Darren Criss in Hedwig- Page 15

[dfrillsnedit]

Posted: 7/21/15 at 11:43am

I ended up deciding to put my grudges against Darren to the side, and saw the show the night of the Supreme Court news. And I have to say, I was really happy I made the decision. Darren really surprised me, especially vocally. Though I wouldn't say that overall he was a "great Hedwig" but definitely a "good one" for sure. 

My biggest issue with Darren's performance was his comic timing. Maybe it's because my past Hedwig's were MCH and JCM, both whom I thought got the comedy aspect of the role like complete bosses (along with the rest of the role, obviously), but Darren's comedic efforts felt very rushed. It seemed pretty obvious that he was suffering from the fear that he'd forget his lines, and thus raced through them at rapid speed, and in the process missed a few of the punchlines. He did though do an incredible job when it came to the dramatic aspects of the role, and was easily the angriest Hedwig I had seen. Also his overall performance when taking on Tommy was brilliant. He skyrocketed to my favorite Tommy that I've seen thus far, and brought new energy into that section of the show. 

I also have to say that, next to JCM, Darren seemed the feel the most comfortable when taking on the "Punk Rock" energy of the role, probably due to his age. I really enjoyed whenever he would go into the more "hard" production numbers, like "Angry Inch" and "Exquisite Corpose". He definitely shined during those. Sadly, I think he was (like most have said) at his weakest during the slower songs, especially "Origin of Love". Was never truly terrible, but he didn't shine as much there as he did in the more upbeat/angsty numbers. 

Overall, Darren was vocally a beast, and tried his hardest. Nothing to write home to mom about, but wasn't as bad as I expected, nor as bad as what he seemed to be doing during his first few performances. Now I'm beyond excited for Taye, who I know will take a while to get comfortable in the role, but I have hopes of bringing new energy into the show - and if Alan rumors are true, my #1 dream Hedwig will be crossed off the list. 

Updated On: 7/21/15 at 11:43 AM

[SingMeToSleep]

Posted: 7/21/15 at 12:47pm

Things have been trending down somewhat since fairly early this year. Overall, in the history of the production, the numbers started strong and, over the course of NPH's run, kept climbing. They went down once he left and Andrew Rannells took over for the remainder of the summer and the early fall. They then went up again during the fall, holiday season, and into early January 2015 with Michael C. Hall. They then went down some with John Cameron Mitchell during the winter and early spring and continued to decline when Darren stepped in at the end of April. The length of time the show has been running very well may contribute to the downward trend in 2015. There may be many other factors such as who is starring as Hedwig, particularly in a show where the actor playing Hedwig is such a large factor in shaping and personalizing the role; the season of the year and whether it is a high or low time for tourists and theater goers in general; the impact of other new shows opening, etc.I suppose even things like the harsh and long winter in 2015 may have had a potential impact. Seeing numbers through the end of this fall and holiday season will show more accurately if the production is still fluctuating or if it is in a sustained downward trend. 

The largest takes for the show came during the runs of the two actors (NPH and MCH) who are best known to the majority of the public that may not attend Broadway shows on a regular basis and make their viewing choices based, in part, on wanting to see a famous actor live. AR, and JCM especially to Hedwig devotees, have significant recognition among regular theater goers but might not be as well known to the general public.

Darren was able to draw huge crowds and a tremendous take during his limited 3 week run in H2$ back in 2012 when Glee was still more or less a cultural phenomenon ($4,037,394 total, with an average of $1,345,798/week), but since then the show fell off the radar screen of a lot of the public which may have had an impact on his draw for Hedwig. 

It will be interesting to see how TD does, and also to see what impact might occur if the show's producers get another big name star to follow TD for the remainder of 2015.

Comparative figures for the various Hedwigs:

 NPH (21 weeks*; 140 performances; March 29-Aug. 17, 2014)

Average Capacity: 101.96%

Average % Gross: 120.18%

Average take: $994,097/week; $142,014/performance Total: $19,881,933 

*His first "week" was only one performance; the second week was 6 performances; the rest of his run had 7 performances per week. For the purpose of calculating his average per week I combined the take from the 7 performances in the first and second weeks.

