Broadway League To Resume Releasing Weekly Grosses- Page 2

[HogansHero]

Posted: 3/21/22 at 6:09pm

Phantom4ever said: "So if the grosses show that a long runner like Aladdin, Chicago, Phantom, etc. is clearly not making its weekly nut, how long do you think producers will keep supporting these shows in the hopes that they will go back to their consistent moneymaker status? 6 months? a year?

I'm curious if there were any weeks where the old shows like Chicago or Phantom outgrossed a "newer" show like BOM or Aladdin."

With the two shows I mentioned, it's hard to say because the producers have been made so rich by the shows (among others) that it's really just their own subjective choice. (I'd put Aladdin in a diff category, both because the banked profit is not as humongous and also because they are their own landlord. As Dramamama points out, it's kinda up to the landlord but here again these producers are going to get a wide berth in terms of telling them it's time. .

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 3/21/22 at 6:44pm

At this point, I don't expect any older shows to announce closing until we see how the summer does. IF some long-running strugglers have awful numbers now, and IF those numbers don't improve quite a bit over the summer, then that should signal if it's time to pack up or not. ("Long-running" encapsulating things from Evan Hansen and Come From Away to Chicago and Phantom)

The old belief would be that these shows should announce 4-6+ months before closing and try to capitalize on people seeing them one more time (like Rent, Jersey Boys, Kinky Boots). But the New York audience has already had their chance to see these shows –– and see them cheaply –– since Broadway reopened. If the summer isn't good to them then it's probably not worth it to stick around through next Christmas.

Also remember: releasing the numbers doesn't do anything for a landlord/stop clause situation. The landlords already know how good or bad every show is doing. And if for once there isn't a glut of shows waiting to come in, it doesn't do a landlord any good to push any tenants out if the house will sit empty.

Updated On: 3/21/22 at 06:44 PM

[ACL2006]

Posted: 3/21/22 at 6:51pm

The few people omi know that have seen Chicago, all seat in the mezzanine, were told they could move down. The select pictures I've seen on socials show lots of empty seats. I'm sure Pamela Anderson will bring the crowds back for Chicago.

[GiantsInTheSky2]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 7:17am

I’m still wondering why people are so eager to see these numbers from a period of time that have so many other factors involved than just, “the show isn’t selling”. Like, okay, we’ll now know that Show A was selling slightly more than Show B…but that doesn’t give us any real indication on it from a business perspective because of everything that has been going on. It just seems weird to me. 

[dramamama611]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 7:48am

Because we like to know the facts.  JUST how bad?  Which shows ARE finding a way to make it work?  Why are they different?  I don't think I'll look terribly closely at EVERY week.....but just enough to get an idea.   

 

Oh, and then there's the fact that we are vultures.  (As many here will point out when a show continues to do poorly and is still limping along.)  I've said this in another thread: I think the theater owners are only going to give a lot of leeway here - unless they have someone ready to move in.

[BJR]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 7:57am

ACL2006 said: "The few people omi know that have seen Chicago, all seat in the mezzanine, were told they could move down. The select pictures I've seen on socials show lots of empty seats. I'm sure Pamela Anderson will bring the crowds back for Chicago."

Her run is well timed and she will indeed pack em in.

[JBroadway]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 10:05am

As has been discussed in other threads, we want to know the grosses for the same reasons we’ve always wanted to know the grosses: it’s interesting, it’s educational, it provides clarity and insight into the industry that we’ve all dedicated a large part of our lives to.

The idea that we’re all here to JUDGE these shows for their low grosses in the middle of a pandemic is the big misconception behind this whole misguided situation (now being corrected).

The grosses discussions have ALWAYS taken into account external factors with timing, and incorporated them into the analysis. That’s a BIG part of it. And this is perhaps the biggest “external factor” in Broadway history. The idea that we’d all just be sh*tting on these shows indiscriminately, without regard for the obvious obstacles, is a fundamental misunderstanding of where this analysis is coming from.

Maybe there are some people who are just happy to see their least favorite show fail, but those people would be doing that anyway.

[jkcohen626]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 10:14am

Is today the day?

What time do they usually release the info?

[EDSOSLO858]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 10:16am

jkcohen626 said: "Is today the day?

What time do they usually release the info?"

Should be mid-late afternoon

[Sutton Ross]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 10:45am

Oh, and then there's the fact that we are vultures.

Speak only for yourself here, thanks. 

it’s interesting, it’s educational, it provides clarity and insight into the industry that we’ve all dedicated a large part of our lives to.

​​​100%

[JSquared2]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 1:20pm

jkcohen626 said: "Is today the day?

What time do they usually release the info?"

 

[kdogg36]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 2:11pm

I think I've read on these boards that Phantom doesn't have a stop clause. Is this true? If so, is it the only show that doesn't have one?

