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The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'

The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'

Wayman_Wong
#1The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/9/24 at 10:04pm

Last week, the Tony nominators failed to nominate the historic "Here Lies Love" for Best Musical and to me, it showed a disappointing lack of judgment. This acclaimed, Obie-winning, one-of-a-kind spectacle was more than just another closed show. Under Alex Timbers' dynamic direction, his immensely immersive vision blazed a bold new way a musical could be staged. With theatergoers grooving to a beat on the dance floor and spectators seated in the mezzanine, David Byrne and Fatboy Slim's incredibly catchy disco-pop musical played all over the reconfigured Broadway Theatre. It turned the audience into witnesses and participants in the rise and fall of Ferdinand and Imelda Marcos, and became a cautionary fable about fascism and the fragility of democracy. And the amazing ensemble that brought it all to life was making its own history as the first all-Filipino cast on Broadway. It's their passion and power that has energized ''Here Lies Love'': from winning the 2013 Outer Critics Circle prize for Outstanding Off-Broadway Musical at the Public, to getting nominated for Best New Musical at the 2015 Olivier Awards in London, to its current 2024 Drama League nomination for Outstanding Revival of a Musical.

Unfortunately, the Tony nominators didn't show "Here Lies Love'' the kind of love I had hoped for. Yes, it got 4 nominations: Byrne and Slim for Score; David Korins for Scenic Design; Annie B. Parsons for Choreography, and M.L. Dogg and Cody Spencer for Sound. And bravo to them all, but "Here Lies Love" deserved much more. You know what was glaringly missing? Any Tony recognition of the Asian and Asian-American contributions to the show. No Best Musical nod, which would've included Filipino producers Jose Antonio Vargas and Clint Ramos, who also designed the costumes, not to mention co-producers H.E.R., Jo Koy or Lea Salonga, who also played Aurora Aquino. No acting nominations for Arielle Jacobs, Jose Llana or Conrad Ricamora. Let's be clear: I'm not implying the Tony nominators did anything anti-Asian regarding ''Here Lies Love.'' What's awards-worthy is always subjective. That's just how the votes fell. Nor do I believe Asians automatically deserve Tony nominations just for being Asian. But it's not a great look when not a single Filipino in ''Here Lies Love'' gets nominated. Especially when Broadway aims to be more inclusive and celebrate diversity.

The sad lack of Tony acknowledgment of any of its all-Filipino cast also underscores the lack of opportunities for Asian-Americans to be seen and literally prized on Broadway. Jacobs had such a Herculean role as Imelda: She acted, sang and danced her way from one end of the theater to the other, climbing up and down stairs to the mezzanine. Plus, Jacobs pulled off 18 costume changes during the 90-minute show. If Jacobs had been nominated, she would've been only the fifth Asian woman up for Leading Actress in a Musical in Tony's 77-year history. Llana, a past Drama Desk winner, played Marcos, and Ricamora, a 2024 Drama League nominee for both his work in ''Here Lies Love'' and ''Oh, Mary!,'' played Ninoy Aquino. If Llana or Ricamora had been Tony-nominated, he would've been the first Asian man up for Featured Actor in a Musical since Isao Sato in ''Pacific Overtures'' - almost 50 years ago! (And had Eva Noblezada been nominated for ''The Great Gatsby,'' she would've been the first Asian performer with 3 Tony nominations.)

Contrast that with the progress Asian performers are making elsewhere at other showbiz awards: Last year, Michelle Yeoh became the first Southeast Asian to win the Best Actress Oscar (for ''Everything Everywhere All at Once'' ) in the Academy's nearly century-old history. And her co-star, Ke Huy Quan, became the first Asian man to win an Oscar for Best Supporting Actor since Haing S. Ngor (''The Killing Fields'' ) in 1985 - almost 40 years ago! Earlier this January, Steven Yeun and Ali Wong became the first Asian pair of performers to win Emmys for Outstanding Lead Actor and Actress in a Limited Series for ''Beef'' on Netflix. Meantime, Asian performers still have to fight to get nominated at the Tonys. Back in 1991, Jonathan Pryce, a Caucasian actor in "yellow face," won the Tony for playing the Engineer in "Miss Saigon." Over 25 years later, Jon Jon Briones, a Filipino-American actor who was a Drama Desk and Olivier nominee and Theatre World Award recipient, couldn't even get a Tony nomination for the same role in the 2017 revival.