-----------------------------------

AR (8 weeks; 58 performances*; Aug. 20-Oct. 12, 2014)

Average Capacity: 82.04%

Average % Gross: 72.76%

Average take: $573,138/week; $79,054/performance Total: $4,585,107 

*He had two weeks with 8 performances and six weeks with 7 performances

--------------------------------------

MCH (14 weeks; 97 performances*; Oct. 16, 2014-Jan. 18, 2015)

Average Capacity: 88.04%

Average % Gross: 84.93%

Average take: $625,016/week; $90,208/performance Total: $8,750,218

*He had one week with 6 performances and thirteen weeks with 7 performances

--------------------------------------

JCM (14 weeks; 96 performances*; Jan. 21-Apr. 26, 2015)

Average Capacity: 78.14%

Average % Gross: 73.77%

Average take: $546,098/week; $79,639/performance Total: $7,645,372

*He had two weeks with 6 performances and twelve weeks with 7 performances. Michael C. Hall replaced him for one of the 7 performance weeks when he injured his knee; the figures for that week are included here as it took place during JCM's run filling the role.

------------------------------------

DC (12 weeks; 83 performances*; Apr. 29-July 19, 2015)

Average Capacity: 74.64%

Average % Gross: 66.08%

Average take: $481,978/week; $69,684/performance Total: $5,783,741

*He had one week with 6 performances and eleven weeks with 7 performances.

Updated On: 7/21/15 at 12:47 PM

[HedwigInch]

Posted: 7/21/15 at 1:15pm

Thanks for doing all the work and sharing these numbers. I wanted to compare each actor's run but was too lazy in the end. 

Curious how things will develop.

[Amazing2]

Posted: 7/21/15 at 6:55pm

I really don't understand comments by you, dfrillsnedit, about having "grudges" against Darren Criss.  I don't mean to single you out except to say your comments seem the most rational compared to some others who admittedly do hold him in less than high esteem and, yes, try to tear him down.  Therefore, maybe you can explain this phenomenon.  At least you went to see him and gave his performance a fair shot.  Some people seemingly have not even seen him in the show (even in a bootleg) and disparage him quite savagely. I went to see him, and I was impressed.  I've seen my fair share of plays over thirty years, and he was very good in this role in my opinion.  There is no doubt in my mind the kid has talent.  Therefore, if you have someone who is passionate about theater and Broadway (which he seems to be) and talented, why aren't people more encouraging rather than overly and even cruelly critical?  He's admitted his voice is not suited to a number of musicals, but this is a different sort of show---not a conventional musical.  I thought his voice was more appropriate than NPH's.  I agree with you about his comic timing.  It did seem a little rushed.  That's something he needs to work on, but there are so many other elements to the part in which he excelled (which you noted).  If you (or anyone else for that matter) can give me any insight why people are so negative about him, I would really appreciate it.

Updated On: 7/21/15 at 06:55 PM

[Phan2]

Posted: 7/21/15 at 8:11pm

I hold no grudge against Darren. I wouldn’t say I am a fan of his, since I only paid attention to him after he was cast in Hedwig, especially since he preceded Taye (and I am a fan of Taye). But I do believe credit should be given, when earned. As I said before, being a college student, I couldn’t afford the trip to NYC to see the show. So based only on my listening to a couple of the audios of Darren, and watching the bootlegs videos of JCM (both off-Broadway and in the Broadway role) and of NPH, AR, JCM and DC, I personally think Darren was very, very good overall.   So I stand by my personal view that he was “great.” (I couldn’t find a bootleg video of MCH, but I heard he was great in his dramatic acting; didn’t hear how funny he was until I read dfrillsnedit’s post, but I believe it.)

