Next for the Neil Simon - Page 2

[RippedMan]

Posted: 1/6/15 at 4:22pm

Honestly, with most of the Kennedy Center's transfers: they aren't always the most thought out plans. So I'm thinking they'll scoop up the Simon because it's available. I don't think the location matters too much as they can throw up a big poster in Times Square and Hudgens can plaster herself all over the TV. But their Follies didn't work out, their Side Show flopped...so you know. And I can't imagine this would become a hot ticket regardless.

[Robbie2]

Posted: 1/6/15 at 4:28pm

Hopefully a good cleaning as the theater is in dire need off being spruced up before any future production.
I doubt GIGI will go here as I hear they want the Rodgers but that all depends on the reviews @ the Kennedy Center.

[Kad]

Posted: 1/6/15 at 4:40pm

From people I know involved with Gigi, the plan was initially for a fall opening. Who knows now if that still stands. It depends on how the production is received and how easily a transfer is facilitated.

Also: this is not a Kennedy Center production. They are using the Center's space.

Updated On: 1/6/15 at 04:40 PM

[Smaxie]

Posted: 1/6/15 at 4:45pm

Just to clarify: Gigi is not a Kennedy Center production. It is being independently produced there by commercial producers as an out of town tryout. Comparisons with Side Show or Follies are meaningless.

[RippedMan]

Posted: 1/6/15 at 5:38pm

Okay?

[binau]

Posted: 1/6/15 at 6:14pm

"But their Follies didn't work out, their Side Show flopped...so you know"

It's pointless for me to say, but still - comparisons between Side Show and Follies are somewhat meaningless. Let's not compare Follies, which sold out practically every performance in DC, had some very strong sales in NYC in a short 4.5 month run and likely made back half of its investment to a show that would have been lucky to even cover its weekly expenses for a week or two, and lost everything. All flops aren't equal.

Updated On: 1/6/15 at 06:14 PM

[theatregeek6]

Posted: 1/6/15 at 7:29pm

Bdn223

Quick question. I didn't get the stop clause for Side Show from Jujamcyn to the producers since they are also a producer

How does that work?


Appreciate your well articulated answers in this thread btw

[bdn223]

Posted: 1/6/15 at 9:26pm

Yes the Jujamcyn company was one of the several producers of Side Show, but it was not one of the lead producers. Jujamcyn often invests in productions playing in its houses to double dip on revenue streams so that they can collect money through both rent and profits. The problem with being both producer and theater owner is that it technically breaks anti-trust law, which is why Disney, Warner Brothers, Universal, and MGM no long own movie house out side of a few flagship theaters. The way around this is that they are simply angel producers giving money to a production with little to no say in the actual creative process. Thus as the theater owner Jujamcyn, likely saw that by keeping the St James active with Side Show for the next 2 month they were going to loose more money than simply letting the St. James go dark for two months and hoping Something Rotten is a hit.

In theory theater owners make money when a show is running at one of their houses, but rent is often paid via percentage of gross rather then a steady figure which is a double edge sword. Hypothetically speaking lets just say rent is 10%of weekly gross for a show at the St James. If Side Show were to make its maximum potential gross of $1.1million then rent would by $110k. Last week was Side Show's highest grossing week and it made about $800k, which would equate to around 80k in rent. Excluding last week the show averaged $450k a week, which equates to $45k in rent. In this scenario the Jujamcyns have a fixed cost of $20k a week to simply keep the lights on in the St James. The fixed cost does not include paying ushers, concession workers, and custodial staff to clean up after performances along with the massive amount of electricity used by stage lights and sound equipment during a production. These variable costs bring an additional expense of $50k a week, thus when added to the fixed cost cost of $20k, the St James has a total cost of $70k a week, which likely rose the past two weeks as union workers were likely paid time and a half if they worked on Christmas or New Years. If Jujamcyn were to allow Side Show to remain open the next 8 weeks Jujamcyn would loose roughly $25k a week in terms of both variable and fixed costs, losing about $200k in total. By shutting Side Show and allowing the St James to go dark they are only paying their fixed cost and are loosing $20k a week for a total loss of $160k over the next 8 weeks until Something Rotten moves in.

Remember non lead producers only collect money when a show is turning a profit. Therefore even if Side Show was barely making its weekly nut, (we know this is not true) Jujamcyn still would not be getting any additional revenue from producing the show to make up to the deficit in their budget from general running costs.

I hope that makes sense. Please remember that above is a hypothetical. In all honestly I have no idea what the costs are. I was just picking numbers and percentages to help explain my point.

[theatregeek6]

Posted: 1/6/15 at 9:28pm

bdn. Thanks. Makes sense and clears up the confusion

[Mystic Pasta]

Posted: 1/7/15 at 8:48am

Gigi played on Broadway 40 years ago for 3 months and then closed. It was not well received and felt dated at the time. I have only seen a regional production but the book is flimsy and not at the level of Brigadoon or My Fair Lady. There is a reason it is Lerner & Lowe's least popular show. Also, with The King and I playing at the same time, I would think audiences would prefer to see that or see an original musical like American in Paris. I have never heard of Vanessa Hudgens but I do know who Zac Efron is. Maybe the producers can put Zac in the Broadway version of Gigi.

[neonlightsxo]

Posted: 1/7/15 at 9:16am

Maybe the Gigi producers are in talks to get the Simon-- I don't know. But the idea of Gigi succeeding with Vanessa Hudgens seems far fetched to me. She isn't famous anymore. She's only "famous" from High School Musical.

