New York in the 70s — Page 3
#52
Posted: 6/23/11 at 10:31am
Yes, there have always been visitors to the city, but to back up the statement that mass tourism didn't begin until post-WWII, here's a bit of info:
"...the city created the first agency to promote tourism, the New York City Convention and Visitors Bureau in 1935. By 1945 (end of WWII), the Circle Line boats began their sightseeing excursions.
A decade later (1955), tourism had become a major industry and officials actively marketed its image, eventually birthing slogans like "Fun City," "Big Apple," and "I LOVE NY."
History of NYC tourism
"...the city created the first agency to promote tourism, the New York City Convention and Visitors Bureau in 1935. By 1945 (end of WWII), the Circle Line boats began their sightseeing excursions.
A decade later (1955), tourism had become a major industry and officials actively marketed its image, eventually birthing slogans like "Fun City," "Big Apple," and "I LOVE NY."
History of NYC tourism
#53
Posted: 6/23/11 at 10:31am
Tagteam?
"You travel alone because other people are only there to remind you how much that hook hurts that we all bit down on. Wait for that one day we can bite free and get back out there in space where we belong, sail back over water, over skies, into space, the hook finally out of our mouths and we wander back out there in space spawning to other planets never to return hurrah to earth and we'll look back and can't even see these lives here anymore. Only the taste of blood to remind us we ever existed. The earth is small. We're gone. We're dead. We're safe."
-John Guare, Landscape of the Body
#54
Posted: 6/23/11 at 10:31am
Tagteam?
"You travel alone because other people are only there to remind you how much that hook hurts that we all bit down on. Wait for that one day we can bite free and get back out there in space where we belong, sail back over water, over skies, into space, the hook finally out of our mouths and we wander back out there in space spawning to other planets never to return hurrah to earth and we'll look back and can't even see these lives here anymore. Only the taste of blood to remind us we ever existed. The earth is small. We're gone. We're dead. We're safe."
-John Guare, Landscape of the Body
#55
Posted: 6/23/11 at 10:32am
How sad for you, Jordan.
NYadgal, loved reading your memories of going to NYC.
NYadgal, loved reading your memories of going to NYC.
Just give the world Love. - S. Wonder
#56
Posted: 6/23/11 at 10:33am
"Back in the 1920s, there were over double the amount of Broadway theatres that there are now, and because so much tourism died after the depression, the attendance went down and the theatres were demolished."
Actually, the advent of movies and television contributed to the decrease in Broadway theatres at least as much as any decline in tourism.
Actually, the advent of movies and television contributed to the decrease in Broadway theatres at least as much as any decline in tourism.
#57
Posted: 6/23/11 at 10:34am
Why is that sad? Obviously you haven't seen what Marian Seldes can do with her tongue.
#58
Posted: 6/23/11 at 10:38am
I loved what you wrote Addy, and had no idea you were born in NYC.
I lived in NYC from 1987-2000. I'm there at least once a month. I made a comment just last weekend, that I don't ever remember Times Square being as congested with pedestrian traffic as it is now.
I lived in NYC from 1987-2000. I'm there at least once a month. I made a comment just last weekend, that I don't ever remember Times Square being as congested with pedestrian traffic as it is now.
Hey Dottie!
Did your colleagues enjoy the cake even though your cat decided to sit on it? ~GuyfromGermany
#59
Posted: 6/23/11 at 10:39am
Another big part of my memories from back then was taking the Amtrak train to New York and saving a bit of money to buy something in the cafe car for the ride up.
Just give the world Love. - S. Wonder
#60
Posted: 6/23/11 at 10:42am
why are you so intent on proving that "MASS tourism didn't begin until post-WWII" I never disagreed, I just said new york has always been a tourist destination. whether in the masses or not.
#61
Posted: 6/23/11 at 11:09am
The basic point here is the insistence that several people have that Broadway came into being because of (and would die without) tourists, a common enough mistake among most people who think the world has always operated as it does now.
Whereas tourism today is in the millions per year, before 1945 it would have been measured in the thousands. NYC was not as designed to please visitors then as it is now. It was a city primarily driven for and by its own inhabitants.
The difference is important.
Whereas tourism today is in the millions per year, before 1945 it would have been measured in the thousands. NYC was not as designed to please visitors then as it is now. It was a city primarily driven for and by its own inhabitants.
The difference is important.
#62
Posted: 6/23/11 at 11:13am
Lovely memories, Addy.
When I was a teenager in the 70s, taking acting classes on Saturday mornings, I would go to a matinee after my classes ended and saw things like Company and Follies multiple times.
I rarely waited at the stage door, and when I did, there were never more than a handful of people.
One day when I was fourteen, I went to see Sir John Gielgud and Sir Ralph Richardson in an early four-character play by David Storey called Home, which took place in a sedate mental institution.
The two of them were extraordinary, as were the two women in the cast, Mona Washbourne and Dandy Nichols.
I decided to wait and have them sign my Playbill--and see if they would talk to me!
The only other autographs I had ever asked for were Ann Miller, after Mame, and Shelley Winters, after Minnie's Boys. (Instead of signing my program, Miss Winters kissed me--full, on the lips.)
I waited at the stage door and Sir Ralph came out first, bustling past me and the few others very abruptly. Then Sir John come out, stopped and spoke to a few people, and noticed I was waiting. He signed my Playbill and asked if I was interested in theater. I replied that I was, and that I was studying to be an actor. And then I said, very proudly, "At the Lee Strasberg Theater Institute!"
Sir John looked at me with what I realized later was pity and said, "Ah, yes. The Method. Well, I'm sure you will learn a great deal from Mr. Strasberg."
