklahoma, but it’s important to remember that this revival was announced (with Van Hove’s involvement) well before the Oklahoma revival got any sort of real attention. It had played at Bard, and announced its St. Ann’s run, but that’s it - definitely no talk of Broadway or Tony Awards at that point.

Plus, Van Hove has been doing work like this for a long time. Probably a lot longer than Daniel Fish, and if not, then at least a lot more in the public spotlight. And Daniel Fish’s work on Oklahoma was very much drawn from the European style of theatre-making, a category within which Van Hove has been a major player for well over a decade. I’m not calling Daniel Fish derivative, but I am saying we DEFINITELY shouldn’t be implying that Van Hove is derivative of Fish.

I just think that while it’s natural to think of this revival in relation to the Oklahoma revival, it’s important to remember that this production of WSS is not trying to copy, or ride the coattails of Oklahoma.

And on a separate note: to those of you who are saying that making cuts to the book would make this “not West Side Story” - do you feel that way about 95% of Shakespeare productions from the past 20 years? Or many Sondheim revivals, for that matter? And if they are making cuts, what do you expect them to do, call the show something else? Despite having the same score, plot, characters, themes, and much of the same dialogue as West Side Story? The purist mentality is truly mind-boggling to me. "

We don’t know whether the drastic cuts to the text are true or not, but what recent Sondheim revivals have made drastic changes to the text? The recent off broadway revival of Pacific Overtures featured a condensed book of one act, trimmed by John Doyle and John Weidman himself. The Company revival has book updates revised by Sondheim under guidance from Marianne Elliot. I don’t think these examples are comparable to the rumored drastic changes to the text of this new WSS revival. This revival would likely never happen if Arthur Laurents were still alive. 

Updated On: 10/29/19 at 01:11 PM

[JBroadway]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 1:59pm

^well, the recent off-Broadway revival of Merrily, for one. Very drastic changes, which were obviously approved, but I don’t believe they were implemented by the writers

But also: I don’t agree that it really makes much of a difference having the original writers doing the changes. Sondheim made changes for this Company revival in order to suit the director’s vision, same thing for Pacific Overtures. They were director-driven changes, even the writers implemented them. I don’t see that as being all that different from Van Hove and Rudin making changes to the text for their purposes, since they will be approved by the estate regardless. I think we are conditioned in the arts world to immediately assume that the writer knows best, especially in the current cultural climate of “cannons” and such (see MCU, Harry Potter, etc.). But in practice, I don’t think anyone would have known the difference if Weidman hadn’t worked with Doyle on the book of Pacific Overtures, for example. If anything, I think it can lead to changes for the worse. I personally don’t care for the new lyrics in Company, and I think many of the changes Sondheim has made to his own work over the years have not been for the better.

And anyway - my Shakespeare example still stands regardless. Is it no longer Hamlet if they cut it down to 2.5 hours?

[ljay889]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 2:21pm

The Merrily revival used all additional text from George Furth’s drafts, and as you said, was obviously approved by Sondheim.
I just feel this WSS is a different animal from anything we’ve seen.
Again its all rumors, but apparently Sondheim is letting them try certain changes until he sees it on the stage, and then decides to keep it or not. Which would make sense given there’s an extremely long preview period.

[HogansHero]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 3:06pm

trpguyy said: "everythingtaboo said: "The OP should really rename this thread to "West Side Story Revival Speculation" because there's really no true detail of anything yet."

Some of the speculation is quite accurate."

Unless you put more meat on the bones, that's just nonsense. First, how do you know? and second, unless you have never been involved in a production, one would expect you to appreciate that nothing is carved in (or out of) stone at this point. It's a process, the goal is to make everything work, and in this case the track record suggests it is likely to. Does everyone here love Ivo's work? No. But that's irrelevant to this discussion. 

[Dollypop]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 3:14pm

I can't understand why people are criticizing a show that hasn't even gone into previews.