What's sad is "Here Lies Love" was poised to make MORE history. It was playing the Broadway Theatre, the same theater where "Miss Saigon" had its casting controversy 33 years ago (a story I broke in the New York Daily News). Now more than 3 decades later, "Here Lies Love" opened with an all-Filipino cast that included Salonga, who first starred in ''Miss Saigon.'' What a wonderful, full-circle story it would've been if the Tonys had recognized that history and progress with a Best Musical nomination. Instead, it's like what Imelda sings in ''Here Lies Love'': ''Why don't you love me?''

Oh, well. In the graveyard of shuttered shows that deserved better, here lies ''Love.'' Gone but not forgotten, at least not by its most fervent fans. May its short-lived stay of nearly 200 performances someday inspire a long-running, Asian-American hit musical on Broadway and beyond!

Updated On: 5/9/24 at 10:04 PM

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TotallyEffed
#2The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/9/24 at 10:16pm

I saw this off-Broadway and felt embarrassed that I didn’t like it. Everyone seemed to love it downtown. I gave it another chance on Broadway and liked it even less. I just don’t connect with the material at all.

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binau
#3The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 2:37am

Everyone speaks about the mediocre season but forgetting we had ‘here lies love’. Come on if this was pulling >1 million a week right now I think we all know it’d probably be the front runner for best musical right now. It is rare for something to truly break the mould and be so innovative - this was nothing like we’ve ever seen on Broadway. It was like a high energy art installation cross club and musical with brilliant staging, performances and some genuine catchy music. 
 

I can’t explain why it didn’t work - if they transferred immediately after the off Broadway run while the hype was still alive and didn’t wait until culturally we became a miserable victim culture on social media trying to pretend we are all ‘offended’ at the material when it’s not offensive perhaps it might have worked. 
 

The thing about a ‘party’, which the show is. And I say this as someone who HAS genuinely partied in Ibiza, Mykonos, London and New York - I’m not just pretending I know what it is like - there is nothing that sucks the energy out of it more than a bad crowd or empty dance floor. And without that momentum early on I think the show was also doomed. 
 

I saw it twice, and even though the performance was technically better the first time with Jacobs because her vocals were jaw dropping. It was a better show with her alternate simply because it had sold more tickets on a weekend and the audience had more energy. 
 

$35 USD for a standing dance floor ticket was incredible value. 


"You can't overrate Bernadette Peters. She is such a genius. There's a moment in "Too Many Mornings" and Bernadette doing 'I wore green the last time' - It's a voice that is just already given up - it is so sorrowful. Tragic. You can see from that moment the show is going to be headed into such dark territory and it hinges on this tiny throwaway moment of the voice." - Ben Brantley (2022) "Bernadette's whole, stunning performance [as Rose in Gypsy] galvanized the actors capable of letting loose with her. Bernadette's Rose did take its rightful place, but too late, and unseen by too many who should have seen it" Arthur Laurents (2009) "Sondheim's own favorite star performances? [Bernadette] Peters in ''Sunday in the Park,'' Lansbury in ''Sweeney Todd'' and ''obviously, Ethel was thrilling in 'Gypsy.'' Nytimes, 2000

Sammy232
#4The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 7:31am

I was genuinely shocked that Alex Timbers didn't receive a nomination for direction. He was the ringleader of something so innovative, that really tried to move Broadway forward. 

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Wick3
#5The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 8:24am

Also remember that Tony Awards is a competition so you have to take in consideration the other nominees this season. Had Kimberly Akimbo, A Strange Loop, Moulin Rouge, Hadestown, Band’s Visit, Dear Evan Hansen, and Hamilton been in the same season together, unfortunately only 4 or 5 would be nominated for Best Musical.

I loved Here Lies Love and looking back, I think it would have fared better had it gone to Broadway during the 2013-2014 or 2014-2015 seasons. Would it have beaten A Gentleman’s Guide to Love and Murder or Fun Home? We will never know but I think Here Lies Love would have had an easier time to least get nominated for Best Musical. 

