Posted: 11/30/15 at 12:48pm
Thanks for asking, haterobics. I just sent you a PM.
:)
Posted: 11/30/15 at 2:24pm
Best, I recently read somewhere recently that wrapped in the story of The Wonderful Wizard of Oz were adult politics of the day. The Yellow Brick Road representing the country's switch to the Gold standard and the Tin Man, Scarecrow and Lion symbolizing, Manufacturing, Agriculture and Environmentalists respectively. The Emerald City, the Economic Utopia that the Gold Standard would lead us to. Much like what Lewis Carrol (Dodgson) did in Alice in Wonderland, where a lot of the characters were satirical looks at political figures of the day.
Posted: 11/30/15 at 3:08pm
I'm convinced that people are reading way too much into it as symbolism, and I say this having spent time discussing the very subject with two of his relatives.
There is no doubt that he was influenced by his own surroundings and life experiences. He was married to Maud Gage Baum, who was Matilda Joslyn Gage's daughter, one of the foremost suffragettes in our nation's history. To say that he was influenced by strong, powerful women in his life would be an understatement. I do believe, even subconsciously, this is why he gave the female characters in his story all the "real" power. The witches and Dorothy are the catalysts who have the power to move the story forward. The primary male characters (the Wizard and Dorothy's three friends) are either incomplete or a humbug/fraud. But at most, it's a nod to what was happening around him as far as the strength of female influences go.
Frank was born on a farm in Chittenango, NY, and his influences there are more prevalent than many of these other supposed "references." The Scarecrow and Tin Man, for example. The Emerald City is largely based on "the White City" which was built for the Chicago World's Fair of 1893.
And I am far more inclined to believe that this story of a 12-year-old Frank Baum sent to military school in Peekskill is the source of his Yellow Brick Road in the first novel.
Again, his primary goal and motivation was "to please a child." To entertain children. His heroine Dorothy is named after his own niece Dorothy Gage, who died at just five months old. Frank's wife Maud was inconsolable. The namesake is a tribute to their little niece who didn't live.
So there are a lot of theories and a lot of layers being projected onto the Baum characters and story line. Perhaps it's because his writing style is so lean. He leaves Dorothy to be pretty much a cipher at the beginning of his adventure, and we get to know her as her story progresses. But we don't delve deeply into her psyche, and she only speaks directly and plainly about her situation and her feelings. She is, in some respects, a blank slate that we can project ourselves and our own personalities onto.
I will add one side note, and it's one that has resonated with me ever since I discussed it with Hamilton Meserve (Margaret Hamilton's son). He said, "You know the real fairy tale of this story is the ending. Many of us leave our simple, ordinary early lives to have big adventures in the world. But we can never truly go home again after that. We aren't the same people anymore, and our homes and lives have changed. In The Wizard of Oz, Dorothy gets to go home again. That's the real fantasy. That's why this story speaks so emotionally to us."
I will never forget him saying that. And I believe it's true.
Updated On: 11/30/15 at 03:08 PM
Posted: 11/30/15 at 3:12pm
Maybe it's time for Hamilton22 to reveal its previous screen names.
Posted: 11/30/15 at 3:14pm
best12bars said: "I will add one side note, and it's one that has resonated with me ever since I discussed it with Hamilton Meserve (Margaret Hamilton's son). He said, "You know the real fairy tale of this story is the ending. Many of us leave our simple, ordinary early lives to have big adventures in the world. But we can never truly go home again after that. We aren't the same people anymore, and our homes and lives have changed. In The Wizard of Oz, Dorothy gets to go home again. That's the real fantasy. That's why this story speaks so emotionally to us." I will never forget him saying that. And I believe it's true.
"
Welp. Full-on weeping at a message board post right now.
Updated On: 11/30/15 at 03:14 PM
Posted: 11/30/15 at 3:16pm
"Maybe it's time for Hamilton22 to reveal its previous screen names."
Oh please. I've seen you bully people by calling them socks and trolls but It doesn't work with everyone. Your shtick is old. If you have a problem with me, put me on ignore. Simple as that.
Posted: 11/30/15 at 3:22pm
"
"You know the real fairy tale of this story is the ending. Many of us leave our simple, ordinary early lives to have big adventures in the world. But we can never truly go home again after that. We aren't the same people anymore, and our homes and lives have changed. In The Wizard of Oz, Dorothy gets to go home again. That's the real fantasy. That's why this story speaks so emotionally to us."
That's the best thing I've read all year.
Posted: 11/30/15 at 3:26pm
Lulz. This is for sure not your first screen name.
Posted: 11/30/15 at 4:04pm
One wouldn't have to be here for a week to see how distasteful you are to other posters. But it's not just you.
Updated On: 11/30/15 at 04:04 PM
Posted: 11/30/15 at 4:14pm
I'm not sure what's not just me, but it's cool. You keep pretending you're a brand new snowflake.
Posted: 11/30/15 at 5:00pm
Wow best12bars, I didn't know you wrote Oz books. That's really cool! 
