Broadway dancer Amar Ramasar reinstated by NY City Ballet- Page 2

[Fosse76]

Posted: 4/23/19 at 2:37pm

South Fl Marc said: "Maybe I'm wrong but I think Alexandra Waterbury was never an employee of NYC Ballet. She was a student at School of American Ballet, the school of the Ballet Company and a training ground for new talent."

That's not relevant. since these were affiliated organizations, company members would probably be considered to be in positions of power over students.

I find this entire thing disgusting, but morals for things not related to work are not a fireable offense.

Yeah, that's totally not true. However, in this particular matter, his contract with the NYCB governs the terms of his employment.

Likewise, most certainly NYC Ballet will be dismissed from the lawsuit because their term of employing Chase Finlay was not on condition he have an affair with or sleep with Ms Waterbury, who was not associated with the company.

Unlikely. They are affiliated organizations, and as I said above, he would be considered to have been in a position of power over her. Since he was sharing these pictures with other members of the NYCB, it can be argued that the atmosphere fostered this kind of behavior, regardless if anyone in power had any knowledge of what was happening.

But then Ms Waterbury would not have "deep pockets" to suit."

Nonsense. But since you clearly think that sexual harassment is ok, she isn't a real victim.

 

[South Fl Marc]

Posted: 4/23/19 at 11:19pm

Fosse76 said: "South Fl Marc said: "Maybe I'm wrong but I think Alexandra Waterbury was never an employee of NYC Ballet. She was a student at School of American Ballet, the school of the Ballet Company and a training ground for new talent."

That's not relevant. since these were affiliated organizations, company members wouldprobably be considered to be in positions of power over students.

I find this entire thing disgusting, but morals for things not related to work are not a fireable offense.

Yeah, that's totally not true. However, in this particular matter, his contract with the NYCB governs the terms of his employment.

Likewise, most certainly NYC Ballet will be dismissed from the lawsuit because their term of employing Chase Finlay was not on condition he have an affair with or sleep with Ms Waterbury, who was not associated with the company.

Unlikely. They are affiliated organizations, and as I said above, he would be considered to have been in a position of power over her. Since he was sharing these pictures with other members of the NYCB, it can be argued that the atmosphere fostered this kind of behavior, regardless if anyone in power had any knowledge of what was happening.

But then Ms Waterbury would not have "deep pockets" to suit."

Nonsense. But since you clearly think that sexual harassment is ok, she isn't a real victim."

 

Please do not judge me <<edited by BWW staff>>. I do NOT think sexual harassment is ok, I was  pointing out that legally NYC Ballet had no other choice but to reinstate Mr. Ramasaar as well as questioning their culpablitty in the original suit against Mr. Finlay. Mr. Finlay should be sued and found guilty. I questioned whether NYC Ballet had any duties to police the relationship between a student of the school and a lead dancer who had no direct connection with the school. <<edited by BWW staff>>

 

Updated On: 4/24/19 at 11:19 PM

[starcatchers]

Posted: 5/19/19 at 7:16am

Per several people on Instagram, he made his return performance last night. Disappointing, to put it mildly.

[LuPita2]

Posted: 5/19/19 at 2:55pm

I attended last night, and everyone was exceptional.  He is an incredible dancer, no one can really say differently, but I did not applaud for him. He was met by uproarious applause by everyone else.  Either people did not care or did not know what occurred last year.

[Fosse76]

Posted: 5/19/19 at 6:15pm

LuPita2 said: "I attended last night, and everyone was exceptional. He is an incredible dancer, no one can really say differently,but I did not applaud for him. He was met by uproarious applause by everyone else. Either people did not care or did not know what occurred last year. "

They probably didn't know. The reality is that he is unknown to people who don't follow ballet. It's unfortunate that they couldn't keep him off the stage,  though the terms of his contract probably looky made that impossible. 

[Fosse76]

Posted: 5/19/19 at 6:15pm

LuPita2 said: "I attended last night, and everyone was exceptional. He is an incredible dancer, no one can really say differently,but I did not applaud for him. He was met by uproarious applause by everyone else. Either people did not care or did not know what occurred last year. "

They probably didn't know. The reality is that he is unknown to people who don't follow ballet. It's unfortunate that they couldn't keep him off the stage,  though the terms of his contract probably looky made that impossible. 

