Disney's THE LITTLE MERMAID live-action movie musical - News & Discussion Thread- Page 4

[hearthemsing22]

Posted: 9/12/22 at 8:39am

Dark_Vader said: "hearthemsing22 said: "Dark_Vader said: "The uproar over Halle Bailey's casting in this film is disturbing. It's also happening with the casting choices for House of the Dragon and Rings of Power.

No matter how these objectors try to justify their views it is blatant racism. Where was it ever written that any of these characters had to be specifically white?

These are tales that are rooted in fantasy!The racist backlash to people of color in fantasy is rooted in a larger desire to erase us from all facets of society."

So me saying I don’t understand the point of a remake is me being racist? No, I said that about The Lion King, which I tried to watch and it was just…weird seeing the real animals talking. Ooof. I’ve said that about Beauty and the Beast (.Emma Watson version) This does not mean I’m racist."

Nowhere in my post did i mention you and my post was not directed at you.

What is wrong with you?"

Absolutely nothing :) I’m trying to explain that not every single person who says they don’t want this remake-that doesn’t mean they’re racist 

[Dark_Vader]

Posted: 9/12/22 at 8:50am

hearthemsing22 said: "Dark_Vader said: "hearthemsing22 said: "Dark_Vader said: "The uproar over Halle Bailey's casting in this film is disturbing. It's also happening with the casting choices for House of the Dragon and Rings of Power.

No matter how these objectors try to justify their views it is blatant racism. Where was it ever written that any of these characters had to be specifically white?

These are tales that are rooted in fantasy!The racist backlash to people of color in fantasy is rooted in a larger desire to erase us from all facets of society."

So me saying I don’t understand the point of a remake is me being racist? No, I said that about The Lion King, which I tried to watch and it was just…weird seeing the real animals talking. Ooof. I’ve said that about Beauty and the Beast (.Emma Watson version) This does not mean I’m racist."

Nowhere in my post did i mention you and my post was not directed at you.

What is wrong with you?"

Absolutely nothing :) I’m trying to explain that not every single person who says they don’t want this remake-that doesn’t mean they’re racist"

You are “explaining” to something that I never wrote. Nowhere in my post did I write that anyone was racist for not wanting this remake. 

[Chase Miller]

Posted: 9/12/22 at 9:23am

I didn't like the riff at first but then I heard the full leak.  The riff sounds great when you hear the entire song. Halle sounds stunning. I think some are overreacting to the riff. 

Updated On: 9/12/22 at 09:23 AM

[somecheapfrenchthing]

Posted: 9/12/22 at 11:27am

Finally got to watch the whole song and I really loved it! I still feel the last riff softens the impact, but I’ll still be listening and relistening when the soundtrack is released! I don’t think anyone on here is “overreacting” about the choices being made. Honestly, I don’t even think the speculation about how Howard Ashman might react is that outrageous based on what information we have about how he coached songs like these. People are impassioned about these films and for many of us (maybe all of us?) these late 80’s-early 00’s “I want” songs and their characters were surrogates for our own pangs, unexpressed/stigmatized wants, etc. - so I get people having strong reactions to a different interpretation. I’m very excited to see more! I’m already a fan of the overall look and sound of it and based on the full clip, I suspect HB will deliver an amazing performance. 

[Emma_Pillsbury]

Posted: 9/12/22 at 11:57am

She did a beautiful job with the song - "riff" and all. Anticipating the release of the film's soundtrack, it remains one of my favorite scores. 

 

[VintageSnarker]

Posted: 9/12/22 at 2:58pm

Chase Miller said: "I didn't like the riff at first but then I heard the full leak. The riff sounds great when you hear the entire song. Halle sounds stunning. I think some are overreacting to the riff."

I actually feel the opposite. Hearing the whole song, I understand what people mean now about her choosing to emphasize words strangely. But it's done now and will be received however it will be received. I was a fan before and I'll still be a fan of hers even if I think the movie could have been better with a different director.

[TheatreFan4]

Posted: 9/12/22 at 3:52pm

There's a lot of hit dogs hollering 😂

[Chase Miller]

Posted: 9/12/22 at 5:47pm

I actually feel the opposite. Hearing the whole song, I understand what people mean now about her choosing to emphasize words strangely. But it's done now and will be received however it will be received. I was a fan before and I'll still be a fan of hers even if I think the movie could have been better with a different director."

To each their own. I thought this new version of the song improves upon the original. I felt more emotion with how Halle sung some of the lyrics. Especially the "Burn" note

[Seb28]

Posted: 9/12/22 at 8:10pm

Emma_Pillsbury said: "She did a beautiful job with the song - "riff" and all."

Can you tell me what you find so beautiful about the wrong note in the line "BUT who cares"? NO big deal, I want more".

