THE WIZ: 2015 NBC LIVE MUSICAL- Page 55

[teddy1996]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 11:09am

 The all white Wizard of Oz (Judy Garland) classic has winged monkeys what were called monkeys in the movie as well as the original L. Frank Baum novel. Whats with all this politically correct nonsense? Its a fantasy 4 crying out loud. What difference does it make from monkeys to warriors? The racial divide in America is the highest its ever been since the civil rights era and no "fantasy" can change it! Then he says they don't need a political statement while he's actually making one from monkeys to warriors? Please.....

[uncageg]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 11:23am

Hamilton22 said: ""
 

 

 

 

I love this actually. It makes Dorothy more relatable to teens these days. Lots of teens hate school and hate the kids in their town. It sounds like dorothy will actually be a real person  rather than some doey eyed naive 2 dimensional girl that we are used to seeing. Harvey is great with books. 

 

Maybe some of you older people loved school and had no problem getting through it but that's not the case with lots of younger people these days. School is a battle and it's incredibly hard for some people to get through. Harvey is making dorothy a little edgier because kids these days are more edgier 

 

 

 

And good god Best12, get off it already,.Go make your own show if you are so mad about this one. Your pearls must be choking you at this point.

Kids today are the same as they were years ago. Us "older" people had the same issues with school as kids today do. We just didn't have social media. We hated some teachers and our bullying was done face to face with fights after school on the playground. Your comparison really holds mo weight.

 

.

 

"

 

[Hamilton22]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 11:33am

That's HIGHLY debatable, uncageg. But either way, I like Harvey's talk on Dorothy. Now if they would only just change Shanice's costume.

[c0113g3b0y]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 11:47am

Dorothy from the books, the Judy Garland movie and the original Wiz production was plenty relatable as a young girl thrown into the adventure of a lifetime. 

Harvey seems to be trying to make Dorothy into some petulant emotionally stunted whiney brat.

[seaweedjstubbs]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 11:57am

"I honestly expect that he is going to slip in a gay reference via the Lion."

The Lion in the stage version of THE WIZ is actually pretty flamboyant. Not sure if Ted Ross played him that way, as I wasn't alive to see it and the movie completely took all of the comedy out of the show/his role, but just by reading the script, you can see how the Lion could be portrayed as a gay man. Or maybe my closeted 13-year-old self just played him that way when I was in middle school, haha!

[jimmycurry01]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 12:26pm

Harvey's ideas about would be all well and good if the story wasn't already a timeless classic. The thing is, it is already a timeless classic that is familiar to millions via the book or one of the many other adaptations. They really just need to trust the material, it is a classic for a reason. It doesn't need help, or additional back story. The author's intent doesn't need to be adjusted for a modern audience because the modern audience already knows, loves,and accepts it.

[smallvillefan16]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 12:28pm

Hamilton22 said: ""
""It has to come in that mind of what a kid wants," he explains, "and so I started there. I wanted to say her parents are dead — it never said that. I wanted to say, 'I hate living with you' to her aunt. It's never said, right? In the movie, [she wants to leave] because her dog gets in trouble in [Miss Gulch's] garden, but I wanted to [say], 'I hate this school. I hate these kids. I hate living in Kansas. I want to go back to Omaha. That's where I was born; that's where I belong.'"

 

 

I love this actually. It makes Dorothy more relatable to teens these days. Lots of teens hate school and hate the kids in their town. It sounds like dorothy will actually be a real person  rather than some doey eyed naive 2 dimensional girl that we are used to seeing. Harvey is great with books. 

 

Maybe some of you older people loved school and had no problem getting through it but that's not the case with lots of younger people these days. School is a battle and it's incredibly hard for some people to get through. Harvey is making dorothy a little edgier because kids these days are more edgier 

 

It seems like Dorothy is one of the popular girls at school by the way Shanice plays her. If anything, Dorothy would have been very studious, which is why she  is more shy and reserved. She learns to come into her own during her time in Oz. However, they decided to change her so she plays like a hip know-it-all instead of a doe-eyed girl with insecurities all around her. Dorothy wants someone to hear her, but she's only a child which is why Aunt Em and Uncle Henry ignore her when she tries to get their attention. I feel like this version's Dorothy will just be kinda... loud and bratty? Or so it sounds from that article. As I've said before, Shanice's height really bugs me. The Wicked Witch of the West doesn't see Dorothy as a threat because she is just a little girl. You can't really say that when she towers above the witch...

Here's hoping I am wrong.

 

 

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"

 

[CarlosAlberto]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 1:05pm

The more I read, the more they reveal the more I am hating what they've done to this show, this story and its characters. I was willing to see it with an open mind, but these people involved are trying to literally reinvent the wheel. I now have absolutely no interest in watching this at all. 

