CAMELOT Returns to Broadway - Reviews Thread- Page 4

[MCfan2]

Posted: 3/30/22 at 10:15am

Count me as one of those who aren't thrilled about Sorkin. I didn't see Mockingbird, so I have no idea what he did there, but I dislike his tendency in much of his TV and film work to make all the characters into little Sorkin clones. I hope he can restrain himself a little here, but I don't know.

[fashionguru_23]

Posted: 3/30/22 at 10:22am

My biggest beef with Sorkin, is when he writes things that are based on true events, he likes to change the truth to make it a better story, or more dramatic (Molly's Game, The Social Network, etc). It always seems to me to be just enough revision to question the whole story. 

BTW, I just remember the Cubby Berstein webseries "Xanadu" did, and the hilarious exchange between Nathan Lane and Cheyanne Jackson:

CJ: [We're worried people] think our show is too 'camp'

NL: oh, that's outragious. Do they say 'Fiddler' is too Jewish? Do they say 'The Wiz" is too Black? Do they say 'Camelot' is too long?...well, actually they do

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 3/30/22 at 10:32am

I'm interested in seeing if this can be a success for Sorkin, taking him out of his comfort zone.

Mockingbird is an admirable adaptation, but his 3 most recent film scripts have really deteriorated in quality –– and he also happened to direct all 3 of those movies. He's a much, much better screenwriter when someone else is directing, and he probably needs to the collaboration of a David Fincher or a Danny Boyle or a Scott Rudin. I hope Sher can be a great collaborator who helps bring out better work from him.

[jimmycurry01]

Posted: 3/30/22 at 10:36am

fashionguru_23 said: "My biggest beef with Sorkin, is when he writes things that are based on true events, he likes to change the truth to make it a better story, or more dramatic (Molly's Game, The Social Network, etc). It always seems to me to be just enough revision to question the whole story.

 

That's the difference between making a movie based on true events and making a documentary. If you want somebody's truth, you watch a documentary, not a movie. One is meant to entertain, the other to educate. 

[dramamama611]

Posted: 3/30/22 at 10:40am

Amen.  EVERY writer embellishes the plot when it's BASED on a true story.  EVERY ONE.   

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 3/30/22 at 10:54am

jimmycurry01 said: "That's the difference between making a movie based on true events and making a documentary. If you want somebody's truth, you watch a documentary, not a movie. One is meant to entertain, the other to educate."

The arguments with Sorkin (mainly as they relate to BEING THE RICARDOS and TRIAL OF THE CHICAGO 7) is that the actual events and people were much more interesting and impactful than what he presented them to be on the screen. Some people feel his portrayal of Lucille Ball was a disservice to her in regards to HUAC and as a trailblazer, businesswoman, and comedienne (regardless of what Lucie Arnaz might say). Same with Bobby Seale, Abbie Hoffman, and some of the others portrayed in CHICAGO 7; those men became watered-down caricatures on screen.

Nobody's saying that the events have to be 100% accurate, and there often has to be some level of simplification or omission in the name of storytelling. But when your work is grounded in realism (as those two films were), one should be able to expect a certain level of integrity and respect for the real-life figures.

The other complaint is that sometimes he intellectualizes characters a little too much when a simpler vernacular would be more effective. I know some people have found his dialog for Calpurnia and some of the old racists in MOCKINGBIRD to be almost comical in its sophistication.

Luckily, none of the above will be relevant to CAMELOT, since it is a work of fiction, and all the characters in it are fairly high-status.

Will this be his first work that isn't about Americans?

[ATerrifyingAndImposingFigure]

Posted: 5/27/22 at 10:48am

Last Stars in the House, Seth Rudetsky seemed pretty sure Jordan Donica was continuing with this soon on Broadway, with no comment from the man himself on the matter.

[Dollypop]

Posted: 5/27/22 at 1:15pm

CATSNYrevival said: "I’m surprisedMorgan le Fay was in the workshop version. Aside from the concert version mentioned previously in this thread I’ve yet to see a production that didn’t cut her scenes."

 

I've done 2 productions of CAMELOT and both of them included Morgan le Fay and the Enchanted Forest

 

 

[UWS10023]

Posted: 5/30/22 at 7:12pm

ATerrifyingAndImposingFigure said: "Last Stars in the House, Seth Rudetsky seemed pretty sure Jordan Donica was continuing with this soon on Broadway, with no comment from the man himself on the matter."

It seemed Seth had an inside scoop. I would not be surprised actually given that Bart uses people again and again.

 

[jagman1062]

Posted: 5/30/22 at 7:52pm

ATerrifyingAndImposingFigure said: "Last Stars in the House, Seth Rudetsky seemed pretty sure Jordan Donica was continuing with this soon on Broadway, with no comment from the man himself on the matter."

I read in a recent thread that offers are out for the roles of Lancelot and Mordred. What role did Donica play in the benefit concert a few years ago? .Also, Donica is covering Raoul in Phantom until some time in August, which makes him available to begin rehearsals in late summer/early fall for Camelot.

[JBroadway]

Posted: 5/30/22 at 8:04pm

jagman1062 said: " What role did Donica play in the benefit concert a few years ago?"

 

Donica played Lancelot

[Musical Master]

Posted: 5/30/22 at 8:07pm

Jordan Donica did a really good job in My Fair Lady in what is honestly a thankless role. I think he would make a great Lancelot.