"But" and "no" are now the exact same low notes, which makes that part repetitive instead of confirming of Ariel's opinion. In the actual melody the word "but" is much higher. And she confirms it to herself with the lower "No". Now she just repeats herself. She basically makes the melody of the song disappear. Pity. The real melody is nowhere in the song any longer. What do you like about that?

I also dislike the "what's a fire AND why does it". The loud, screaming emphasis on the word AND makes no sense at all. She sounds angry there and really disconnected from the intention of the song. Too much soul diva. Why is that wrong emphasis appealing to you?

The last note of the song, the word "world" is sung much too loud and aggressive, right after the "Bee-hee-iieeeeh-yeah" ad-lib. Both moments should be subdued and silent in longing. Now it sounds affected and takes away from the moment and song. Can you tell me what you like about that?

I also find her pronunciation lazy and pop diva-ish at times, which takes away from the intention. Does insincerity appeal to you?

There is one moment in the song that I do like and that is the "abo-ho-hove", because that is the only part that actually fits the music and intention of the lyric and melody. The violins normally do that melody too, and that actually ads to the story telling. It's a shame the rest of the whole song is such a mess. 1 note that is right and sincere is not enough for me to enjoy a whole song.

 

 

[Emma_Pillsbury]

Posted: 9/12/22 at 8:18pm

Seb28 said: "Emma_Pillsbury said: "She did a beautiful job with the song - "riff" and all."

Can you tell me what you find so beautiful about the wrong note in the line "BUT who cares"? NO big deal, I want more".

"But" and "no" are now the exact same low notes, which makes that part repetitive instead of confirming of Ariel's opinion. In the actual melody the word "but" is much higher. And she confirms it to herself with the lower "No". Now she just repeats herself. She basically makes the melody of the song disappear. Pity. The real melody is nowhere in the song any longer. What do you like about that?

I also dislike the "what's a fire AND why does it". The loud, screaming emphasis on the word AND makes no sense at all. She sounds angry there and really disconnected from the intention of the song. Too much soul diva. Why is that wrong emphasis appealing to you?

The last note of the song, the word "world" is sung much too loud and aggressive, right after the "Bee-hee-iieeeeh-yeah" ad-lib. Both moments should be subdued and silent in longing. Now it sounds affected and takes away from the moment and song. Can you tell me what you like about that?

I also find her pronunciation lazy and pop diva-ish at times, which takes away from the intention. Does insincerity appeal to you?

There is one moment in the song that I do like and that is the "abo-ho-hove", because that is the only part that actually fits the music and intention of the lyric and melody. The violins normally do that melody too, and that actually ads to the story telling. It's a shame the rest of the whole song is such a mess. 1 note that is right and sincere is not enough for me to enjoy a whole song.


I found her voice beautiful and I loved her interpretation. And I'll just leave it at that. 

I am sorry you weren't pleased with it. 

Have a wonderful evening. 

[Seb28]

Posted: 9/12/22 at 8:41pm

Emma_Pillsbury said: "I loved her interpretation. And I'll just leave it at that.

I am sorry you weren't pleased with it.

Have a wonderful evening."

I'm sorry you can't even explain yourself about what you like about all the moments in the song I mentioned. That means you don't have a well formed and substantiated opinion. Because you either don't listen to all those moments, or you can say what you actually like about them.

Have a wonderful evening loving interpretations.

[windowwaving]

Posted: 9/12/22 at 9:52pm

Seb28 said: "Emma_Pillsbury said: "I loved her interpretation. And I'll just leave it at that.

I am sorry you weren't pleased with it.

Have a wonderful evening."

I'm sorry you can't even explain yourself about what you like about all the moments in the song I mentioned. That means you don't have a well formed and substantiated opinion. Because you either don't listen to all those moments, or you can say what you actually like about them.

Have a wonderful evening loving interpretations."

You can love something without knowing why you love it - you can just feel it. I'll often eat a dish and have no idea what's in it or why I like it - but I just know that I love it. Same with music, you don't have to be able to break down every single word or moment to simply enjoy it. 

It's also okay to like different things. Just because you didn't, even with your detailed analysis, doesn't mean someone else can't. 

[MagicalMusical]

Posted: 9/13/22 at 10:39am

Seb28, at first I hated Halle's trill in the last "wish I could be", but hearing the full song, I think it not only fits, but the whole performance is pretty phenomenal. All those loud additions and adl-libs and trills I find to emphasize passion, which is exactly what Ariel's character was all about. In the animated film, that girl was not quiet except in her grotto, and only during most of the song. And yeah, you could then say it should always be sung quiet because it's meant to be a quiet, reflective song, but I like that as the song goes on, Halle gets more and more passionate. Sure, she does some selecting of words to be more passionate that some may say don't fit acting-wise, but I like that she gets more passionate even in small words like "and". Like she's excited to say yet another thing she wants. And her trills and ad-libs, she's making that about passion, too, I would say. She's wanting the world so bad she's gonna run up and down scales. And Ariel was kind of a diva, more so than the previous Disney Princesses, so I'd say her being pop diva a little bit rather fits. And you say she's lazy with pronunciation but I found her dictions to match that drop of "g"s in words like "jumpin'" and "dancin'" to fit perfectly. At least we agree we love what she did with "above"!