 I preferred Darren’s dramatic acting over that of NPH and AR. I agree that his portrayal of Tommy is brilliant, the best behind JCM, in my opinion (again, didn’t see a bootleg of MCH).   His singing was great, in my opinion, conveyed more emotion than NPH and Andrew.   He sounded lovely (and emotional) in the slower ballad-type songs. I felt touched listening to them (“Wig in a Box,” “Wicked Little Town” and “Origin of Love” in particular touched me). I actually loved Darren’s “Origin of Love,” and one of my Hedwig friends agreed, that she thought he did wonderfully on it (she has seen NPH a couple of times in the role, AR once in the role, JCM six times, and DC three times; she’s a lucky New Yorker).   I also agree he did the rock songs as well as they could be done, wonderful energy from him. But I respect if others disagree on the issues of dramatic acting and song performances, since it is highly subjective (not to mention grudges against and favoritism of the various actors do play a role).

 I agree with you, dfrillsnedit, that Darren’s comic timing wasn’t as good as the others.   I thought JCM and Neil especially were very funny.   But I still laughed quite a bit during Darren’s bootleg.   He didn’t fail to be funny overall, he just needs to improve.  

 Dfrillsnedit, I noticed you felt his Tommy portrayal was “brilliant,” and that he did “an incredible job” dramatically. You also stated he brought “new energy into that section [the Tommy section] of the show.”   You said he was “vocally a beast,” and that he shined during the rock songs. Yet, you felt Darren’s performance was “nothing to write home to mom about,” just not “as bad as I expected.”   This is really interesting to me, because reading your earlier statements about how his Tommy was “brilliant,” that he did “an incredible job” in his dramatic acting, I would say that is indeed a performance that Darren should be proud of. For me, the reason why I love this show the most is because of how it really touches me, how Hedwig’s struggle really touches me. The last 20 minutes of the show are the most important to me and thus the part that lingers in my memory, because of the emotional impact that is permanently made during that part of the show.   Likewise, the emotional aspect of the music and whether the actor succeeds in touching me emotionally through his song performances are critical to whether or not I feel the actor has managed to connect emotionally with me in his portrayal of Hedwig.   But I do realize for others, the comedy may be more central than what I consider to be the climax of the story line, which takes place in the last 20 minutes.

 Amazing2, you may be opening a can of worms by asking why some folks hold a grudge aginst Darren.  I'm sure some of the reasons are not even based on his actual performance in Hedwig.  I prefer to focus on his performance in this musical.  I agree with you, that I find it sad how others have attacked Darren in this thread, and that he is very talented.  I hope he returns to Broadway again.

Updated On: 7/22/15 at 08:11 PM

[cascade]

Posted: 7/21/15 at 11:15pm

I've seen 3 of the Hedwigs so far, JCM and Darren both multiple times. I found that Darren's performance varied more than JCM's. Maybe it was just the times I went, but I felt that JCM more or less maintained the same emotional tenor over his performances (which was perfectly fine because he was completely brilliant, and he did throw in a lot of improv bits). Darren vaciliated more in his moods as Hedwig and sometimes played it angrier and sometimes more light. He was pretty quick with coming up with lines off the cuff in response to the audience. It was interesting to see how Rebecca's performance has changed too, possibly just from settling into the character, but at first she played Yitzhak as very, very hard but softened up in the later performances. She plays Yitzhak as more smug than Lena Hall ever did which I kind of like. The dynamic between her Yitzhak and Darren's Hedwig also changed and sometimes would be more playful and sometimes more purely antagonistic. Her Yitzhak could also be physically intimidating to Hedwig at times in an interesting way.

Agreed that Darren's weakest spot was the comedic timing, though it did improve as the show went on, it just can't compare to JCM's perfect dry delivery. His singing was my favorite of the Hedwigs I've seen or listened to, however, and he made some unique emotional choices. For instance when he spoke the bridge in Angry Inch he wasn't just angry but truly anguished. His Exquisite Corpse was also particularly intense. My favorite number of his though ended up being Wig in a Box, his youth worked in his favor for that one.