[SNAFU]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 2:39pm

 Actually not. Dorothy in Baum's books was a determined young girl. She didn't douse the Wicked Witch by accident causing her to melt. She did it with determination and intent and did not apologize. I haven't read the book in awhile but I do remember her always complaining she was hungry.

 I don't think adding a little nuance to Dorothy's home life is a bad thing. I think you might be pleasantly surprised on how faithful this is to bothe the original musical and Baum's book. Though Dorothy Gale in the Wiz is probably 8 years older then Dorothy Gale of The Wonderful Wizard of Oz.

[perfectliar]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 2:46pm

best12bars said: "He's completely wrong for this project if that's his approach. And he thinks the flying monkeys are racial (?!?) so he changed them to Winged Warriors?!?"

 

The article reads like it was Leon's idea to change the monkeys, and Harvey just came up with the new name.

[Mr. Nowack]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 3:08pm

I do find it hard to imagine the Dorothy they describe singing "Soon As I Get Home."

[uncageg]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 3:43pm

Hamilton22 said: "That's HIGHLY debatable, uncageg. But either way, I like Harvey's talk on Dorothy. Now if they would only just change Shanice's costume.

 

For you maybe. I have been on this eath for a number of  decades. Helped raise 3 kids and have one of my own. School was its own battle then as it is for some now. And some kids love school now and get through with no problem.

 

"

 

[SNAFU]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 3:50pm

My most serious quibble, is they are still viewing OZ as a dream. It makes more sense for it to be a real place.

[Hamilton22]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 3:53pm

"

For you maybe. I have been on this eath for a number of  decades. Helped raise 3 kids and have one of my own. School was its own battle then as it is for some now. And some kids love school now and get through with no problem."

 

Regardless, Giving Dorothy more of an edge I think will help the character relate more to audiences . I mean, look at the Dorothy in the the wizard of oz film. No one can relate to that character on a personal level. And no one could relate to the 30 year old playing a 13 year old in the Wiz film. So I'm happy they are updating the character in this broadcast.

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Updated On: 11/29/15 at 03:53 PM

[uncageg]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 4:03pm

I will just say that you can't speak for everone. I related to he as did my nieces years ago when the watched the movie every year on tv. It is a matter of opinion.

[broadwayboy223]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 4:05pm

I think OZ needs to be a real place as well. 

[Hamilton22]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 4:15pm

"I will just say that you can't speak for everone. I related to he as did my nieces years ago when the watched the movie every year on tv. It is a matter of opinion"

 

I think  many people can relate to dorothy on a superficial level. We can all relate to wanting to go home and such, but neither Dorothy in the Wizard of Oz or the dorothy in The Wiz film is very relatable on a personal level. Sure you can feel empathy for them but no one talks like the character Judy Garland played, no one says the things that Judy said. 

 

Doing the character like Harvey sees her, I think will make it easier for the audience to root for dorothy (who is already a pretty dull character to begin with).

 

But I never said it would speak to everyone. Nor does it have to.

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Updated On: 11/29/15 at 04:15 PM

[uncageg]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 4:53pm

I was referring to your comment that no one can relate to the character on a personal level. That is pretty much speaking for everyone.

My end of this debate is over and I stand by my comments.

Updated On: 11/29/15 at 04:53 PM

[SNAFU]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 4:59pm

broadwayboy223 said: "I think OZ needs to be a real place as well." 

It was in Baum's books. Hell, Aunt Em and Uncle Henry retired there and were treated quite well!

 

 

 

[Mr. Nowack]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 10:20pm

In the Baum books, isn't Oz simply a forgotten continent in the Pacific or some such?

[broadwayguy2]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 10:54pm

Baum's OZ is a very real place; A fairy country in the middle of fantastical lands and hidden via magic from the outside world. Where it is exactly was never spelled out by Baum.

Baum's Dorothy is also every big a strong, mid-western farm girl who has experienced much and is loved at home, though she feels lonely there. She is determined. She is not at all a damn see in distress, which is what MGM somewhat turned her into. (I am being polite with my "somewhat "

i have always appreciated THE WIZ's ability to stay so faithful to Baum while streamlining the plot and making it effective in then-contemporary African. American culture. I sincerely hope that this production manages to distill that same magic into 2015 vocabulary. What I have seen, even the choices that I so far do not agree with, give me great hope that they will do that. I also see great evidence that they have finally learned what works and what does not to make a broadcast such as this fly. I am only sorry that it came at the expense of Sound of Music and Peter Pan.