I think Tony’s should publicize the voting results (either by % or total number of votes.) For all we know, Here Lies Love or another musical we were rooting for might have ranked 6th in terms of getting the most nominator votes for Best Musical, just missing a spot! Doing so would also provide more transparency in this industry.

hearthemsing22
#6The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 8:24am

So Tony nominators should have voted just to fulfill certain quotas? You don't get a nomination for costume changes. You also kind of answered your own...question? here..

"What's awards-worthy is always subjective. That's just how the votes fell." 

In an extremely crowded season, that's how the votes fell. What exactly would publicizing the voting results accomplish? What good would it do?  

Updated On: 5/10/24 at 08:24 AM

Wick3 Profile Photo
Wick3
#7The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 8:34am

hearthemsing22 said: "What exactly would publicizing the voting results accomplish? What good would it do?"

Transparency.

Though some shows like How to Dance in Ohio, Harmony, Heart of Rock Roll, etc didn’t get any Tony nominations, we can at least see if there were Tony voters who gave them some love. 
 

Kad Profile Photo
Kad
#8The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 8:47am

Would artists really want to know they missed out on a nomination by one or two votes? Or if nobody voted for their work at all? I’m not sure which would be more disappointing. 


"...everyone finally shut up, and the audience could enjoy the beginning of the Anatevka Pogram in peace."

Dreamboy3
#9The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 8:51am

Sammy232 said: "I was genuinely shocked that Alex Timbers didn't receive a nomination for direction. He was theringleader of something so innovative, that really tried to move Broadway forward."

I am genuinely shocked at the admiration given to Timbers. His direction is all about calling attention to how clever he is to the detriment of the narrative of the work he is directing. I always find his shows to be narratively incoherent which is exactly what I thought of HLL. 

JBM84
#10The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 9:08am

Conrad should have gotten a nom for Ninoy for sure, and not getting a nom for Best Musical feels more like the committee forgot shows opened in 2023.

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inception
#11The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 9:18am

binau said: " .


$35 USD for a standing dance floor ticket was incredible value.
"

$35 for a standing dance floor ticket was why it flopped.


...

hearthemsing22
#12The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 9:57am

Wick3 said: "hearthemsing22 said: "What exactly would publicizing the voting results accomplish? What good would it do?"

Transparency.

Though some shows like How to Dance in Ohio, Harmony, Heart of Rock Roll, etc didn’t get any Tony nominations, we can at least see if there were Tony voters who gave them some love.

"

Tonys are a fraction of what helps a show succeed. Box office receipts. Those speak much louder than Tony votes. Why are we so demanding? We're not obligated to see those results. Awards never owe us results of votes whether it's the Oscars, Grammys, Emmys or Tonys- they never owe us those things. 

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Barbour Pole
#13The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 10:49am

Well the unnecessary dustup with the musicians union didn't help.

It would've been interesting to see this running in split screen with Illinoise.  Two musicals based on albums but HLL using a track and Illinoise showing how much more magical it is to use live singers and musicians.

 

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muscle23ftl
#14The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 10:52am

I'm shocked it got any nominations at all, it was absolute crap without live music. I felt bad for the talented cast but the material was terrible. Almost an insult to all the people from the Philippines to be represented with such low quality abroad.


"People have their opinions and that doesn't mean that their opinions are wrong or right. I just take it with a grain of salt because opinions are like as*holes, everyone has one". -Felicia Finley-

Broadway61004
#15The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 10:54am

The reality is that this season was oversaturated with new musicals, especially this spring, and therefore shows from 7 months ago were bound to be forgotten. There were also a couple controversies surrounding this: 1) The attempt to get out of paying musicians which rubbed a lot of people wrong. And 2) It being declared a new musical even though it opened 11 years ago. Which, right or wrong, generated some negative responses and probably had to do with Timbers not being nominated (I wager that "he already did that 10 years ago" was uttered more than once).

And lastly, while the voting for the sake of commercial viability has lessened over the past 30 years, it's still a factor. So a flop that closed 7 months ago and isn't going to tour is already at a disadvantage against shows like Hell's Kitchen and The Outsiders.

Add it all up and it should in no way be surprising this was left out.

Updated On: 5/10/24 at 10:54 AM

Wayman_Wong
#16The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 11:04am

''So Tony nominators should have voted just to fulfill certain quotas?''