[HogansHero]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 2:35pm

I don't know, kdogg, though I don't recall hearing that. It wouldn't matter, though, because stop clauses are hardly ever actually invoked, and the relationship between the shuberts and cammac/alw is such that it is virtually unimaginable. (Relationships drive quite a few of these relationships with other parties as well. By which I mean that if the Shuberts or another landlord tell a producer (at least one who wants access to a theatre in the future) to move on, no clause ever gets invoked. Beyond that, obviously Disney does not have a stop clause with itself at the New Amsterdam, and non-profits (or anyone else) producing in their own property would not either. 

[kdogg36]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 3:41pm

HogansHero said: "I don't know, kdogg, though I don't recall hearing that. It wouldn't matter, though, because stop clauses are hardly ever actually invoked, and the relationship between the shuberts and cammac/alw is such that it is virtually unimaginable. (Relationships drive quite a few of these relationships with other parties as well. By which I mean that if the Shuberts or another landlord tell a producer (at least one who wants access to a theatre in the future) to move on, no clause ever gets invoked. Beyond that, obviously Disney does not have a stop clause with itself at the New Amsterdam, and non-profits (or anyone else) producing in their own property would not either."

Thanks for that erudite response. For the record, I found the BWW thread I was referring to here (post 37). Of course I don't know how much inside information the poster has, though they're a familiar member.

[EDSOSLO858]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 3:47pm

https://www.broadwayworld.com/article/Broadway-League-Releases-Full-Grosses-Report-Grosses-For-The-Week-Ending-320-20220322

Historical data to be posted soon!

Updated On: 3/22/22 at 03:47 PM

[JBroadway]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 3:53pm

Not too shabby at all. A lot better than I expected, actually. I guess now we know why they felt comfortable starting this up again. 

[ACL2006]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 3:55pm

Essentially everyone seems to be doing well outside of TINA. The usuals are still selling out.

[VintageSnarker]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 3:58pm

GiantsInTheSky2 said: "I’m still wondering why people are so eager to see these numbers from a period of time that have so many other factors involved than just, “the show isn’t selling”. Like, okay, we’ll now know that Show A was selling slightly more than Show B…but that doesn’t give us any real indication on it from a business perspective because of everything that has been going on. It just seems weird to me."

I don’t have much interest in comparing but there are some “whys” for the shows I’m interested in. How big was the drop off for Ain’t Too Proud and when did it start? What were the numbers like for Doubtfire that would help explain the hiatus? Was Waitress doing well coming off the Jennifer Nettles run or was there already a slump that made the decision to close early easier?

[binau]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 4:04pm

Wow, those Music Man figures. 

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 4:06pm

$3.4 million in a week for MUSIC MAN. Jesus. That's got to be close to a record, right? (I think it would look like bad taste if shows started announcing those kinds of records, considering everything that's going on.)

It doesn't look like the League is sharing the percentage of Gross Potential. Hmm...

[Sauja]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 4:17pm

The Music Man numbers are staggering, but so are the numbers for Plaza Suite. For a straight play in a smaller house, that gross is ENORMOUS. And in general, Broadway looks to be back in good health after the Omicron scare!

[blaxx]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 4:20pm

Chicago was doing fine even without Anderson. It's Hadestown that is going down...

[Smaxie]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 4:23pm

Hadestown lost two shows the week before, both of its Saturday performances. 

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 4:29pm

need to copy-paste into excel and do a little math if you want things like the Average Ticket Price. here are those #s from high to low:

THE MUSIC MAN 2022-$283

HAMILTON-$213

PLAZA SUITE 2022-$213

SIX-$156

HADESTOWN-$149

MOULIN ROUGE! THE MUSICAL-$142

HARRY POTTER AND THE CURSED CHILD-$142

THE LION KING-$133

WICKED-$131

THE BOOK OF MORMON-$128

MJ THE MUSICAL-$128

TINA - THE TINA TURNER MUSICAL-$120

DEAR EVAN HANSEN-$119

COMPANY 2021-$114

AMERICAN UTOPIA 2021-$110

THE PHANTOM OF THE OPERA-$96

ALADDIN-$90

CHICAGO-$88

COME FROM AWAY-$88

TAKE ME OUT 2022-$87

BIRTHDAY CANDLES-$70

PARADISE SQUARE-$47

[Lumiere2]

Posted: 3/22/22 at 4:32pm

ErmengardeStopSniveling said: "$3.4 million in a week for MUSIC MAN. Jesus. That's got to be close to a record, right?"

The current record is Hamilton in Christmas 2018, specifically the week ending Dec. 30th 2018. They made $4.04 million over eight performances - still the only time any show has grossed more than $4 million in one week.

That being said, Music Man doing $3.45 million last week is a mammoth gross. That's a ridiculous amount of money. To compare, The Music Man made just a few thousand dollars less last week than the total gross of six other shows combined:

• Dear Evan Hansen
• Come From Away
• Tina: Tina Turner Musical
• Chicago
• Take Me Out
• Paradise Square

And those six shows sold more than three times the number of tickets that The Music Man did (38,700 for the six vs. Music Man's 12,185)