We could have the same old performance, sung the same way Jodi did it, but Halle is truly making it her own, and you know what, it's not a sucky difference. It's an amazing one, in my opinion. These remakes need to be two things: different, and good. A lot of times they are barely one or the other. This one looks like it will be both.

Dark_Vader, people just usually set fairy tales where they were from, and make the people look like where they were from. Of course there were Black people in 19th century Denmark, they just weren't Danish royalty, but also, in the fairy tale, Hans Christian Anderson actually wrote that the mermaid had "white legs" when she became human. Yup, she was white. However, I just wanted to share that info, not say Ariel should be white, because by God do I love her performance as Ariel so far! Count me as someone who is now very much for Halle as Ariel!

Updated On: 9/13/22 at 10:39 AM

[Emma_Pillsbury]

Posted: 9/13/22 at 10:47am

Seb28 said: "Emma_Pillsbury said: "I loved her interpretation. And I'll just leave it at that.

I am sorry you weren't pleased with it.

Have a wonderful evening."

I'm sorry you can't even explain yourself about what you like about all the moments in the song I mentioned. That means you don't have a well formed and substantiated opinion. Because you either don't listen to all those moments, or you can say what you actually like about them.

Have a wonderful evening loving interpretations."

And I'm sorry that instead of accepting the answer I gave gracefully you chose behind the comfort of anonymity to take the low road by being unnecessarily rude and condescending to me.

Where is it written that I owe you an explanation about anything?

I am sure you are losing much sleep over all of this.

I on the other hand, am not.

You have yourself an incredibly wonderful day...or not.

 

 

Updated On: 9/13/22 at 10:47 AM

[hearthemsing22]

Posted: 9/13/22 at 2:32pm

I have absolutely NOTHING against anyone in this movie. I just do not see the need for so many remakes. Original stories are needed so much more. 

[Joviedamian]

Posted: 9/13/22 at 3:11pm

"I want someone who understands and respects the material and who makes choices in meaningful ways. Is that too much to ask for these days?"

Then tell that to Alan Meken (he wrote the material) and LMM. What you want is a CARBON COPY of what was. If that's the case, then just watch the original and don't move forward in life. The creators (including the artist) made these creative choices--how about respecting them to make these creative choices overall? You don't have to like them, but go in with an open mind to see something new; they did.

I was not expecting the riff, but actually feel that it works--brings more depth to the lyric and gives that "I want song" something to grab on too, before she hit's that last note. It works for me. 

[hork]

Posted: 9/13/22 at 4:21pm

This thread is a trip. Between one poster demanding that someone justify their opinion of a song, and another poster shouting into the void that they're not racist despite nobody even vaguely suggesting they are, it's a perfect satire of humanity and yet is somehow real.

[TheatreFan4]

Posted: 9/13/22 at 6:27pm

hearthemsing22 said: "I have absolutely NOTHING against anyone in this movie. I just do not see the need for so many remakes. Original stories are needed so much more."

This is such a hollow ****ing critique in particular as it pertains Disney which made its fortune on adapting well known fairytales to screen that had been (and still are) adapting multiple times over. Disney has many new films that they put out. Encanto, Coco, Onward, Soul, Raya and the Last Dragon, Turning Red, etc. 

If you're not watching those original stories, it says more about you than it does about the existence of these remakes. Are they a money grab? Absolutely! Are we going to pretend this is anymore aggrandizing than the era of Direct to Video sequels & prequels. 

[Seb28]

Posted: 9/14/22 at 6:22am

MagicalMusical said: "Seb28, at first I hated Halle's trill in the last "wish I could be", but hearing the full song...

I like that as the song goes on, Halle gets more and more passionate. Sure, she does some selecting of words to be more passionate that some may say don't fit acting-wise, but I like that she gets more passionate even in small words like "and". Like she's excited to say yet another thing she wants."

Thanks for your views and explanation MagicalMusical!

I can see what you mean about her being passionate, but I feel that at the end of the song, "wish I could be", after the build-up has ended with the "above" climax. That is really not a place for an ad-lib anymore. That is probably why it is jarring, even to riff lovers. So that has nothing to do with passion, because it actually takes a way from the passion of that last moment. It feels and sounds like posing, a distraction. Effects put on from the outside, not from within.

