BONNIE AND CLYDE only selling tickets until Dec. 30...- Page 3

[hyperbole_and_a_half]

Posted: 12/6/11 at 10:54pm

I'm really curious to hear from those who believe critics have a vendetta against Wildhorn: why? What could critics possibly get out of conspiracy against him? How would they benefit?

[MelissaF]

Posted: 12/6/11 at 10:56pm

Argh. Im coming in to NYC for my birthday in February, and was hoping to catch this.

[broadway7117]

Posted: 12/6/11 at 10:57pm

A cast album would have been great marketing imo.

[CurtainPullDowner]

Posted: 12/6/11 at 11:24pm

I think Frank will be back on Broadway, there seem to be a butt load of rich people who fall for his tunes and put up the dough.
He needs to stop trying to musicalize deeper stories and maybe attempt something modern day? The ALICE stories should have fit his work but what landed on Broadway was such a miss/mash, and had no focus or reason to be. Making the Mad Hatter, a woman and the villian of the piece is just too out there.

What is his most modern piece? He writes pop songs (great ones), why can't he find a good lyric partner and a modern day story, like GHOST? Or THE BODYGUARD? I think his music would have been a good fit for that material.

[philly03]

Posted: 12/6/11 at 11:26pm

"I'm really curious to hear from those who believe critics have a vendetta against Wildhorn: why? What could critics possibly get out of conspiracy against him? How would they benefit?"

Because he has proved (to an extent) how little the critics can matter - Jekyll did not receive many good notices and ran for FOUR years; The Scarlet Pimpernel received many bad reviews and came back 3 times! He's still very popular with the tourists/casual theatre goers.

[broadway7117]

Posted: 12/6/11 at 11:38pm

Yeah Frank will be back. Producers and investors know they can make money from tours and international productions of his shows. Also there are many shows to choose from. Not including the J & H revival, as philly said, the next most likely would be Zelda. Producers could very easially, after seeing the show next year, fall in love with it and end up throwing money at it..and there you go.

Updated On: 12/6/11 at 11:38 PM

[ChenoKahn]

Posted: 12/6/11 at 11:39pm

His cast recording's sell very well I will give you that. But Jekyll & Hyde was a flop even though it ran four years and Scarlet was a big flop all three times.
Updated On: 12/6/11 at 11:39 PM

[ljay889]

Posted: 12/6/11 at 11:57pm

Riedel on BONNIE AND CLYDE

http://www.nypost.com/p/entertainment/theater/hit_list_of_way_misses_391zpESeyAWJNIHHZ7EXjM

[jetts7]

Posted: 12/7/11 at 12:04am

Does anyone have tickets after the 30th? Did they refund your tickets? Please don't close !

[blaxx]

Posted: 12/7/11 at 12:23am

I'm really curious to hear from those who believe critics have a vendetta against Wildhorn: why? What could critics possibly get out of conspiracy against him? How would they benefit?

Because they love a good conspiracy theory. Isn't it wonderful to imagine all NYC critics getting together every night at a secret location to find a way to destroy a composer who has never turned a profit on Broadway?

The truth is that, critics aside, Broadway audiences have never cared much for his shows.

[ljay889]

Posted: 12/7/11 at 12:32am

The truth is that, critics aside, Broadway audiences have never cared much for his shows.

Philly will be here soon to disagree because J&H and the Pimpernel actually had substantial runs.

But his recent track record is absolutely atrocious.

The Civil War (1999) 61 performances
Dracula (2004) 157 performances
Wonderland (2011) 33 performances
Bonnie and Clyde (2011) likely under 30 performances

[philly03]

Posted: 12/7/11 at 12:53am

I don't know how you can call someone who has one of the Top 50 longest runs in Broadway history saying Broadway audiences "have never cared".

