Jennifer Lopez to Star in KISS OF THE SPIDER WOMAN Film — Page 20

joevitus said: "Jeffrey Karasarides said: "I can't help but think of how if Bob Fosse was making his Cabaret movie today and word got out how he wasn't usingany of the book numbers from the stage version, many would be reacting on social media like "Are you f***ing kidding me?!.""

I don't think there would have beenmuch of a reaction. How many of those book songs count among people's favorites? But as has already been pointed out, the film of Cabaret is more it's own thing than a Broadway-to-Hollywood adaptation."

I agree, the songs that were cut from Cabaret are pretty ho-hum. I'm much more sad about the loss of the book songs in Spider Woman, several of which are thrilling.

Yes, there is an early screening in NYC - but it's sold out. https://www.nypl.org/events/programs/2025/10/08/kiss-spider-woman





joevitus said: "Jeffrey Karasarides said: "I can't help but think of how if Bob Fosse was making his Cabaret movie today and word got out how he wasn't usingany of the book numbers from the stage version, many would be reacting on social media like "Are you f***ing kidding me?!.""

I don't think there would have beenmuch of a reaction. How many of those book songs count among people's favorites? But as has already been pointed out, the film of Cabaret is more it's own thing than a Broadway-to-Hollywood adaptation."

John Adams said: "

Although I’m familiar with the OBC recording of the musical, I’ve never seen the Broadway musical. I’m only familiar with the 1985 movie starring William Hurt, Raul Julia and Sonia Braga. I liked the script, but I absolutely hated the performances, especially William Hurt as Molina.

Roger Ebert gave the movie 3½ stars and praised Hurt’s performance saying, “William Hurt, who won the best actor award at Cannes this year for this film, creates a character utterly unlike anyone else he has ever played – a frankly theatrical character, exaggerated and mannered – and yet he never seems to be reaching for effects.”

I agree that Hurt “never seems to be reaching for effects”, although I would more bluntly interpret that as, Hurt “never seems to reach a realistic authenticity”.
"

The musical was my first exposure to the story back when I was 13, but I loved it so much that I did then rent the movie and eventually read the book, and frankly I think the movie is a pretty terrible adaptation (and I felt this back in the 90s--) And, yes, my main issue is with Hurt (who I believe in one interview said he approached the role as a woman.) It is interesting that the movie made the movie within the movie one continuous work, as does this musical movie and as did the original Purchase production--one thing people found so confusing was trying to follow the convoluted movie plot along side the overall plot--so of course, wisely, that was one of the myriad changes for the eventual Livent production. But, I can understand why Condon changed this again for his movie.

(The original novel, which I should re-read, I believe pulled from a bunch of movies whose stories begin to thematically increasingly reflect Molina and Valentin's situation, but of course the novel itself is written in a very stream of conscious way, and also goes on many diatribes--about the nature of sexuality, politics, connections between... Stuff that's hard to dramatize--interestingly originally Hal Prince had asked Puig to write the book--he had already written a play version-- but I believe what he wrote was seen as unusable, and VERY long--he did give his blessing for McNally to take over, though he passed away before seeing either version of the musical.)

I'm curious about your comments about Molina being presented as trans--it sounds like it's implied to a degree but left ambiguous? Of course this brings up issues like what it would mean to be trans in their time and place anyway, etc. I admit I feel like a horrible, old conservative gay guy when I say that the way I always say it was Molina is a very flamboyant, gay man, and I don't think that always should be read as trans to modern viewers--I never thought the lyrics of She's a Woman were meant to say that Molina wished they were literally a woman. I am sure others completely disagree with me.

I don't really like the idea of making Molina trans--it doesn't represent either how Puig or later McNally conceptualized the character. And it feels uncomfortably reductive. Because, yes, there were, are and always will be effeminate gay men who do not view themselves as trans women. Effeminate doesn't equal trans. It makes me wonder if, in the future, looking over the diaries, recorded conversations, etc. of men from our era and earlier eras who used terms like "she" or "sister" or "Mary" or whatever are going to be interpreted for future generations as "actually trans," when in fact it is just the language of some members of the gay community.

BUT we are in a period that is so hateful to trans people that I absolutely LOVE a major movie musical with a trans woman at its center--and one much more likely to gain mainstream interest than, you know, that previous one.

Someone in a Tree2 said: "Eric, so nice to see your post, old friend. Yours is one of the voices I miss most when I see how few posters from the past still contribute toBWW these days. But I digress."

Thanks for those kind words! And the feeling is mutual.

I really should stop commenting on this until I've seen the movie, but that is somewhat disappointing to me just because, as you say, I feel it does change a key element.