[poisonivy2]

Posted: 5/19/19 at 7:02pm

I was there this afternoon. I don't think most people in the audience really knew, and plus, whatever you think of his behavior, he is an exceptional dancer.

I covered his return on my blog:

https://humbledandoverwhelmed.blogspot.com/2019/05/spring-diaries-nycb-brings-back-brahms.html

[bwayrose7]

Posted: 5/19/19 at 8:19pm

poisonivy2 said: "I was there this afternoon. I don't think most people in the audience really knew, and plus, whatever you think of his behavior, he is an exceptional dancer."

Frankly, I don't care if he's an exceptional dancer or a terrible one. Gross, harassing, exploitative behavior is not excused by talent. I understand that the union rules and technicalities are why he's back, but no, I don't believe he deserves "another chance," especially given that he has not, to my knowledge, expressed any sort of genuine remorse or learning, but instead has stuck to the claim that he's really the wronged party here. Talent doesn't excuse or mitigate terrible behavior.

[starcatchers]

Posted: 5/19/19 at 8:26pm

bwayrose7 said: "poisonivy2 said: "I was there this afternoon. I don't think most people in the audience really knew, and plus, whatever you think of his behavior, he is an exceptional dancer."

Frankly, I don't care if he's an exceptional dancer or a terrible one. Gross, harassing, exploitative behavior is not excused by talent. I understand that the union rules and technicalities are why he's back, but no, I don't believe he deserves "another chance," especially given that he has not, to my knowledge, expressed any sort of genuine remorse or learning, but instead has stuck to the claim that he's really the wronged party here. Talent doesn't excuse or mitigateterrible behavior."

Bingo. 

[EllieRose2]

Posted: 5/20/19 at 8:17pm

 Several women in the company have expressed dismay at his return, and a sense of having been betrayed by the union that represents them as well. And yet there was Ms. Mearns, one of City Ballet’s biggest stars, a woman who once dated Mr. Ramasar, there by his side, seeming, at least implicitly, to endorse him.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/19/arts/dance/amar-ramasar-new-york-city-ballet.html

[Robbie2]

Posted: 5/20/19 at 9:36pm

LuPita2 said: "I attended last night, and everyone was exceptional. He is an incredible dancer, no one can really say differently,but I did not applaud for him. He was met by uproarious applause by everyone else. Either people did not care or did not know what occurred last year. "

 

he's an amazing dancer and was excellent in Carousel unfortunately he's back at NYCB but most don't know anything about what happened and or just don't care anymore as that's the world we live in...look who we have in the white house as POTUS...just saying.

Updated On: 5/20/19 at 09:36 PM

[NYadgal]

Posted: 5/20/19 at 10:06pm

His dance abilities are beside the point.

His behavior was unconscionable, and I have lost respect for NYCB and the culture they created, allowed and turned a blind eye to.

It will be a while before I support them again.  Things must change first.

[Mediamaven2]

Posted: 5/20/19 at 11:03pm

Robbie2 said: "LuPita2 said: "I attended last night, and everyone was exceptional. He is an incredible dancer, no one can really say differently,but I did not applaud for him. He was met by uproarious applause by everyone else. Either people did not care or did not know what occurred last year. "

I think the uproarious applause is because people do know what happened, and are glad he's back. Just saying that it sounds like most were well aware of his absence and therefore the reason why.  

[NYadgal]

Posted: 5/20/19 at 11:13pm

Shame on them.

[SweetLips22]

Posted: 5/21/19 at 2:29am

 I was watching ice couples dancing[that sounds a bit weird], anyway, I paused mid-leap and the guys hand was firmly embedded in the ladys crutch to hold her up. This is obviously allowed as there is a lot of personal contact with dancing and has NOTHING to do with the disgusting behaviour of Amar but how long before we read complaints about this.

LuPita2 did you attend knowing that he was dancing? It seems hypercritical knowing that and you still went along. Surely there was a performance without him then you could have clapped everyone.