Updated On: 7/21/15 at 11:15 PM

[Phan2]

Posted: 7/22/15 at 2:45am

John is the master. No doubt about this. I’ve seen others state this, and I agree with them, that in some ways, it’s unfair to compare the other actors, including Darren, to the master.   Most Hedwig fans believe that none of the other Hedwig actors compare with John. But I do feel that Darren was a great Hedwig. Also, I don’t feel that the fact that Darren altered how he played Hedwig (angry versus less angry) depending on the night, reflects badly on Darren. Theater changes from night to night; this is something often intentionally chosen by the actors on the stage.

 SingMeToSleep, thank you for taking the time to calculate the figures.

 I agree with all the factors that you identify (the actor who plays Hedwig, the time of the year, including whether it is a high or low time for tourists and theater fans, the impact of the new shows. I agree, that as the show goes into the Fall (with Taye) and beyond that it will be more clear whether the show is sustaining a downward trend. I'm sure that the drop in Glee’s popularity also affected Darren’s numbers

 I do believe that the new shows (the majority of which came out on or after March 15, 2015) have impacted the numbers for Hedwig in 2015, which affected Darren’s numbers and a few weeks of John’s numbers. As a fan of Taye, I am concerned they may affect Taye’s numbers.  Seven of the 13 new shows in 2015 made their first appearance on Broadway in the month of March. Four of these seven new shows made their first appearance on March 15 (An American in Paris, Finding Neverland, Hand to God, and The King and I).  

 During John’s run, during the week ending March 22, the numbers went down more than just some. They took a significant dip. In the preceding week (ending March 15), he brought in a gross of $604,849. The following week ending March 22, he brought in a gross of $421,691, a difference of $183,158. So the show took in 30% less than the prior week.   Compare this to the gross weekly amount for the week ending in January 4, 2015 of $777,340 (I’m guessing the numbers increased in part because of the winter holidays) and the gross weekly dollars for the following week ending in January 11, 2015 ($626,117), when the show had a drop of 20% less gross weekly dollars than the preceding week (this was during Michael’s run). So the timing does suggest the new shows that made their first appearance on March 15 significantly impacted the numbers for the week ending March 22.

 The difference in gross % potential between the week ending March 15 (79.85%) and the week ending March 22 (55.67%) was 24.18%, the largest drop between two weeks within a single actor's run for the time Hedwig has been on Broadway. The difference in capacity (percentage of seats sold) between the week ending March 15 and the week ending March 22 was 18.9%, the second highest drop in attendance between two weeks within a single actor's run (the highest being between the week ending August 31 and the week ending September 7, which was 23.3%, during Andrew’s run).  

 

 

Updated On: 7/27/15 at 02:45 AM

[cascade]

Posted: 7/22/15 at 12:00pm

"Also, I don’t feel that the fact that Darren altered how he played Hedwig (angry versus less angry) depending on the night, reflects badly on Darren. Theater does change from night to night; this is something often intentionally chosen by the actors on the stage."

 I didn't mean it in a negative way at all. I actually found it really interesting. If it was the same exact performance every night I wouldn't have wanted to see it with him multiple times. I found him fantastic to watch.

The show is aging and Darren's popularity coming on board was not at its peak like it was back in the How to Succeed days, so the numbers shouldn't have surprised anyone. He did what he needed to do and kept the show afloat and (presumably) profitable. Taye is certainly a bigger name so the show could go on the rise again with him but we'll see. If it doesn't I don't think it's a reflection of Taye, just the reality of a show like this that is this far into its run. I plan to try to see him at least once while he's in the role. It was a cool casting choice they made!

[RussT2]

Posted: 7/22/15 at 1:00pm

"^ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1SAdNuhZT3M"

I shot that video, my YouTube ID is IndieCabaretNYC. Alan comped me a ticket and allowed me to film that entire performance as long as I sent him a couple of dvds. It was a late night show at Joe's Pub on a Monday night around 11:30. Besides the Hedwig medley he did a wide range of songs that showed his range. He really would be a great Hedwig.