[Robbie2]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 8:15pm

I heard Sondheim's inspired by Ivan's vision

[Kad]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 8:50pm

trpguyy said: "everythingtaboo said: "The OP should really rename this thread to "West Side Story Revival Speculation" because there's really no true detail of anything yet."

Some of the speculation is quite accurate."

I can also verify that some of the speculation indeed reflects what is currently going with this revival. 

[JBroadway]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 9:06pm

ljay889 said: "The Merrily revival used all additional text from George Furth’s drafts" 

 

But they also inserted a scene from the original play, AND trimmed the show down to 1h45m, AND made some stylistic choices that impacted the text (like reversing the words of "how did you get to be here" during one of the transitions). All of these decisions presumably approved by Sondheim, but didn't seem to be implemented by him. They were director-driven. 

 

"I just feel this WSS is a different animal from anything we’ve seen."

 

What about some of these older shows that credit a book writer with "updated book" or "additional material"? Amanda Green for "Kiss Me Kate," Douglas Carter Beane for "Cinderella," Harvey Fierstein for "Funny Girl," David Henry Hwang for "Flower Drum Song," John Weidman for "Anything Goes," and so on and so on. Just last year we had a production of "Iceman Cometh" that shaved something like 40 minutes from the text. These changes may or may not have been well-received, and they may or may not have been less drastic changes than WSS will face. But they were all changes that were not implemented by the original book writers/playwrights. And did anyone complain that it was "no longer Flower Drum Song"? Or "no longer Anything Goes"? Or "No longer Iceman Cometh"? Probably not, because nobody really cared about the scripts/books of those shows. And once again, we have countless Shakespeare productions, and Chekhov productions, and Ibsen productions, and productions of ancient Greek plays, that are constantly being altered updated - and people may complain about specific choices, but they seldom complain about the act of changing things on principal. 

The only reason people are mad about West Side Story potentially being changed is because they are attached to this particular book in its original state, and unlike with Shakespeare and Chekhov, they aren't USED to this text being changed. And that's not an artistic principal, that's just people having knee-jerk emotional reactions to an idea that is unfamiliar to them. 

Updated On: 10/29/19 at 09:06 PM

[scarlet721]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 10:12pm

Actually, there was quite a bit of push back when Flower Drum Song played, it lead to the new (then) term of "revisal" being used.  

There was also annoyance at the additions/edits make to Cinderella a few years back.

But the news cycle is so fast this day that although nothing ever really disappears from the internet, it is easy to overlook what was said in 2003

[ljay889]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 11:05pm

I wish PalJoey still posted on here.

[JBroadway]

Posted: 10/29/19 at 11:44pm

scarlet721 said: "Actually, there was quite a bit of push back when Flower Drum Song played, it lead to the new (then) term of "revisal" being used.

There was also annoyance at the additions/edits make to Cinderella a few years back.

But the news cycle is so fast this day that although nothing ever really disappears from the internet, it is easy to overlook what was said in 2003"

 

That is interesting, and if that's true, then I stand corrected on that particular point.

But that then raises the question: What about now? What's the legacy of that pushback after these years? Do people STILL care about the changes made to Cinderella and Flower Drum Song? It feels to me like we've just collectively accepted the new versions of these shows as having their own place in the cannon. I guess if I were to ask one of the people who complained about the changes to Cinderella, they would still probably be opposed to them. But from a broader, more collective standpoint, it feels to me that all of those productions that I named are remembered more for their quality. If the changes worked, the production is remembered positively. If they didn't, it's remembered negatively. But the mere fact that changes were made by someone who isn't the author? Doesn't feel all that controversial after time has passed. Which connects back to my earlier point about this being a knee-jerk reaction to the unfamiliar. 

And what about something more recent like Iceman Cometh? I was on this message board then, and I have no memory of some big uproar around the trimming of the script. Why get mad about West Side Story and not Iceman Cometh? 

I realize a lot of what I'm saying in this post is conjecture based on my subjective impressions. But am I wrong about this? For those of you in this thread that are mad about the rumored changes to WSS: do you feel the same way about all the other examples I mentioned?