Posted: 5/14/16 at 9:45am
At the end of the day. Who is Patti Murin?
Posted: 5/14/16 at 9:48am
"I have told people who know her that she harmed the kids who come here out of love for the theater, the older people who com e here to reminisce, the women who formed communities of theater-lovers helping each other through breast cancer treatments (both successful and non successful)m the Rentheads,m the Wicked lovers, the Sondheimists, the Lloyd Webberites, the Cabaret and Hedwig devotees."
Quite frankly, this is nonsense. No one has been "harmed" here. All those people can still come here. There only difference here is that the mods have gotten slightly more strict about enforcing the rules they already had, something they already planned to do before anyone ever knew who Murin was (and outside of this board, very few people still do). In fact, it's a better place for those people because the personal attacks that were allowed here for so long are no longer acceptable. How on Earth is this a bad thing?
Yes, she rather absurdly called for the boards to be shut down.
That hasn't happened. It's not going to happen. It was never going to happen.
We mostly agree that she has little power, but you give her power every single time you ask for that apology. Stop talking about her, and she will fade right back into the nothingness from which she came.
Posted: 5/14/16 at 10:17am
"And for those two slights (and other similarly petty transgressions), she thought it right and good to run a campaign of vilifying the rest of us."
Seems like I can't edit, but I wanted to respond to PalJoey's edit above. I don't feel villified, nor do I feel tarred. An apparently ditzy, little-known actress with a blog said some silly things about BWW, and as a result, BWW rolled out a change a little bit ahead of schedule.
This affects me how?
Posted: 5/14/16 at 10:32am
" There only difference here is that the mods have gotten slightly more strict about enforcing the rules they already had, something they already planned "
Perhaps that'a true on paper, but in reality, many of us felt the repercussions went deeper to the core, or spirit that was once here. Many members left.
Posted: 5/14/16 at 10:50am
"Perhaps that'a true on paper, but in reality, many of us felt the repercussions went deeper to the core, or spirit that was once here. Many members left."
I can understand how you feel that way (I obviously do not), but how many people never joined or left quickly because of (some) of those members? For a very long time, it seemed almost standard practice for this board to attack newcomers, and treat them with suspicion - which is why I find PalJoey's paean to BWW BP (Before Patti) as such a welcoming place or a sanctuary a bit absurd.
If you were one of the clique, all was well and good - if not, get out of the sandbox until you've proven yourself.
Those who left did so of their own free will. They can return any time they want. They just have to follow the rules BWW has always had.
Posted: 5/14/16 at 12:33pm
PalJoey said: "I have told people who know her that she harmed the kids who come here out of love for the theater, the older people who com e here to reminisce, the women who formed communities of theater-lovers helping each other through breast cancer treatments (both successful and non successful)m the Rentheads,m the Wicked lovers, the Sondheimists, the Lloyd Webberites, the Cabaret and Hedwig devotees.
Theater-lovers she made to feel embarrassed and ashamed of coming here to share our love--and why did she do it? Because one callow boy posted that she couldn't hit the high note in Wicked (he has since apologized) and then some people made fun of a show that was closing.
And for those two slights (and other similarly petty transgressions), she thought it right and good to run a campaign of vilifying the rest of us.
She KNOWS she owes us an apology, and she knows we will not forget.
Don't speak of power. The only power is love."
You need to get a grip and let it go. She doesn't owe you or anyone an apology. Listen to her radio podcast and you'll see what she was trying to do. You are the only one going on and on about an apology for a few months now.
As for calling me a callow boy I'm actually a female.
Posted: 5/14/16 at 1:04pm
'Quite frankly, this is nonsense. No one has been "harmed" here.'
One might say exactly the same about the comments to which Patti Murin took offence in the first place.
"Hey we didn't harm anyone!"
How about a little consistency please?
Posted: 5/14/16 at 1:14pm
Of course Murin wasn't harmed. Of course she overreacted. Is continuing to harp on and overreact to this silly little incident in which NO ONE was harmed a good idea? What purpose does that serve?
Eta: Pal Joey, you said that some people here were embarrassd and ashamed. I wasn't. Doesn't sound like you were. Who are these embarrassed and ashamed BWW members?
Updated On: 5/14/16 at 01:14 PM
Posted: 5/14/16 at 1:21pm
PalJoey said: "But, as Betty Comden, Adolph Green, and Jule Styne said, "the party's over".
Only Betty and Adolph wrote "the party's over.
Jule Styne wrote "da dada DEE dah."
"Good one, Joey. Precision.
Posted: 5/14/16 at 1:49pm
"For a very long time, it seemed almost standard practice for this board to attack newcomers, and treat them with suspicion - which is why I find PalJoey's paean to BWW BP (Before Patti) as such a welcoming place or a sanctuary a bit absurd."