Posted: 11/30/15 at 5:14pm
best12bars that quote gave me such chills.
Posted: 11/30/15 at 5:36pm
Baum created a very, very rich well of material in how he crafted Oz over more than a dozen books. Even if you do not enjoy all of them, and even if you only know and appreciate the first, there is a lot to be found in the following books that enriches and enlightens the first book. No one has to reinvent Baum's wheel, they just have to mine that well.
All of those scholars trying to draft Oz as a commentary on the American financial structure are fools seeking to look smart. The real world influences on Baum are not all hidden and they abound without having to create more. As bestie says previously, just look to Baum's use of powerful women and humbug men, the reflections of military conflict, the near direct ties to so many places that Baum lived and traveled through.
Posted: 11/30/15 at 5:38pm
I have read 2 of best12's books. I own them. They are wonderful.
Posted: 11/30/15 at 6:25pm
Posted: 11/30/15 at 6:37pm
I just can't get enough of Shanice. She's a sweetheart. Also, Elijah Kelley is surprisingly a very cute actor. I don't remember him being that charming in "Hairspray", but I love it.
Posted: 11/30/15 at 10:12pm
Here is a very interesting article that i think you guys should read: http://deadline.com/2015/11/craig-zadan-neil-meron-the-wiz-live-nbc-1201646727/
Posted: 11/30/15 at 11:42pm
teddy1996 said: "Here is a very interesting article that i think you guys should read: http://deadline.com/2015/11/craig-zadan-neil-meron-the-wiz-live-nbc-1201646727/
"
Meh, that's pretty much the same stuff seen in every other article or interview. Press time always gets so repetitive for movies and TV shows.
Posted: 12/1/15 at 12:06am
''With Harvey Mason Jr. we’re going to get authentic black R&B music and it’s not going to sound like Broadway pit band music. The influence comes with the way music is produced for R&B albums, which starts with rhythm tracks. And that’s what he specializes in''
I love this part of the article. Harvey is a great producer and he and stephen are going to do the music justice
Updated On: 12/1/15 at 12:06 AM
Posted: 12/1/15 at 2:16am
Just watched the Making Of special.
I think it will look good. Still not crazy about all of the costumes and I hope Latifah and Blige will ramp it up for the broadcast. The bits of music with the orchestra that we saw didn't totally impress me. It lacks the rawness of the original. And you can feel the "updating" in the sound. Blige could blow her song out of the water but what I saw tonight was nowhere near what she can do. Hopefully this was just for rehearsal. Same with Latifah as her "So You Wanted To Meet The Wizard" in this sneak piece was lackluster.
I noticed that Harvey was only in small snippets. Did they not want to talk about the book changes? Also, they referred to the movie as iconic. I guess this was part of their rationale for putting You Can't Win in the show. And the fact that Michael Jackson sang it. We all knew back then that the movie was not good. People were vocal about it. But of course they are going to praise it because that is what they are supposed to do while working on this project.
The commercials and this special are designed to get people to watch the show. Had I not seen the original stage show, I probably still would have the same feelings about it having seen the Garland movie a million times. But now I must see it so I can either say I was wrong or be able to back up my problems with it.
There are some massively talented people involved with this and no matter my feelings I wish them all the best on Thursday night! (Especially a friend of mine in the ensemble!) Jmo
Updated On: 12/1/15 at 02:16 AM
Posted: 12/1/15 at 5:53am
Very well put, uncageg, and I feel the same way. Ultimately, I'm hoping the cast and their performances will win me over and I enjoy it. I don't wish for it to fail, despite many preliminary disappointments.
I hope they all have a great show and do the best they can.
Posted: 12/1/15 at 7:28am
Phyllis Rogers Stone said: "Maybe it's time for Hamilton22 to reveal its previous screen names. "
While Hamilton22 is most likely a unique poster, he could very well be one of the "Phillypinto Trolls", just more likely than the average poster. We should all keep in mind that we don't know who is really who. To us, everyone else could be a troll. This goes into me now saying my very much possibly wrong thereoy, which is that Hamilton22 may be a troll, as his username follows the formula seen in other accounts we have speculated as "Phillypinto Trolls" which is the name of a somewhat newly put on show, followed by a number under 100, such as FunnyGirl5. However, due to the way that Hamilton22 writes his sentences clearly with proper punctuation and such makes the likelyhood smaller, but does not eliminate it. But why is Hamilton22 being caused of being a "Phillypinto Troll"? Because they have strong opinions. Are we going to acuse people because they want people to keep an open mind about a show that no one has seen? We shouldn't, as these are discusion boards. Could Hamilton22 be a troll? Maybe. But is Hamilton22 a person who allows us to see a different veiw and enriches our veiw on theatre, even in a different way? Yes, so let's leave them be for now.
Posted: 12/1/15 at 7:52am
KCW wrote: "But is Hamilton22 a person who allows us to see a different veiw and enriches our veiw on theatre, even in a different way?"
I want to thank you KCW from the bottom of my heart for that much needed laugh!
Truly hilarious!!