Whenever it's pointed out that actors of color haven't gotten nominated, someone always brings up this lame straw-man argument. No one is arguing for racial quotas. But how hard it is to believe that actors of color who are talented and deserving might be disadvantaged by the awards system in place? Without getting into the debate over Yul Brynner's disputed ethnic heritage, only 3 Asian performers have ever won a Tony in 77 years: Lea Salonga, B.D. Wong and Ruthie Ann Miles. That's a reflection of how few opportunities Asian-Americans have gotten on Broadway, and the tastes of the Tony nominators. Of course, it's hard to add to the list of winners ... if Asian performers can't even get nominated.

Remember the 2015 Academy Awards? There were 20 slots for acting nominees, and all of them went to Caucasian actors. There was a public outcry that became known as OscarsSoWhite. What were the odds right? Just a fluke, surely. Then it happened again at the 2016 Oscars. No acting nominees of color. Embarrassed, the Academy did some soul searching, and decided to  expand the Academy's voting membership, which for decades had been overwhelmingly dominated by older white men and their tastes. 

This all happened within the last decade. Back in 2002, Halle Berry made history as the first African-American to win Best Actress for ''Monster's Ball.'' Notably, Sidney Poitier was the first African-American to win Best Actor for ''Lilies in the Field'' in 1964 - nearly 40 years earlier. When Berry won, it was widely hailed as a breakthrough. And yet here it is 2024 - over two decades later - and no other black woman has won Best Actress. In nearly a century of the Academy Awards, does anyone really believe that only one black woman was worthy of winning Best Actress? Last year, Michelle Yeoh (''Everything Everywhere All at Once'' ) became only the second woman of color and the first East Asian to win Best Actress.

I, for one, look forward to the day when it's no longer ''historic'' for actors of color to finally get the recognition they deserve. But for now, the facts are the facts. B.D. Wong is the only Asian to win a Tony for Featured Actor in a Play for ''M. Butterfly'' in 1988. That's over 35 years ago! No Asian man has ever been Tony-nominated for Leading Actor in a Play. No Asian man has ever won a Tony for Leading Actor in a Musical. Will it happen in my lifetime? We'll just wait and see. 

Updated On: 5/10/24 at 11:04 AM

chrishuyen
#17The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 11:48am

Subjectively, there are a few categories where I personally thought Here Lies Love would have "deserved" a nomination over other people who were nominated.  But we also know Tony voting is as much of a political game as any other awards show--there are benefits to creating relationships and goodwill, and then there's also just the fact that it can be hard to remember back to a show that happened over 6 months ago when 10 shows just opened in the last 2 weeks.

For what it's worth, I was pleasantly surprised at how many nominations HLL DID get.  I was VERY happy to see the score nom (I thought the closed show score nom might go to Harmony instead and the score is very different from how a musical theater score usually operates), though I've seen some grumbling about it based on the musicians controversy.  Set and Sound were no brainers (though I was surprised it didn't pick up lighting too), and as much as I loved the show I did think Choreography was a bit of a head scratcher (compared to some of the other shows that didn't get nominated). 

I saw a little bit of a narrative online about how between KPOP and HLL, it seemed like Asian shows were flopping and I hope it's not the case that producers want to take fewer chances on Asian-centered works on Broadway because of that, so I can only hope there would be more shows in the future that WOULD nominate Asian performers and creatives in these categories.  Could it have been different if HLL opened later in the season? In most likelihood yes, but I guess that will just be one of the what ifs lost to theater history.

hearthemsing22
#18The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 11:50am

Wayman_Wong said: "''So Tony nominators should have voted just to fulfill certain quotas?''

Whenever it's pointed out that actors of color haven't gotten nominated, someone always brings upthis lame straw-man argument. No one is arguing for racial quotas. But how hard it is to believe that actors of color who are talented and deservingmight be disadvantaged by the awards system in place? Without getting into the debate over Yul Brynner's disputed ethnic heritage, only 3 Asian performers have ever won a Tony in 77 years: Lea Salonga, B.D. Wong and Ruthie Ann Miles. That's a reflection of how few opportunities Asian-Americans have gottenon Broadway, and the tastes of the Tony nominators. Of course, it's hard to add to the list of winners ... if Asian performerscan't even get nominated.