Which includes member PalJoey who accused ANY newcomer who started a thread saying hello that they were a troll, and used other colorful language along with his clique of bros which have mostly left, thankfully. Verbal abuse, threats, all that stuff. You are not getting an apology. How many people do you need to tell you that?
"Don't speak of power. The only power is love."
You shouldn't tell people what to speak about. Isn't that why you loathe Patti so much?
Updated On: 5/14/16 at 01:49 PM
Posted: 5/14/16 at 1:50pm
"Eta: Pal Joey, you said that some people here were embarrassd and ashamed. I wasn't. Doesn't sound like you were. Who are these embarrassed and ashamed BWW members?"
Exactly. No one. Nobody.
Posted: 5/14/16 at 1:57pm
Nobody can call the people who come here for love of the theater "nobodies."
Don't disparage the 99% that way.
Posted: 5/14/16 at 2:40pm
As for nobody being harmed, I'm not so sure. A few of the longtime members have left the board.
Posted: 5/14/16 at 3:11pm
Posted: 5/14/16 at 9:06pm
I don't think that the end is near for BWW. It is surely adapting and growing as the years roll by. Now, as a result of MurinGate, I see it as calmer, less vicious and more accountable. There is a lot less bullying and such on these boards. Let's just say that people have become more aware of the problems we had before and have adjusted accordingly. I would be intrigued about what the mods think of this particular thread. from RC in Austin, Texas
Posted: 5/14/16 at 11:21pm
And it will be even better when Patti decides to do the right thing and take responsibility for her actions and apologizes to the 99% of us for the true act of bullying she perpetrated on the 99% of us, attempting to shut down our home.
All because some silly little girl once said that Patti couldn't hit a high note.
Updated On: 5/14/16 at 11:21 PM
Posted: 5/15/16 at 1:38am
PalJoey said: "
And it will be even better when Patti decides to do the right thing and take responsibility for her actions and apologizes to the 99% of us for the true act of bullying she perpetrated on the 99% of us, attempting to shut down our home.
All because some silly little girl once said that Patti couldn't hit a high note."
Dude you seriously need to let it go and also stop making me sound like I'm 12yrs old.
Also don't blame me alone for her writing her blog.
LISTEN TO HER RADIO PODCAST AND YOU WILL HEAR THAT SHE DOESN'T WANT THE BOARDS SHUT DOWN. She just wants people to be nicer to each other. Yes her original blog was all over the place and she admits on that podcast that it was. I'll send you a link to it in a DM if you want. Maybe then once and for all you will shut up about her owing you an apology.
Posted: 5/15/16 at 2:21am
I really don't care about patty murin, but it's funny how she wants the boards to be nicer, but was quiet happy with some of here over zealous fans to wish death upon people than retweet it..
And Margo what ever the rest of your nic is, people in glass houses!
Posted: 5/15/16 at 4:16am
"Maybe then once and for all you will shut up about her owing you an apology."
What a glorious day that will be. Jesus Christ.
Posted: 5/15/16 at 8:31am
"I can understand how you feel that way (I obviously do not), but how many people never joined or left quickly because of (some) of those members? For a very long time, it seemed almost standard practice for this board to attack newcomers, and treat them with suspicion - which is why I find PalJoey's paean to BWW BP (Before Patti) as such a welcoming place or a sanctuary a bit absurd.
If you were one of the clique, all was well and good - if not, get out of the sandbox until you've proven yourself."
Very true. And this was definitely the worst feature of these boards. And the guilty parties seemed to be forever back-slapping one another over their antics, which only perpetuated them.
Their mistreatment of newcomers was shameful, and did great harm to the board. How many people were turned off to these boards by their mistreatment upon arrival, causing them never to return? How many valuable insights were the rest of us thus deprived of by their departure? How many lurkers who had equally valuable things to say remained silent due to fear of the reception that might await them? This board suffered greatly by their absence.
Perhaps things will now improve. I hope so. It seems more congenial now that some of the more flagrant bullies have gone, and others have seemingly toned down their act. Yet we still have someone acting like a veritable bully in a China shop, trampling threads left and right, calling people names. So plus ça change....
Posted: 5/15/16 at 9:07am
LISTEN TO HER RADIO PODCAST AND YOU WILL HEAR THAT SHE DOESN'T WANT THE BOARDS SHUT DOWN.
We shouldn't have to go and give traffic to her podcast in order to hear her apology. If she has something to say to us, she should come here and say it.
And I believe she will.
Posted: 5/15/16 at 9:23am
No...she wants people to be nice to her. Her further tweets have shown she doesn't feel that SHE has to be nice to anyone.
My issue with the censorship isn't about her, however. We were told that we would get an explanation telling us why posts were removed...and that clearly has not happened.
Could we be nicer to each other here? Yes, and I wouldn't mind that at all. But its a grey area to determine what is snark and what is too far. Some folks are more sensitive than others.
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