About the aggressive emphasizing on the "And", that is not really excited to say another thing that she wants, but she is talking about the same thing, fire that burns. So it really is out of place there.

But what is really unforgivable is the wrong melody in "but who cares". Both the "But" and the "who" are on the wrong note. She sings the melody there from the next line. The same melody twice, and the actual melody is not there anymore. The second line "No big deal" was written with a different melody for a reason. It reminds me of Amanda Seyfried in Les Miserables "There's so little I know, that I'm longing to know, of the man that you were, a time long ago" completely messing up the steps in the melody, basically just not understanding it and sounding uncertain and showing that she did not understand the material well enough.

 

 

[Seb28]

Posted: 9/14/22 at 6:26am

Emma_Pillsbury said: "

And I'm sorry that instead of accepting the answer I gave gracefully you chose behind the comfort of anonymity to take the low road by being unnecessarily rude and condescending to me.

Where is it written that I owe you an explanation about anything?

I am sure you are losing much sleep over all of this.

I on the other hand, am not.

You have yourself an incredibly wonderful day...or not."

I just asked you some questions about notes and melodies in the song. Which is kind of the point of liking a song or not. But please do not explain and have great day.

Updated On: 9/14/22 at 06:26 AM

[Seb28]

Posted: 9/14/22 at 6:44am

Joviedamian said: ""I want someone who understands and respects the material and who makes choices in meaningful ways. Is that too much to ask for these days?"

Then tell that to Alan Meken (he wrote the material) and LMM. What you want is a CARBON COPY of what was. If that's the case, then just watch the original and don't move forward in life. The creators (including the artist) made these creative choices."

I feel that is not the case. I think the atmosphere behind the scenes is the reason for it. Too much disconnect between professionalism and an overly friendly, very non-critical, popular kind of behaviour behind the scenes. 

If it really was deliberate choices there would be no actual mistakes in the melody (for example the "but who cares, no big deal" sequence). And there would not be actual failed notes that do not reach the actual note, for example in Cynthia Erivo's "When you wish upon a star" in Pinocchio. "Not caring or noticing" is something different than "a deliberate choice".

Updated On: 9/14/22 at 06:44 AM

[CarlosAlberto]

Posted: 9/14/22 at 7:12am

"Part of Your World" = "Somewhere That's Green". Menken & Ashman were their very own "plagiarists". LOL. 

[MagicalMusical]

Posted: 9/14/22 at 11:28am

Thank you for listening and replying back thoughtfully, Seb28! Ok, so, I do get why you hate the "be" in the second to last line of the song, but I feel like it's her last little whimper of passion before she is defeated that she can't be part of that world. Also, she does sing "world" a little passionately, too, but that also goes into quiet, defeated at the end for me.

That "AND"? Well, I couldn't find the link to the full song anymore, so I remembered it wrong. You're right, it wasn't getting excited to say the next thing. But, you say you find it aggresive, right? Well, if I'm remembering it correctly now, it fits in a different way for me. That she aggresively wants to know why fire burns. That she is starting to get agrresive with her desperate wish to know about the human world! That makes sense for getting to the very passionate end of the song for me!

The loss of the melody in some places...you may have me there. I may agree and think you are totally right there. But, I like her singing of the song so much overall, I do not mind. Like has been said, the orginal is an immortal classic, and the original melody will last as long as people still watch films from past times. I really love this new interpretation because overall, I think it's, well, amazing! But I will still watch the original along with the remake, too!

[Dancingthrulife2]

Posted: 9/14/22 at 2:19pm

Joviedamian said: ""I want someone who understands and respects the material and who makes choices in meaningful ways. Is that too much to ask for these days?"

Then tell that to Alan Meken (he wrote the material) and LMM. What you want is a CARBON COPY of what was. If that's the case, then just watch the original and don't move forward in life. The creators (including the artist) made these creative choices--how about respecting them to make these creative choices overall? You don't have to like them, but go in with an open mind to see something new; they did.

I was not expecting the riff, but actually feel that it works--brings more depth to the lyric and gives that "I want song" something to grab on too, before she hit's that last note. It works for me."

Would help if you do your research first. LMM DID NOT write the song. Alan Menken AND Howard Ashman did. And there has been umpteen information about how the song was intended to be perform by Ashman. Also, do you know appeal to authority is actually a logical fallacy?

And addressing the specific point you made. Yes it's about this "something to grab on to[sic]," but the point here is that there's nothing to actually grab on to since at this point there's no conceivable way for her to live on land. So the passion people have been praising Bailey about needs to be dampened, and not overdoing the last few lines is exactly the poignant disillusionment anyone who "understands and respects the material and who makes choices in meaningful ways" would consider doing.

[Sutton Ross]

Posted: 9/14/22 at 2:39pm

Jesus Christ.