Again, I feel uncomfortable stating my opinion too strongly on this, but I will say it does seem like we've reached a moment 9in time where when a particularly feminine presenting (for lack of a better word) gay man from a different place and era (in fiction or history) is approached in a contemporary work, it's almost the default thinking to say "Well, we now recognize that they more likely than not would be considered trans or at the least non-binary, so we'll approach it that way," which I find unsatisfying for a myriad different reasons. And I'm sure people will find this way of thinking "problematic" but I realize a part of that too is that you take one of the first unapologetically gay lead characters in a mainstream Broadway musical (something we *still* don't have a lot of) and turn it into a trans role (and yes, that's something we don't have much of either.)

BJR, I really appreciate your post and I think I completely get where you're coming with (especially how that song would read to contemporary audiences--I guess since it's not in the movie it's a bit of a moot point.) (And yes, part of that is that Molina is a complicated character, and not just a gay man to emulate. I recently came across one review of the film--and I can't remember which one--where the critic was upset that as written, Molina made disparaging remarks about the appearance of certain actresses, etc--like that bitchy and sympathetic element to his character took away from our sympathies with them--honestly, a take on how gay characters should be written that I thought we had moved past.)

I feel like perhaps I'm simply being totally naive, but when I first heard She's a Woman, I simply didn't talk it so literally--more just a sense that Molina wanted to be "allowed" to have all of these (cliche?) feminine qualities and not have it questioned. OK, I'm having trouble working what exactly I mean, but...

Actually “She’s a Woman” is most definitely in the film, and takes up a major slot of the score (it combines with “Her Name is Aurora” to fully introduce Jennifer Lopez’s character to Valentin and us, the audience.) Yet I agree with Eric that the emotions in the song could just as easily be those of a gay man who envies a woman her place on the highest pedestal in the world as Molina understood it; it need NOT be the song of a man who wants to stop being a man and become biologically female.
In 1991 when K&E were writing the score and Terrence McNally the book, the concept of a transsexual was quite well known (Christine Jorgensen had been around since the ‘50’s.) If they had wanted to create a character like that for Molina, I’m quite sure they would have written exactly that.

Updated On: 9/17/25 at 09:39 AM

Jeffrey Karasarides said: "Unlike the original Broadway production where Chita Rivera contended (and won) as lead at the Tonys, Jennifer Lopez will officially be campaigning for a Best Supporting Actress Oscar nomination.
https://www.goldderby.com/film/2025/jennifer-lopez-supporting-actress-kiss-of-the-spider-woman/"

That makes sense. Nowadays, that’s a frequent way to get someone with a very large role but not the sole narrative a nomination, since the leading categories are often heavily stacked, and with people who carry the whole movie.

I absolutely see what everyone is saying about Molina and gender! I’m not advocating for any one definitive take. But I do think it’s a worthwhile discussion because indeed no one can argue that the intention of Puig or McNally or Ebb was for Molina to be trans. But then, their understanding of the trans experience would’ve been different then. (And a real life person experiencing the exact same feelings as Molina did then, could now classify themselves differently today.) So it’s a debate that’s often had amongst art historians / critics about whether/how to apply our understanding of our own times on a work of another era. And there’s no right answer.

Jeffrey Karasarides said: "Unlike the original Broadway production where Chita Rivera contended (and won) as lead at the Tonys, Jennifer Lopez will officially be campaigning for a Best Supporting Actress Oscar nomination."

I'm not a fan of that practice. I didn't care for it when "The Bear" contended in the Comedy category at the Emmys, either. For me, it just feels like a way of stacking the deck to win an award.

Updated On: 9/17/25 at 07:13 PM

^Agreed. Aurora/Spiderwoman is the sparkly object in the cast, but honestly her screen time does not merit a lead designation as far as I can tell. There is really only one lead in this film and that is Tonatiuh as Molina. When Aurora sings "...My Leading Man..." to him, she is correct about his status, if not her own.

BJR said: "
I absolutely see what everyone is saying about Molina and gender! I’m not advocating for any one definitive take. But I do think it’s a worthwhile discussion because indeedno one can argue that the intention of Puig or McNally or Ebb was for Molinato be trans. But then, their understanding of the trans experiencewould’ve been different then. (And a real life personexperiencing the exact same feelings as Molina did then,could now classify themselves differently today.) So it’s a debate that’s often had amongst art historians / critics about whether/how to apply our understanding of our own times on a work of another era. And there’s no right answer."

I think your last line is particularly apt. Puig was evidently interested in looking at the concept of gender-as-construct in terms of both men, and while that doesn't mean Molina was "really" trans, it makes the subject of gender and how gender is defined much more complex and open to question and opens the door for ideas about the the character being trans.

AEA AGMA SM said: "I can’t find my copy of the script to check to see what has been in the licensed script, but in the Playbill that’s on Playbill Vault the Morphine Tango Reprise is not listed, so it may indeed have been cut between London and Broadway. And of course since I’ve listened to the original recording so much, I don’t trust my memory of seeing the tour some 30 years ago as to whether it was in then or not"

Thank you!