Remember the 2015 Academy Awards? There were 20 slots for acting nominees, and all of them went to Caucasian actors. There was a public outcry that became known as OscarsSoWhite. What were the odds right? Just a fluke, surely. Then it happened again at the 2016 Oscars. No acting nominees of color. Embarrassed, the Academy did some soul searching, and decided to expand the Academy's voting membership, which for decades had been overwhelmingly dominated by older white men and their tastes.

This all happened within the last decade. Back in 2002, Halle Berry made history as the first African-American to win Best Actressfor ''Monster's Ball.'' Notably, Sidney Poitier was the first African-American to win Best Actor for ''Lilies in the Field'' in 1964 - nearly 40 years earlier. When Berry won, it was widely hailed as a breakthrough. And yet here it is 2024 - over two decades later - and no other black woman has won Best Actress. In nearly a century of the Academy Awards, does anyone really believe that only one black woman was worthy of winning Best Actress? Last year, Michelle Yeoh (''Everything Everywhere All at Once'' ) became only the second woman of color and the first East Asian to win Best Actress.

I, for one, look forward to the day when it's no longer ''historic'' for actors of color to finally get the recognition they deserve. But for now, the facts are the facts. B.D. Wong is the only Asian to win a Tony for Featured Actor in a Play for ''M. Butterfly'' in 1988. That's over 35 years ago! No Asian man has ever been Tony-nominated for Leading Actor in a Play. No Asian man has ever won a Tony for Leading Actor in a Musical. Will it happen in my lifetime? We'll justwait and see.
"

Brushing aside the fact that you called my argument "lame straw-man" (nice. thanks. You could have just said everything else without insulting me or whoever uses that), you're absolutely right about everything else. But how does this change? Publicizing the votes won't change anything. So. What do we propose?

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Kad
#19The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 12:00pm

chrishuyen said: "
I saw a little bit of a narrative online about how between KPOP and HLL, it seemed like Asian shows were flopping and I hope it's not the case that producers want to take fewer chances on Asian-centered works on Broadway because of that, so I can only hope there would be more shows in the future that WOULD nominate Asian performers and creatives in these categories. Could it have been different if HLL opened later in the season? In most likelihood yes, but I guess that will just be one of the what ifs lost to theater history."

I certainly hope that the thing producers take away from both KPOP and HLL flopping is not an avoidance of AAPI-centered work. Both shows were hampered by bad, ineffective marketing and different, flawed attempts to make an immersive production that worked off-Broadway translate to Broadway- KPOP threw out the immersive aspect the show was built around and rewrote the entire show to be something far more pedestrian and HLL just tried to scale up what worked downtown a decade ago in an attempt to capture lighting in a bottle.

I think HLL did as well with Tony nominations as it possibly could've considering it closed in November and there was such a glut of new productions.


"...everyone finally shut up, and the audience could enjoy the beginning of the Anatevka Pogram in peace."

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The Distinctive Baritone
#20The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/10/24 at 4:03pm

I don't have any particular feelings about HLL, but if we are going to discuss a lack of Asian Tony winners and nominees in the acting categories, it should be pointed out that according to the 2020 census, only about 6% of people in the United States are of Asian heritage. So if the racial representation of actors across Broadway shows these past few seasons is more or less commiserate with U.S. demographics (and I'm guessing they generally have been), then statistically speaking, Asian performers would still make up the smallest racial group on Broadway, and that would likely be reflected at the Tony Awards.

Wayman_Wong
#21The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/11/24 at 12:05am

''Brushing aside the fact that you called my argument "lame straw-man" (nice. thanks. You could have just said everything else without insulting me or whoever uses that),''

First, Hearthemsing22, thanks for your followup comment. Second, I made a distinction. I think the quotas argument is ''lame, straw-man,'' not the person making it. As a person of color, I guess I'm especially sensitive to the topic of ''quotas''; to me, it often seems like a code word to dismiss the genuine concerns of minorities. On an Oscar website I used to visit in the past, there seemed to be a pushback against diversity, as if it were just part of the ''woke agenda.'' I got the impression that these folks believed the white performers won on merit, but performers of color only won because of their race. Ugh! 

As for any proposal to change things, that's tricky and complicated. For Broadway that means more diversity in what gets produced; who performs in them; who reviews them and who nominates the shows for the awards.