[CarlosAlberto]

Posted: 1/7/15 at 12:34pm

Gigi played on Broadway 40 years ago for 3 months and then closed. It was not well received and felt dated at the time. I have only seen a regional production but the book is flimsy and not at the level of Brigadoon or My Fair Lady. There is a reason it is Lerner & Lowe's least popular show. Also, with The King and I playing at the same time, I would think audiences would prefer to see that or see an original musical like American in Paris. I have never heard of Vanessa Hudgens but I do know who Zac Efron is. Maybe the producers can put Zac in the Broadway version of Gigi.

If you've heard of Zac Efron you've had to come across Vanessa Hudgens at some point...they both starred in the highly successful HIGH SCHOOL MUSICAL franchise for Disney, not to mention they were in a relationship as well.

Aside from all that this new production of GIGI is a more of a re-tooling of the original show. The book is being re-written and several of the songs from the film that were not included in the 1973 Broadway production are being used.

As for GIGI being Lerner and Loewe's least popular show, that really is a matter of opinion. The film is considered a classic and won at the time a record breaking 9 Academy Awards and the score is graced by some pretty classic and memorable songs.

[Smaxie]

Posted: 1/7/15 at 12:54pm

It was also the most commercially successful of all of the MGM musicals. And though I have nothing to base this on, I suspect there are more stock and amateur productions of Gigi than there are of Paint Your Wagon.

[Mystic Pasta]

Posted: 1/7/15 at 3:24pm

Never saw High School Musical. I know Zac from his role as Link Larkin in Hairspray. He was good in that. Maybe it's time for a Hairspray revival. I couldn't tell you what Vanessa Hudgens looks like until I just googled her and still didn't recognize her face.

Updated On: 1/7/15 at 03:24 PM

[Robbie2]

Posted: 1/7/15 at 6:30pm

Nothing till next season as the Simon is becoming a theater that only houses show that fail.
It needs a cleanse and a hit and it won't be Gigi.
Only long running hits after all these years are Forum, Annie, and Hairspray...just saying as it did have some successful limited engagements: At Liberty & All the Way

Updated On: 1/8/15 at 06:30 PM

[Smaxie]

Posted: 1/8/15 at 2:26pm

>Only hits after all these years are Annie & Hairspray.<

What about All The Way in 2014? It won Best Play and recouped.

And if you are going all the way back to Annie, what about the theatre's other distinguished tenants between 1981 (when Annie moved theatres) and 2002 (when Hairspray opened), like Elaine Stritch at Liberty, Matthew Bourne's Swan Lake, the 1996 Tony-winning King & I, the great Anthony Lapaglia View from the Bridge, the Dewhurst/Robards Long Day's Journey, Brighton Beach Memoirs and Biloxi Blues?

[Robbie2]

Posted: 1/8/15 at 5:31pm

^ true but not a lot as many of those were limited engagements so I will say long running hits in general...

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 1/8/15 at 5:40pm

Of late (Since Hairspray)the theater is a virtual deathtrap for new original musicals scheduled for an open ended run

Catch Me If You Can
Scandalous
Big Fish
The Last Ship
?????

[Robbie2]

Posted: 1/8/15 at 5:43pm

^Roxy

That's what I'm getting at...Thank you!

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 1/8/15 at 6:02pm

You're welcome

The four I listed happened one after the other interrupted by All The Way. Hopefully something will come along to break the string but do not think I Gigi will be it. It has already been a flop on Broadway . Even if it is totally redone, people will remember the classic MGM movie and will compare it to that. In general , our critics are not to kind to the screen to stage adaptations of classic MGM Musicals.

[Smaxie]

Posted: 1/8/15 at 6:13pm

What of the St. James, post-The Producers, with the following flops, under performers and non-recoupers?

Gypsy
Desire Under the Elms
Finian's Rainbow
American Idiot
On a Clear Day You Can See Forever
Leap Of Faith
Bring It On
Bullets Over Broadway
Side Show

Or the Palace, with:

Holler If You Hear Me
Annie
Priscilla Queen of the Desert
All Shook Up
Legally Blonde
Lestat

Or the Marquis with:

Jekyll & Hyde
Evita
Follies
Wonderland
Come Fly Away
9 to 5
Cry-Baby
The Woman in White
La Cage aux Folles
Thoroughly Modern Millie
The Capeman
Victor/Victoria
Damn Yankees
The Goodbye Girl
Man of La Mancha
Nick & Nora
Shogun the Musical


Or the other theatres that were one time or another considered "death houses" like the Belasco, Cort, Hirschfeld, Nederlander, Gershwin, Minskoff, Lunt-Fontanne...until each theatre has broken the "curse" with a hit, or several hits. It's total nonsense, and if we're going to compare track records, the St. James, Marquis and Palace have equally ill-starred recent history.

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 1/8/15 at 6:46pm

It has been discussed before certain house like the Cort were death houses

We were talking about the Simon as Gigi might go in. Were I a producer of a musical, I would wait for another theater to open up before going into the Simon unless they offered free rent for a year.

[haterobics]

Posted: 1/8/15 at 7:06pm

"Scandalous
Big Fish
The Last Ship
?????"

Err, OK, but why blame the theater for undercooked shows that audiences didn't care for?! It's not like any of those shows listed were universally thought to be amazing shows poised for long runs. Look at the preview threads for them, they were panned from the get-go.

By your reasoning, Scandalous in a different theater would still be running today?! On what planet?

(I removed Catch from your list, as I never had the good fortune to see that show, which closed before my then-annual NYC trip)

[theatregeek6]

Posted: 1/8/15 at 7:21pm

So. All of you Broadway experts actually believe that it is the theatre that makes a show fail? Really?

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 1/8/15 at 7:24pm

Just like stories of theaters being haunted, certain houses are jinxed to some extent. Lately the Simon is one of the latter category. If 2 more musicals in a row fail there, will you change your mind?