 

[ChiTheaterFan]

Posted: 7/22/15 at 1:13pm

""^ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1SAdNuhZT3M"
I shot that video, my YouTube ID is IndieCabaretNYC. Alan comped me a ticket and allowed me to film that entire performance as long as I sent him a couple of dvds. It was a late night show at Joe's Pub on a Monday night around 11:30. Besides the Hedwig medley he did a wide range of songs that showed his range. He really would be a great Hedwig.
 "

 Cool!  Nice work. Alan Cumming always seemed like someone I'd love to meet. Lucky you!

[Phan2]

Posted: 7/22/15 at 4:14pm

Ok, sorry cascade, I misunderstood.   I've always liked it when stage actors make interesting changes on different nights of performances. 

I'm glad that you are seeing Taye too, cascade.  I hope to see your comments on his performance in the Taye thread.  Yes, I hope Taye can bring in good numbers, since he is pretty well known.  If the numbers are not as good as expected, I agree that it won't be a bad reflection on Taye, but rather as you said, that the show is further in its run, competing with the new shows. 

RussT2, that must had been such an enjoyable experience, filming Alan.   Thanks for posting that video.

 

 

Updated On: 7/22/15 at 04:14 PM

[Sami7]

Posted: 7/22/15 at 9:09pm

I'll admit upfront that I am completely biased when it comes to Darren and his performance, as I was a Glee fan right until the bitter end, and only really developed an interest in Hedwig due to his being in the role, but using words like "embarrassment" (which is one of the milder critiques I have seen from some members of this board) is completely without merit. As with all of the other actors, Darren was better at some things than others, but overall, (and based on the general reviews/reactions of people who don't have some bizarre act to grind and my own personal viewing of his performance 7 times) he was vocally great, his physicality was fantastic, and his Tommy was a triumph. I'll just never understand the need to tear others down, especially someone who clearly loves the Broadway community, is talented, and goes above and beyond for his fans. The only "embarassment" is the vitriol surrounding what, at the very least, was a solid performance.

[mariel9]

Posted: 7/22/15 at 9:55pm

This isn't a fan board (except broadly for fans of Broadway). I come here for honest assessments of shows and performances. That includes harsh opinions expressed harshly (and positive ones expressed gushingly). I put all these opinions in the hopper along with my own history and taste, and decide what to see. 

 

And I thought Darren's performance was one of the worst professional live performances I've ever seen. Embarrassing is, in my opinion, completely accurate. Others disagree. This is fine. This is life. This is art. All this hand-wringing about why people don't like Darren and making it out to be some personal attempt to "tear him down" is tedious and belongs on a Darren fan board. If I only wanted to read positive opinions a particular show or performer, I'd skip this place. That's not what it's for.

 

Also, Sami7, to you specifically, you're admittedly a Glee fan who only came to Hedwig because of Criss. Consider the possibility Darren's critics genuinely see things differently than you--no need to ascribe ulterior motives. We just didn't like his performance. That doesn't change or lessen your enjoyment of his performance. I have no interest in doing that. 

 

It's a big wide world out there with lots of opinions, and people can have perfectly good reasons for disagreeing with yours. People who can't handle that without making up weird motivations for other people's opinions should probably stay away from these boards.

[Sami7]

Posted: 7/23/15 at 12:20am

Fair enough. I didn't mean to imply that simply because I am a fan, that means everyone else has to be as well. But I think it's fair to say that from the get-go there were a lot of people unwilling to give him a chance, and who discounted him immediately, and that, imo, comes from a place that is not conducive to a fair or honest assessment of his work. Personally, I discount people who rave about a thing (so, my own review) but also people who say it was "omg, the worst thing ever", because I think it's generally true that there are some outside influences at play in both scenarios - unless it was, in fact, just a total trainwreck, but as someone who is a fan, and therefore keeps up with what has been said, that was not the general consensus about his perfromance, not from the average theatre-goer and not from many in the business. Anyway, I personally subscribe to the notion that not every opinion needs to be voiced at every turn, and if you've already given your review/made your opinion known about said thing, commentary about how glad you are to see him go, is just rude for rudeness' sake. (YMMV, and I acknowledge that message boards, and the internet in general is not a place where manners seem to exist.)