(Choices are trivial things that I note as an Oz fan... Baum's Munchkin Country was blue and so it was when the wiz  debuted. Reds were reserved in Baum 's realm for the Quadlings in the south, where Glinda resides... Here they have given the. Munchkins a red and orange palette.)

[SNAFU]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 11:14pm

 It might be the fact that with a orange red background, Apparperle will pop being all dressed in blue. 

[Scarywarhol]

Posted: 11/29/15 at 11:16pm

"I mean, look at the Dorothy in the the wizard of oz film. No one can relate to that character on a personal level."

 

You have got to be freaking joking.

 

Yes, that's why that movie has utterly failed to work for 75 years.

[sparklemotion]

Posted: 11/30/15 at 12:02am

So excited for this. I watched the special, and I'm a little nervous about the Dorothy casting...she's really...how do I say...Disney? She's adorable but couldn't they have found someone with more umph? However, she may be amazing.. who fcking knows.

[best12bars]

Posted: 11/30/15 at 7:37am

I think some of you need to read the original story again by L. Frank Baum. You have a skewed perspective of his Dorothy.

 

Dorothy is an orphan. Baum says so on the second page of his book. She is a happy child, and her laughter startles Aunt Em, who doesn't understand what Dorothy could possibly find to laugh at. The word "gray" is used multiple times in the opening paragraphs, to describe Dorothy's surroundings and even the pallor of Aunt Em's cheeks, which were once red when she was younger.

 

It's Dorothy's world in Kansas that is somber and subdued, but she doesn't hate it, she still laughs, mostly due to Toto, who makes her happy when they play.

 

Very little else is said about her or her home life before the tornado hits.

 

In MGM's Oz, Dorothy doesn't run away because she hates her aunt and uncle or her life in Kansas. She longs for "a place where there isn't any trouble," because of the threat Miss Gulch poses to Toto, and that's what drives her to run away. As soon as the tornado hits, she "has to get home to her right away." She's not looking for the nearest exit. She is not in charge of her destiny.

 

In both the Baum novel and the MGM film, Dorothy is a reluctant heroine. She is lifted out of her ordinary, gray life and dropped into a strange land where she is perceived as a "sorceress" for having killed the Wicked Witch of the East. Harry Potter is a reluctant hero as well, so it's not as if this formula doesn't work. He doesn't realize that by surviving Voldemort's curse, he is idolized in the wizard world. All he did was live.

 

It's not in the opening scene, but throughout the Baum novel that we get to know who Dorothy really is. She is determined, focused, simple, direct, and although she is frightened at times, she shows great courage and ingenuity throughout her journey to the Emerald City and beyond. She rises to the occasion many times to face frightening situations. And yes, occasionally, she stops to cry.

 

But all the time, she just wants to go home. That's not something she "discovers" along the way. That's her wish from the start. Her emotional journey is that we see her grow and face odd, fantastic adventures and help her friends and find that even with the magic and splendor and sometimes horror of Oz, she still knows that her home in Kansas is where her heart is.

 

MGM chose to add in the journey that "it wasn't enough just to want to see Auntie Em and Uncle Henry again." It's that her dreams and her desires lie within herself, not in the place or places where she lives. They are inside her all along and she need look "no further than her own backyard."

 

They didn't change Dorothy's character to add this in, which is why I'm fine with the additional layer of storytelling. The emotional journey works well with the physical one.

 

But to make Dorothy hate her life in Kansas and living with her aunt and uncle, why would she want to go home? Even if she realizes that every place (including the Land of Oz) has troubles, why would she "settle" for a place she hates? With people she doesn't care for? It makes the song "Home" lose its impact. It's a song about complacency and settling for what you have, even if it sucks.

 

This sounds like it was written by someone who has never lived outside a "big colorful city" and doesn't know or relate to anyone who would care for a simpler life "on a farm" in a small community. There must be something wrong for her to feel that way. All it does is call attention to the limited perspective of the writer and creative people who signed on for that message. "Dorothy finds that even though she hates everyone and everything at home, she'll go back there and make the best of it, because there is love there (somewhere) if she's big enough to accept it and be satisfied with it."

What a crock of horse sh*t.

And for the snot-nosed brats on the board who have lived less that two decades in this world, we're talking about a story that has endured for 115 years, not 15 years. If you can't relate to it, that says more about you and your problems than this story. Because it has survived countless retellings and adaptations, and it's not going anywhere. It's here to stay. It's a powerful story that many people around the world can relate to. It has earned the term "classic" to describe it. It's not the latest hit song by Adele, or the latest iPhone app. It's a classic. Something you can't wrap your little heads around. I don't think it's your age, though, just a narrow, shallow vision. And a total lack of basic understanding.