''If we are going to discuss a lack of Asian Tony winners and nominees in the acting categories, it should be pointed out that according to the 2020 census, only about 6% of people in the United States are of Asian heritage. So if the racial representation of actors across Broadway shows these past few seasons is more or less commiserate with U.S. demographics (and I'm guessing they generally have been), then statistically speaking, Asian performers would still make up the smallest racial group on Broadway, and that would likely be reflected at the Tony Awards.''

Except that awards aren't given out based on racial percentage, dependent on the census. If you look at the history of the Tony Awards and, say, the Academy Awards, the vast, vast majority of the awards went to Caucasians. Not because of any relationship to population, but that's because most Broadway shows and movies, for a long time, were written by, produced by and starred white people. Actors of color seldom had the opportunities or access to the type of roles that win awards. Take the Oscars. Hattie McDaniel was the first African-American to win an Oscar in 1940 for ''Gone With the Wind.'' Another African-American wouldn't win until 1964: Sidney Poitier. I'd argue that the Oscars did NOT reflect the black percentage of the U.S. population, roughly 12%, for decades. Even in 2015 AND 2016, all of the 40 acting Oscar nominees were white. You get the nominees you get, based on the tastes of the nominators. And if you have a voting membership of overwhelming white older men, you get THEIR choices. Things have changed since the Academy has made efforts to diversify its membership. Earlier this year, 6 out of the 20 acting nominees were performers of color, and it's historically the most diverse it's even been: 4 African-Americans, 1 Latina and 1 Native American.

To bring it back to Broadway, I believe that Asians have won very few Tonys because they rarely have the opportunities or award-caliber roles that make them eligible for nominations. And even when they get those rare roles, the nominators passed them over, or held others in higher regard.

 

Updated On: 5/11/24 at 12:05 AM

Wick3 Profile Photo
Wick3
#22The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/11/24 at 10:11am

Kad said: "Would artists really want to know they missed out on a nomination by one or two votes? Or if nobody voted for their work at all? I’m not sure which would be more disappointing."

Given the current setup, we'll never know the answer. I agree transparency can hurt too but at least we all know the truth.

Also, for Best Musical or any category, if there are 5 nominees, it's totally possible to win that category with only 21% of the votes (or if there are 4 nominees, it's possible to win with only 26% of votes.)  For any data person, that would be interesting to see. Yes, I have a feeling Hamilton probably got over 80% of the votes in 2016 for Best Musical, but for other seasons, I wouldn't be surprised if the show that won Best Musical may have gotten only 21-30% of votes to get the win. 

I only brought it up because I think Tony nominators did show love to Here Lies Love. I think some nominators put HLL in their list for Best Musical but not enough did for the show to get a nomination. We would know if they published results but we'll never know given the current setup.

Updated On: 5/11/24 at 10:11 AM

The Distinctive Baritone Profile Photo
The Distinctive Baritone
#23The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/11/24 at 11:00am

Non-White performers were absolutely under-represented on Broadway until only a few years ago. Of course. But giving lots of Tony nominations to a long-closed flop like HLL is not going to “make up” for that racist history. Nothing can.

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muscle23ftl
#24The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/11/24 at 12:24pm

KPOP was entertaining and a much better show in my point of view, but also I remember asking many of my Pilipino friends to come see KPOP with me and they were like "I don't like KPOP, I don't like Korea". That's very sad.


"People have their opinions and that doesn't mean that their opinions are wrong or right. I just take it with a grain of salt because opinions are like as*holes, everyone has one". -Felicia Finley-

Phillyguy
#25The Tony nominators should've shown lots more love to 'Here Lies Love'
Posted: 5/11/24 at 1:32pm

muscle23ftl said: "KPOP was entertaining and a much better show in my point of view, but also I remember asking many of my Pilipino friends to come see KPOP with me and they were like "I don't like KPOP, I don't like Korea". That's very sad."


This thread just reconfirms taste is very subjective. I loved HLL but didn’t enjoy KPOP at all. 
 

I think the challenge of moving these shows to broadway is that regardless of critical receptions, it’s ultimately a commercial venue. You need people to be able to appreciate it. I think not a lot of tourists are exposed to or familiar with the subjects, genere, or musical tastes to come in large enough numbers to keep these shows successful (for now). 


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