[Phan2]

Posted: 7/23/15 at 2:22am

 . . . I’m not even a “Darren fan,” but snide comments made in an attempt to offend are tedious too. I come here for honest opinions expressed analytically, which I am seeing in the Taye thread. Some in this thread seem to go out of their way to offend and insult, as if they find it amusing to do so.   But of course it's their right to voice their views.  Frankly, whenever they post, I think it backfires on them, because it diminishes their credibility.  It creates an impression that the person who is posting is basing his/her views out of personal bias. Darren’s performance was one of the worst professional live performances ever seen by you? You are entitled to your opinion of course.  Hyperbole does come to mind when reading the wording.  When one speaks so extremely, I read the rest of this post with a grain of salt, much as I would if someone gushed that Darren is absolutely the most perfect actor devoid of any flaws who was ever viewed in a live performance.   No one in this thread or any other thread ever has an ulterior motive for bashing a celebrity? This is the utopia of anonymous internet boards then. Especially in the case of a person whose post is very strongly worded, bias will be suspected.  This goes for statements made against other performers beside Darren.  Yes of course people may have good reasons to critique Darren or any other performer.  But when one uses highly charged, malicious language with the knowledge that it will likely offend, rather than to calmly discuss the performance, then I give little, if no, credit to the person expressing his or her opinion.  If one cannot handle people questioning the rationale for one’s post due to their choice of language, then perhaps one may want to word it in a way that is less overwrought, less hyperbolic, less of a broad, all-encompassing statement.  Or perhaps just learn to deal with it, as Darren fans are learing to deal with some of the statements that have been made in this thread.  Or perhaps just stay away, as has been suggested to Darren fans.  Again, Darren fans, do not let it bother you.

Updated On: 7/23/15 at 02:22 AM

[CarlosAlberto]

Posted: 7/23/15 at 4:48am

^ THIS! 24 x 7 divided by 365 to the 1,000th power! PREACH!

[SDV]

Posted: 7/23/15 at 11:01am

Mariel9, thank you for expressing that. I've kept most of my detailed opinions about DC's Hedwig to myself as criticism of him seems to inspire his fans to create detailed psychological profiles of those who don't like this performance. I'm a dedicated Hedhead, never saw DC in anything before this and I found his performance to indeed be embarrassing. It is not hyperbole on my part. I found myself slipping down in my seat watching him, cringing at many of his choices. It broke my heart to see my beloved show in his hands, truly.

But that's my opinion. I'm certainly entitled to it and there are many who disagree with me, including Stephen Trask who has spent the last three months on Twitter waxing DC's ass. There's much more I could say about my history with this show and why it is so dear to me, but why should I have to tell my life story to explain why I didn't like one person's performance?

Updated On: 7/23/15 at 11:01 AM

[Jamie Pierce]

Posted: 7/23/15 at 12:21pm

I'd like to reiterate a comment I made earlier in this thread that I believe is relevant to this conversation and a true statement for us Hedheads (I have a HATAI tattoo so I like to think of myself in this category): 

If you have a pre-existing relationship with the character and the material, you most likely go into the theatre wanting to get something in particular from the experience. You want your Hedwig to deliver on a promise. And I think everyone's expectations are different. For whatever reason, NPH gave me exactly what I was looking for - what I wanted and needed from Hedwig - that the other ones did not. I was downright angry about the casting of Darren Criss (stunt TV star, too young, not enough theatre experience, etc), but after I went to see him was absolutely shocked when he gave me exactly what I wanted from Hedwig. Yes there are some technical aspects of the performance that I could quibble with. But in the end I think, especially with this particular show, it comes down to a visceral response. 

