Posted: 4/11/25 at 10:13am
To my earlier point - which in no way parses the quality of the three shows, only the marketing challenge in a busy spring for musicals - Boop, Death Becomes Her, and Smash are all on TDF this morning, in my experience (I check twice a day) a first.
Posted: 4/11/25 at 10:15am
Playbill_Trash said: "I’m not a Jesse Green fan in the slightest. But is it possible there are people outside of this message board bubble that just like to like things when they're fun and good?"
Okay but that’s not really what one’s job as a critic is. If you want to see someone who understands the responsibility of theater criticism look at someone like Sarah Holdren at Vulture. It’s about critiquing a work and engaging with the art form and the creative approach to it, and assessing how successfully the show executes. While theater criticism has become something most people dread, at its best it’s a way of holding the art form to higher standards by having a conversation with the piece at a more insightful level than a typical audience member.
it’s perfectly fine for a critic—and anyone for that matter—to enjoy a piece of art that isn’t that good. We ALL do. I just said a few posts back that I enjoyed Swept Away—but if I’m going to *critique* the show? That’s a different matter. Looking at the show critically it was quite messy & failed on execution. The best I could say is it might not be great theater but if this style resonates with you, you may be moved by the shows themes anyway.
Thats basically critical analysis. Giving something like that a critic’s pick is weird. One would think a Critics Pick is reserved for pieces of extraordinary vision, execution, and merit (like English and Liberation), not pieces that a professional critic personally enjoyed in spite of its massive flaws.
Posted: 4/11/25 at 10:31am
Playbill_Trash said: "I’m not a Jesse Green fan in the slightest. But is it possible there are people outside of this message board bubble that just like to like things when they're fun and good?"
I believe the point is that a lot of people don't think the show is good, which is why they're objecting to such over-the-top praise. Are you suggesting that this message board is a bubble where people only like things that are unenjoyable and bad?
Posted: 4/11/25 at 10:50am
BroadwayGirl107 said:
I mean Swept Away, Redwood, and Smash are almost universally considered three of the worst shows of the season
Well, with respect, you might want to check the definition of 'universally". Even the reviews for Smash are a bit more positive than negative, and audiences seem to be loving it for the most part (though not "universally"). Do people seeing the show count as part of the universe?
Posted: 4/11/25 at 11:08am
RaisedOnMusicals said: "BroadwayGirl107 said:
I mean Swept Away, Redwood, and Smash are almost universally considered three of the worst shows of the season
Well, with respect, you might want to check the definition of 'universally". Even the reviews for Smash are a bit more positive than negative, and audiences seem to be loving it for the most part (though not "universally"). Do people seeing the show count as part of the universe?"
Do you know what the word “almost” means when preceding another?
Posted: 4/11/25 at 11:14am
Saw it on Saturday and, frankly loved it. Is it high art? No. But it is a great, fun, evening at the theater. Congratulations to all involved.
Posted: 4/11/25 at 11:30am
I've gotta say --- reading all of these total meltdowns from the Haters/Mean Girls last night and today (and I'm sure for weeks to some) is like Christmas has come early. Just wait'll y'all see the Tony nominations!
Posted: 4/11/25 at 11:54am
The theater queens on these boards are really pissed that the show didn't receive all negative reviews and that it's actually doing respectable sales?
Posted: 4/11/25 at 12:02pm
I'm happy for this show. I enjoyed it a lot and was moved just a lover of the theatre. Congrats to all involved on the NYT Rave.
Posted: 4/11/25 at 12:06pm
LMAO I was just scrolling on NYT and how the **** did this get a critic's pick.
Posted: 4/11/25 at 12:15pm
Jesse Green is an absolutely awful critic. I don't know how he keeps his job. This is why the NY Times doesn't have the pull it once did when it could make or break a show. It makes me miss Ben Brantley who was a huge curmudgeon, but he mostly got it right.
Posted: 4/11/25 at 12:29pm
The Times should just get rid of the Critic’s Pick designation. Or replace it with stars.
Posted: 4/11/25 at 12:32pm
Jesse Green did a Reddit AMA a year or two ago and was asked about Critic's Picks. He said that he considers a Critic's Pick as only a sign that "this is worth seeing", and does not consider it to be actual commentary on the show. So yes, he's given a number of Critic's Picks out recently that were on top of a Mixed review. Critic's Pick does not always equal rave, although it certainly did last night.
Posted: 4/11/25 at 12:34pm
dan94 said: "Jesse Green did a Reddit AMA a year or two ago and was asked about Critic's Picks. He said that he considers a Critic's Pick as only a sign that "this is worth seeing", and does not consider it to be actual commentary on the show. So yes, he's given a number of Critic's Picks out recently that were on top of a Mixed review. Critic's Pick does not always equal rave, although it certainly did last night."
I would love if the TIMES did a star system out of 5.