[inception]

Posted: 5/30/22 at 8:21pm

I was planning to go to Mexico this December, but if Jordan Donica is cast in this I may have to think about changing my plans for the time I've already got scheduled off from work. ;p

[RippedMan]

Posted: 5/30/22 at 8:41pm

Musical Master said: "Jordan Donica did a really good job in My Fair Lady in what is honestly a thankless role. I think he would make a great Lancelot."

I wanted his vocals to be more soaring on the high notes, but it was fine. 

He didn't really make much of an impression, so not sure he'd be my first choice for Lancelot. 

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 5/30/22 at 9:14pm

Are there any casting rumors for CAMELOT beyond who played the roles in the workshop?

I didn't love Donica in MFL and thought he sounded just okay with "Proud Lady" and "Finishing the Hat" on Stars in the House. For me, he's the poor man's Josh Henry or Ben Davis or Ramin Karimloo.

I love most of Bart Sher's productions, but it can almost be guaranteed that at least one actor won't be up to the vocal challenges of their particular role. Matt Morrison struggled with the high notes of South Pacific, Conrad Ricamora & Ashley Park (& Watanabe) in King & I, Jessica Hecht & Perchik in Fiddler, Ambrose & Donica in MFL. He's very much a director who wants actors who can also sing...but sometimes what he sees in the audition room doesn't translate to the stage.

[RippedMan]

Posted: 5/30/22 at 10:12pm

After Company and now Funny Girl please cast singers who act. Thank you.

[JBroadway]

Posted: 5/30/22 at 10:31pm

"singers who can act" are currently dominating the musical theatre industry - they are the rule, to which there are some exceptions. While I don't blame the performers themselves, the widespread culture of prioritizing singing over acting has heavily contributed to -- or at least closely correlates with -- the soulless, homogenized, corporate sheen that this art form has taken on. Give me an actor who can sing any day of the week (granted, as long as they actually CAN sing).

Updated On: 5/30/22 at 10:31 PM

[RippedMan]

Posted: 5/30/22 at 10:51pm

I'd agree with that sentiment for sure. But we've been spoiled by the LuPones, Fosters, Blocks, etc that can do both and do them well. 

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 5/30/22 at 11:28pm

The "singers who act" problem is especially prominent in replacement casting. They're not working with the original director and are being directed by an associate director & stage manager to fit into a mold created by someone else, generally in a shorter rehearsal period without previews.

The harsh truth is pretty much nobody is going to be equally strong as an actor and singer (and dancer). This isn't a new phenomenon –– it was probably worse in the Golden Age. The vocal performances live on in our minds through cast albums and it's easy to enhance the memory of an acting performance in your head if the vocal is good and memorable....or to assume the acting was good if you never saw it in the first place. (And opinions of how "great" a performance was can also vary depend on your seat.)

[inception]

Posted: 5/30/22 at 11:50pm

ErmengardeStopSniveling said: "Are there any casting rumors for CAMELOT beyond who played the roles in the workshop?

I didn't love Donica in MFL and thought he sounded just okay with "Proud Lady" and "Finishing the Hat" on Stars in the House. For me, he's the poor man's Josh Henry or Ben Davis or Ramin Karimloo.

I enjoyed how he performed "Proud Lady."  Is that what is meant by "singers who act?"  That he acted it out?  This is a serious question 

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 5/30/22 at 11:58pm

inception said: "I enjoyed how he performed "Proud Lady." Is that what is meant by "singers who act?" That he acted it out? This is a serious question"

When I talk about "singers who act," it's referring to people whose main talent is singing, but can also act, just not as well. But my problem with Donica is that I don't find him terribly compelling as an actor or singer.

When I talk about "actors who sing," that's referring to people like Richard Burton and Elaine Stritch –– people whose primary skill is acting; they can carry a tune and sell a song but few people would call their voices "beautiful."

[RippedMan]

Posted: 5/31/22 at 12:02am

Agreed with you there. I just don't want to pay Broadway prices to watch a non-singer "search" for the notes or in the case of My Fair Lady strain to hit the notes. I know there are capable people out there. Don't know if that is casting or director, but c'mon on now. 

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 5/31/22 at 12:31am

RippedMan said: "Agreed with you there. I just don't want to pay Broadway prices to watch a non-singer "search" for the notes or in the case of My Fair Lady strain to hit the notes. I know there are capable people out there. Don't know if that is casting or director, but c'mon on now."

It's ultimately on the director. The casting director is merely a facilitator who gets people into the room.

It can be easy to "settle" for someone if certain aspects of their performance blows you out of the water, even if they're not flawless. I would never call this laziness –– but casting is a jigsaw puzzle and there's more to a performance than the way someone hits one note. If a director is searching for perfection in every role, they could easily drive themself crazy...or never get the show off the ground.

Unless it's a one-note role. If you're doing LES MIS, you had better make sure Cosette sings the final 16 bars of Heart Full of Love flawlessly in her callback; the Star-to-Be in ANNIE had better be a fierce belter!

(Don't let Twitter see this conversation, they'll complain about the "transphobia" of people wanting certain vocal ranges in musical theatre.......)

Updated On: 5/31/22 at 12:31 AM

[JasonC3]

Posted: 5/31/22 at 7:05am

I'm not sure I agree with the assessment that Donica is a "poor man's Ramin Karimloo, et al" but you can probably make a very good career out of it even if this ends up being the case.

Updated On: 5/31/22 at 07:05 AM

[ATerrifyingAndImposingFigure]

Posted: 5/31/22 at 10:38am

I disagree with Donica being weak, though to bring up a years old performance that nobody cares about, yes, Mathew Morrison was whiffing those high notes and it really sticks out when the rest of that score was pretty much perfectly done.