[skies]

Posted: 7/23/15 at 12:33pm

". But in the end I think, especially with this particular show, it comes down to a visceral response. "

 This.

There is nothing "wrong" or "right" with a visceral response either way, because if that is the thing than all praise of fans who had a strong connection with Darren Criss performance should be also discounted.

Your fave is unfairly maligned? Try telling Maria Callas or Patti Lupone fans that.
I understand personal reactions to scathing reviews ("an embarrassment", "the worst ever") but sorry, even when my faves get them I can dismiss them as in not agreeing, which is fine, but I don't have to rationalize a whole conspiracy to discount them. I thought Matthew Broderick was simply horrible in his last show and I don't think I have to apologize for it.

"Loving" or "hating" a performance is as much a theater going experience as anything , that's why live performances are thrilling and risky that way because of the audience. So all this talk of "consensus" or "general thinking" leaves me cold as if any criticism or praise outside of some established norm is automatically suspect. I know some theater buffs who can't stand Audra's singing.

Coddling the Darren Criss fans so that they can perpetuate the myth that their favorite is the only unfairly maligned performer out there and that any strong negative reactions is because of a specific ax to grind is tedious.

Updated On: 7/23/15 at 12:33 PM

[HedwigInch]

Posted: 7/23/15 at 12:50pm

I think one thing to consider with Darren fans being so defensive is that Darren got a lot of unnecessary **** from the Glee fandom for years. The Glee fandom is split into several fandoms and those fandoms were busy fighting each other for all 6 years the show was on.

I personally couldn't care less if someone didn't like his performance in Hedwig, an actor is never loved by 100% of the people, but I also get why especially younger fans who had to hear for years how Darren sucks and slept his way up get defensive over seemingly hyperbole statements.

In the end someone shouldn't get their feathers ruffled over a few negative comments on the internet. An actor they like still did Hedwig, was loved by a bunch of people and kept the show going for the next actor to take the role. 

Petty internet fights just take the fun out of things.

[Phan2]

Posted: 7/23/15 at 5:45pm

I find nothing wrong with a visceral reaction.  We all have it when watching certain performances by certain actors.  But one's visceral reaction often varies according to different parts of the show.   To make a broad statement that the entire performance is an embarrassment smacks of hyperbole to me.  I may have a visceral reaction to a performer's dramatic acting as being primarily negative, but that his comic timing is good.  I may have a visceral reaction that I love the way a certain actor performs Wig In A Box, but dislike the way he performs Exquisite Corpse.  I may like the way an actor does improvisation, but dislike how he performs certain scripted parts.   The statements of some people in this thread strike me as extreme and hyperbolic.  That's my opinion.   I'm not going to "coddle" them by not stating my opinion. 

skies, I have no problem, and I would be surprised if Darren's fans do not either, with people disliking DC's performance.   No one is asking for a unanimous consensus on this.  You misinterpret what I have said if you think that is my point.   I'm talking about the way one expresses his or her opinion.   I tend to value opinions that at least give the appearance of some objectivity and that are not emotionally-charged.   I tend to find it embarrassing (on behalf of the person posting) when one expresses himself/herself in a way that is highly charged, knowing full well that it will offend, rather than be informational.   You don't like an actor's interpretation and execution of his interpretation of Hedwig, fine.  But don't pretend that saying an actor's performance is an embarrassment and that he "can't get out of this show fast enough for me" is not phrased in such a way to achieve offense, as opposed to phrasing it differently by stating that you felt his performance was inferior or lacking.

I'm not interested in a competition of which celebrities are most unfairly maligned.   I have never stated DC is the most attacked performer on this board.  To do so would be hyperbolic, which I try to avoid.  Of course other performers have received vitriolic insults.   No one has argued otherwise.  DC fans have been treated the opposite of being coddled.  It's laughable to say others have coddled them in this thread.  Rather, it seems that those who engage in an insulting choice of words are the ones asking to be coddled, because of how offended they seem that anyone would dare to question their rationale for the extreme way they choose to express their opinions.