As with any star system, that means there'd be a lot of 3 and 3.5s, but I think it's much more valuable than the binary "critic's pick"
Posted: 4/11/25 at 12:57pm
ACL2006 said: "BdwyFan said: "The show is great fun and not surprised it’s a NYT Critic’s Pick by Jesse Green. And I’ll go out on a limb to say it could be one of the Best Musical nominees. Ya never know. The industry folk are loving how fun it is especially in today’s crazy times. And stellar performances!"
I highly doubt this gets a best musical nomination. There appears to be four locks at this point:
That fifth slot is between Death Becomes Her, Just In Time and BOOP."
For that fifth slot, Im actually picking either Death Becomes Her or Real Women Have Curves (which is absolutely phenomenal and everyone should go see)
Posted: 4/11/25 at 1:34pm
“ Do you know what the word “almost” means when preceding another?”
You did not make the point you thought you did here. Take the L and move on.
Posted: 4/11/25 at 2:09pm
ACL2006 said: "The theater queens on these boards are really pissed that the show didn't receive all negative reviews and that it's actually doing respectable sales?"
YES!!! YES!!!! THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT WE'RE PISSED ABOUT!!!
HOW CAN YOU POSSIBLY REMAIN CALM IN A TIME LIKE THIS?????
Posted: 4/11/25 at 2:21pm
Oh god forbid people enjoy a musical! Sometimes it feels like these boards are the industry's biggest bullies.
Congrats to the SMASH team!
Posted: 4/11/25 at 2:24pm
ACL2006 said: "The theater queens on these boards are really pissed that the show didn't receive all negative reviews and that it's actually doing respectable sales?"
Where are you seeing these "pissed" reactions? I just see people being a bit surprised and incredulous which is totally valid.
Posted: 4/11/25 at 2:54pm
Jjohansan said: "Oh god forbid people enjoy a musical! Sometimes it feels like these boards are the industry's biggest bullies.
Congrats to the SMASH team!"
Exactly. It’s fun. It’s funny. And stellar performances. I’ve a feeling the wraps are gonna be great today! I already know so many people buying tickets! Good for Smash team. Bravo.
Posted: 4/11/25 at 3:34pm
Sutton Ross said: "ACL2006 said: "The theater queens on these boards are really pissed that the show didn't receive all negative reviews and that it's actually doing respectable sales?"
Where are you seeing these "pissed" reactions? I just see people being a bit surprised and incredulous which is totally valid."
See posts 60, 62, 63 (this is likely the one ACL was referring to), 85, 98, 99, etc.
You may not see people literally saying "I'M SO PISSED!" but implying Green is taking bribes to write positive reviews and can never be taken seriously and has "lost his mind" is more than being "surprised." There is absolutely a sense that people here think the show deserved poor notices and are aggravated/frustrated/confused/pissed/whatever you want to call it, regardless of whether anyone is saying it out loud.
Posted: 4/11/25 at 5:15pm
i love when people react hysterically to something, and then when someone points that out, they pretend it never happened.
this thread is dripping with anger over smash's successful night last night. i get it, its such a messy stupid story that reeks of laziness, but i'm capable of understanding that what I like/appreciate may not be what others do. that understanding seems to have eluded many posters here- no big deal, anger/shock will do that to you.
ill be very disappointed if the Tony nominators join the SMASH train to the exclusion of so many more worthy works, but until then, i hope it sells some tickets and that the incredibly talented actors/crew stay employed for a bit longer than i had expected.
Posted: 4/11/25 at 5:52pm
Saw this on Monday and loved it; was ashamed to say so because everyone has been sh*tting on it. Good for Jesse Green for being brave enough to speak his truth.
I think the majority of the hate on this show is coming because people expected something very specific. Just because you thought what SMASH would (or moreso, should) be, and went in with expectations that didn't match what you saw, isn't anyone's fault but your own. It doesn't change the fact that what happens on stage is actually quite fun - in the moment. Green is just telling us what he experienced in the moment. And in the theatre, that's all you can do.
Congrats to the company of SMASH on their accolades. And honestly, I think the wild division this show has received is only going to drive sales more via curiosity and social media discourse (the very thing the show is about in the first place).
Posted: 4/11/25 at 6:17pm
You may not see people literally saying "I'M SO PISSED!" but implying Green is taking bribes to write positive reviews and can never be taken seriously and has "lost his mind" is more than being "surprised." There is absolutely a sense that people here think the show deserved poor notices and are aggravated/frustrated/confused/pissed/whatever you want to call it, regardless of whether anyone is saying it out loud."
You're right, I somehow missed the suggestion that someone is being paid which is strange and extremely dramatic. But, I hope everyone knows that BWW isn't some barometer for the failure/success of a show. Sometimes we get it right regarding shows (Tammy Faye, Gettin' the Band Back Together, Holler if Ya Hear Me, Heart of Rock & Roll) but still it's like a 50% success rate around here. So, if your opinion goes against others thoughts, so what? Don't be scared or ashamed to post honest thoughts, most people deeply appreciate it.