[SweetLips22]

Posted: 5/21/19 at 2:57am

LuPita2 said: "Um, you should read the response above mine, I will wait. Because you should be DISGUSTED with that person's reply. Be critical of THEM for a second, not me."

I am only responding to the fact that you went to the ballet knowing that he was dancing that performance, loved everything but then gave him a silent protest.

Does that mean you didn't look when he was on stage?

[Mediamaven2]

Posted: 5/21/19 at 7:52pm

I have an unpopular opinion. That opinion is: I am glad the union took the position it did: that non-criminal activity off hours is not grounds for firing. It was too severe. If the union didn't defend this position, it would be a very slippery slope.  As a union member (different union) I am very glad to see the union standing by and defending its members. Even when unpopular/with political pressure of the moment. No, I don't think he should be stoned, his career destroyed. It would seem that in the better climate supposedly at NYCB with Peter Martins' resignation, there is more respect and sensitivity. It's not like the dancers uncomfortable with this haven't been heard or have any reason to fear repercussions. He's just another dancer in the company, albeit a popular principal. Balance, that's all.

 

[Fosse76]

Posted: 5/21/19 at 10:44pm

Mediamaven2 said: "I have an unpopular opinion. That opinion is: I am glad the union took the position it did: that non-criminal activity off hours is not grounds for firing. It was too severe. Ifthe union didn't defend this position, it would be a very slippery slope. As a union member (different union) I am very glad to see the union standing by and defending its members. Even when unpopular/with political pressure of the moment. No, I don't think he should be stoned, his career destroyed. It would seem that in the better climate supposedly at NYCB with Peter Martins' resignation, there is more respect and sensitivity. It's not like the dancers uncomfortable with this haven't been heard or have any reason to fear repercussions. He's just another dancer in the company, albeit a popular principal. Balance, that's all."

Good to know that you favor sexual harassment and exploitation. 

[Anakela]

Posted: 5/21/19 at 10:51pm

Mediamaven2 said: " It's not like the dancers uncomfortable with this haven't been heard or have any reason to fear repercussions. 
"

The women dancers here have been told here by their union that their union will fight for Ramasar's right to decimate nude photos of them without their consent, etc., versus their right to not have to work in that environment, as long as he does it "after hours." So who exactly are "the dancers uncomfortable with this" going to be doing any reporting of this behavior to, next time? How are they being heard? 

 

[JSquared2]

Posted: 5/21/19 at 11:05pm

Fosse76 said: "Mediamaven2 said: "I have an unpopular opinion. That opinion is: I am glad the union took the position it did: that non-criminal activity off hours is not grounds for firing. It was too severe. Ifthe union didn't defend this position, it would be a very slippery slope. As a union member (different union) I am very glad to see the union standing by and defending its members. Even when unpopular/with political pressure of the moment. No, I don't think he should be stoned, his career destroyed. It would seem that in the better climate supposedly at NYCB with Peter Martins' resignation, there is more respect and sensitivity. It's not like the dancers uncomfortable with this haven't been heard or have any reason to fear repercussions. He's just another dancer in the company, albeit a popular principal. Balance, that's all."

Good to know that you favor sexual harassment and exploitation."

 

Kind of ironic coming from someone with the screen name Fosse76, dontcha think??

[cbj97]

Posted: 5/21/19 at 11:24pm

SweetLips22 said: "I was watching ice couples dancing[that sounds a bit weird], anyway, I paused mid-leap and the guys hand was firmly embedded in the ladys crutch to hold her up. This is obviously allowed as there is a lot of personal contact with dancing and has NOTHING to do with the disgusting behaviour of Amar but how long before we read complaints about this.

Complaints about this are actually very active in the skating world at the moment, with former pairs skater and coach John Coughlin being accused of sexual harassment. He unfortunately took his own life shortly after accusations came out, but one of his former partners is his one of his many accusers (along with several minors who were coached by him). Similarly to dancing, pairs skating requires a lot of close contact- but the thing is it is all consensual and for the express purpose of the sport/art form.