I didn't watch Glee or follow it.  I have no idea what happened within the Glee fandom.  I'm also someone who didn't follow Darren, except to follow how he was doing in Hedwig (and that is primarily because he preceded Taye, who I am a fan of).   I wouldn't say I am a "Darren fan."  Speaking for myself, with no knowledge of what happened within the Glee fandom or what kind of treatment Darren received before he performed in Hedwig, I find the way some people express their opinions in this thread to be offensive.   It's my right to call them out, just as it's their right to phrase their opinions in whichever way they choose.   Hedwiginch, I agree that I personally don't care if someone doesn't like Darren's performance.  I never expected a consensus about this, or a consensus about any of the Hedwig actors.  I merely object to the way certain people express themselves in this thread, which is a manner that appears designed to offend, and which is to be contrasted with the way people have expressed their views in the Taye thread, which is stated in an even manner.    If people are going to be outraged because they believe Darren fans are being coddled, then I'm saying that those people should not expect to be coddled either.   It should not be a surprise when people call them out when they phrase their words in such a way that will cause offense.   Hedwiginch, I agree, I think we (those who are Darren fans, those who hate his performance in Hedwig and wish to express their hate in certain ways, and myself, who is neither) should try to not get our feathers ruffled.   

 

 

Updated On: 7/23/15 at 05:45 PM

[HedwigInch]

Posted: 7/23/15 at 6:03pm

I am totally with you on this. I mostly keep my mouth shut about how certain users seem to enjoy using language that is borderline hyperbole and aggressive since they won't change their ways just because someone on the internet isn't in favor of such language.

I think a few people didn't give Darren a real shot, weren't interested in critique that wasn't borderline hyperbole. I see the difference between this thread and the Taye thread, too. 

In the end it doesn't matter. Taye is Hedwig now, Darren is doing a movie now so it's time to let it go, I guess.

[skies]

Posted: 7/23/15 at 6:14pm

The problem is Phan2, they actually do object to any negative comments on his performance.   Personally I don't give a flying fig about Glee and it's fandoms when it comes to Hedwig.

When someone posts what they didn't like about Darren Criss performance we've gotten a refutation as to why the peformance does work mutliple times on this thread as a counter point.  Which is OK I guess, but let's not pretend they welcome any dissenting opinions.

Again, I don't see why opinons have to follow within your prescribed category.  I've seen fans gush about every aspect of Actor X's peformance and seen fans bash every aspect of Actor Y's performance.  If someone , as I've read here, says that Darren is the best Hedwig with the best singing and acting and the prefer him to NPH, for example, that' s fine.  They don't have to follow your box.  If someone tells me that Patti Lupone walks on water, f*** it I'm taking that as gospel.  If they trash my Lupone, well I sure as damn don't agree but whatever.

Of course I don't' like when a fans opinion is presented  rudely (I should know with what my faves go through) and one has the perogative to dismiss it, but again, that's not unique to Darren.  Someone saying they find his performance embarassing is THEIR opinion, and of course it's up to you to rationalize that is beyond rude and beyond normal rational comprehension, even for a "non Darren" fan like yourself.

BTW your take on a "visceral reaction" split up into different parts to be compartmentalized actually is to me the antithesis of the term.

Updated On: 7/23/15 at 06:14 PM

[CarlosAlberto]

Posted: 7/23/15 at 6:33pm

Even though I did like Darren in HEDWIG I respect the opinions of some on this thread that say they didn't care for it, do you know why? Because some of you have actually taken the time to back up your feelings in regards to your love of the piece versus his performance. I totally have respect for that even if the opinion differs from mine. What I don't respect is those that just post something along the lines of: Darren Criss sucks and then leaves it at that which leads me to suspect that maybe it's just a biased opinion because they didn't like glee, Darren in general or both, and that's not fair because they are not judging his performance within the context of the show. 

 

[DAME]

Posted: 7/23/15 at 6:52pm

@Carlos..... Yo se lo que fue que te gusto.  So don't even try it.