Regardless, he's forever in Broadway history for a few reasons: He was the first (and last to my knowledge as of now) American composer in 22 years back in 1999 to have 3 Broadway musicals running at the same time. Don't forget the double-disc concept album to The Civil War which featured (then) very popular Broadway, Pop, Country, Blues, R&B, and historians all coming together to record his songs.

And as said before, if the Broadway community didn't care for his work, how do you prove the (continuing) high record sales? (Many people, even his detractors, have at least one of his songs in their favorites)

[blaxx]

Posted: 12/7/11 at 12:59am

Philly will be here soon to disagree because J&H and the Pimpernel actually had substantial runs.

But his recent track record is absolutely atrocious.

You can argue about Jekyll & Hyde, but don't get me started on Scarlet Pimpernel version 3456566. That was nothing but a producer's stubborn attempt to find the show an audience - major fail. I remember watching the end of version 3.5 to an almost empty house and wondering what the point was.

There's nothing wrong with liking his shows, we all have flops we love - we accept them as such (just take Sondheim, most of his original productions were flops too). Yes, a four year run can be admirable. But in the end, if all his shows lost money on Broadway, who wants to argue facts? They just did not work critically or financially.

I'm sad I'll be missing Bonnie & Clyde. It really had an impact on posters here. So much, that there almost seems to be a concensus on him being a genius, victim to the anti-Wildhorn critic's society. No word on his past shows being really really bad.

[blaxx]

Posted: 12/7/11 at 1:09am

Don't forget the double-disc concept album to The Civil War which featured (then) very popular Broadway, Pop, Country, Blues, R&B, and historians all coming together to record his songs.

And as said before, if the Broadway community didn't care for his work, how do you prove the (continuing) high record sales? (Many people, even his detractors, have at least one of his songs in their favorites)

Sorry, love. I was talking about the Broadway productions of his shows. Not his record sales nor his success anywhere else. He can have 10 of his shows running on empty Broadway houses at the same time, I still don't see how you think he works on Broadway - not anywhere else.

It is perfectly fine to be in love his shows and scores. I find arguing facts tiresome.

But as I said before, I do find intriguing how the BWW community seems to be suffering from short term memory thanks to Bonnie & Clyde, which probably means it is a very interesting piece. For what I remember, the concensus was that the majority of his shows were a torture to sit through.

[philly03]

Posted: 12/7/11 at 1:15am

Well I can't defend the horrible staging of The Civil War (though the tour worked); the horrible book and total misguide of DRACULA (though the design effects and cast were top notched); the disastrous revamp of WONDERLAND (which was rewritten within a MONTH of previews by ghost writers - even though I loved the ideas out of town)....

But who is to say that Broadway is the last stop? I guess that's my point - Frank's CARMEN is a huge spectacle in Budapest, but it could never been done like that here.

[blaxx]

Posted: 12/7/11 at 1:24am

But who is to say that Broadway is the last stop? I guess that's my point

That's what I wonder too.

As I said on a previous posts, if he uses Broadway as a platform to find success somewhere else, why get so defensive about how he does on Broadway? In the end, some open in other cities to make it on Broadway. If he works backwards, there should not be a need to get so worked up about the luke-warm reception here.

[dented146]

Posted: 12/7/11 at 1:25am

So biaxx, you haven't seen the show?
I'm inclined to agree with Roxy. And hyperbole, it's very simple the critics get to feel important( which they are), they force producers to play to them; they get power. That's what they have to gain.

I;m not suggesting that they get together in the fashion of a conspiracy or that they even discuss many shows together. But there are only a handful and they exert enormous influence. They attend many of the same functions and know one another. They certainly have some idea of each other's mindset. If one critic has a beef with someone then it is quite likely others know about it. It's just human nature.

A vendetta can be something as simple as one person seeing something the same way as a friend. Updated On: 12/7/11 at 01:25 AM

[blaxx]

Posted: 12/7/11 at 1:32am

No, I have not seen Bonnie & Clyde. I read BWW poster's reviews more often than I read professional theater critics, which makes me very sad I'll miss it.

It sounds very intriguing and a lot of poster's whose views I trust have very nice things to say about it.

[Zenobia]

Posted: 12/7/11 at 1:44am

Can I just add as an European observer to these boards that Wildhorn is not THAT successful in Europe either as some seem to think here? Except for Jekyll & Hyde which ran a couple of years in different towns, none of his shows have done well here. "Rudolf" was a commercial failure in Vienna and did a lot less well than Vienna's other shows such as "Elisabeth" and "Rebecca", playing for less than a year. "Dracula" only had one short run in Graz/Austria. "Monte Christo" had a handful of performances in a small Swiss theatre. I don't know how successful "Carmen" is in Prague (not Budapest!) but its main draw there was not Wildhorn but the fact that a very popular Czech singer plays the lead and SHE puts the bums on seats. So although Wildhorn shows keep cropping up in small local productions, none except Jekyll have managed a longer commercial run in a big theatre.

And IMHO none of them were good. Rudolf, Monte Christo and Carmen came out at around the same time and all CDs sounded exactly the same and exactly like Dracula, Pimpernel and Jekyll. I got the feeling that Wildhorn just picks any old topic that interests him and chucks a dozen bland pop songs at it with absolutely no attention to the period and the feel of the story. Very notable in Rudolf, set in fin de siecle Vienna, trivializing the rather dramatic story of Austria's crown prince to a sappy fictional love story.

I agree with the poster who said that Wildhorn should perhaps focus on contemporary stories where his pop music works better. Or at least stories set in a period his music matches. I quite liked what I heard of Bonnie & Clyde and would have liked to see it on Broadway next year.

[bwayphreak234]

Posted: 12/7/11 at 1:51am

There's nothing wrong with liking his shows, we all have flops we love - we accept them as such

I am glad you said this, blaxx! I will freely admit that I love Wildhorn's shows (Wonderland is the only exception, but not because of the score but the dreadful book). The Scarlet Pimpernel is one of my favorite scores, and I thought Dracula had some lovely songs and absolutely spectacular effects and design elements. From what I have heard of Bonnie and Clyde, it sounds like some of his best work. I am very sad that it will not have a longer run.

[RippedMan]

Posted: 12/7/11 at 2:29am

I think he'd do better to try working on something original or maybe more obscure.

[dramamama611]

Posted: 12/7/11 at 2:36am

Always sad when a show closes shop so early. I just purchased tickeets to this for Xmas weekend, and still looking forward to it.

As to the question of refunds....until they officially announce, they will not refund. Right now I hold about 90 seats for March...no refund at this time. We'll get it, no doubt -- it's a matter of when.

[EponineAmneris]

Posted: 12/7/11 at 8:53am

JEYKELL & HYDE is by far his best known and most popular score, in a sense his biggest hit. THE SCARLET PIMPERNEL follows as far as I can tell. I *LOVE* J & H and there are moments in SP that are priceless and wonderful... IMHO.

I was excited for WONDERLAND and was sad that I had to miss it, but even more upset that it "flopped."

I am coming to the city next week and will now be sure to see BONNIE & CLYDE... if only just to say, "I saw it."

I must admit I have paid little attention to his other shows.

Wildhorn always seems to be "on the cusp" of creating a HUGE hit. He is talented, but somehow, someway, he always falls short... no pun intended.

And the way he treated Linda Eder was not cool from what I understand.

[Actor2]

Posted: 12/7/11 at 11:30am

In response to where the black and white Wanted posters are coming from, the cast is doing it on their own.

[Corine2]

Posted: 12/7/11 at 11:39am

Go and see this show. In my opinion it is Wildhorn's best work. I loved the cast, the direction and the music.

I have to admit that I did not like Dracula, The Civil War or most of his other work but I saw Bonnie and Clyde last night and loved it.

I have never had a vendetta against Wildhorn but I never liked his other shows. I now can say that I loved a Wildhorn show. Go see it!