When I was a teenager in the 70s, taking acting classes on Saturday mornings, I would go to a matinee after my classes ended and saw things like Company and Follies multiple times.
I rarely waited at the stage door, and when I did, there were never more than a handful of people.
One day when I was fourteen, I went to see Sir John Gielgud and Sir Ralph Richardson in an early four-character play by David Storey called Home, which took place in a sedate mental institution.
The two of them were extraordinary, as were the two women in the cast, Mona Washbourne and Dandy Nichols.
I decided to wait and have them sign my Playbill--and see if they would talk to me!
The only other autographs I had ever asked for were Ann Miller, after Mame, and Shelley Winters, after Minnie's Boys. (Instead of signing my program, Miss Winters kissed me--full, on the lips.)
I waited at the stage door and Sir Ralph came out first, bustling past me and the few others very abruptly. Then Sir John come out, stopped and spoke to a few people, and noticed I was waiting. He signed my Playbill and asked if I was interested in theater. I replied that I was, and that I was studying to be an actor. And then I said, very proudly, "At the Lee Strasberg Theater Institute!"
Sir John looked at me with what I realized later was pity and said, "Ah, yes. The Method. Well, I'm sure you will learn a great deal from Mr. Strasberg."
Updated On: 6/23/11 at 11:13 AM
#63
Posted: 6/23/11 at 11:14am
I first came to New York in 1980 and I was staying on W30th and 9th and between the subway and home I would get aggressively panhandled constantly. I always gave them a quarter because I was afraid of getting hurt. Then someone told me to act a little crazy and they'll leave you alone. So when I would see someone approaching me, I'd start singing something like "I'm Still Here" and sure enough, they'd walk right past me. I remember carrying my subway token clutched in my hand and watching to see what turnstyles other people were using because 'token suckers' would jam turnstyles and steal your token after you left in frustration. I miss Chock Full O' Nuts on Broadway (now, sadly, a Duane Reade), Howard Johnson's, and of course, the Gaiety.
'Our whole family shouts. It comes from us livin' so close to the railroad tracks'
#64
Posted: 6/23/11 at 11:19am
PalJoey, if ever a dream of mine that didn't come true still kind of upsets me, to this day it is that I so wanted to study under Lee Strasberg. I was heartbroken when I realized it would never happen.
Just give the world Love. - S. Wonder
#65
Posted: 6/23/11 at 11:23am
I just hate those people that stop in the middle of the street and start kissing. Get a room!!!
If anyone ever tells you that you put too much Parmesan cheese on your pasta, stop talking to them. You don't need that kind of negativity in your life.
#66
Posted: 6/23/11 at 11:49am
As for the change in the stage dooring phenomenon I would agree that the Internet has had some part in that. Not so much that it has increased the recognizability of the actors, but it has increased the way fans can publicize the fact that they now "know" these actors and can brag about it to their 1200 friends on Facebook.
#67
Posted: 6/23/11 at 11:50am
"So when I would see someone approaching me, I'd start singing something like "I'm Still Here" and sure enough, they'd walk right past me."
I learned the same lesson.
I started coming to the city after HS Graduation in 1981, and moved here in 1984. Things change, and that's great...so I wont complain that it isnt the good old days anymore, but I never felt truly threatened in Times Square. It was always too crowded. There were a few places that were much more scary because there was noone around to hear your screams.
Now I work in TS and it's so frustrating to walk around...even through the pedestrian walkways. I'm amazed too, how entitled some tourists are. They will literally walk right into you and give you a dirty look. Of course noone has a more withering look than me, so...Anyway, this is not the area I care to hang out in anymore, unless I have a theater ticket.
I learned the same lesson.
I started coming to the city after HS Graduation in 1981, and moved here in 1984. Things change, and that's great...so I wont complain that it isnt the good old days anymore, but I never felt truly threatened in Times Square. It was always too crowded. There were a few places that were much more scary because there was noone around to hear your screams.
Now I work in TS and it's so frustrating to walk around...even through the pedestrian walkways. I'm amazed too, how entitled some tourists are. They will literally walk right into you and give you a dirty look. Of course noone has a more withering look than me, so...Anyway, this is not the area I care to hang out in anymore, unless I have a theater ticket.
"Carson has combined his passion for helping children with his love for one of Cincinnati's favorite past times - cornhole - to create a unique and exciting event perfect for a corporate outing, entertaining clients or family fun."
"In Oz, the verb is douchifizzation." PRS
"In Oz, the verb is douchifizzation." PRS
#68
Posted: 6/23/11 at 1:00pm
I remember being a kid and going in to the city one day with my brother. This must have been late 80s. We got off at 42nd St, hands in pockets. Fearful, but adventurous. We grew up in Brooklyn, so we weren't that afraid. My brother couldn't have cared less. As soon as we got out of the station we saw a guy sitting on the sidewalk smoking crack out of a crack pipe, out in the open, in the broad daylight. Just then, a couple cops came strolling down the street towards us. I turned to my brother, elbowed him and said, "They're gonna bust him, they're gonna bust him!"
As the cops passed the guy sitting on the sidewalk in front of the station, still holding up his pipe and smoking openly, one turned to the other and said, "Ain't that a shame...". And they kept walking.
On 42nd St.
As the cops passed the guy sitting on the sidewalk in front of the station, still holding up his pipe and smoking openly, one turned to the other and said, "Ain't that a shame...". And they kept walking.
On 42nd St.
#69
Posted: 6/23/11 at 2:14pm
Best12 bars mentioned that one of the things responsible for the high cost of producing a Broadway show is the high salary that so many leads command today. While this was not so prevalent in the "GOLDEN YEARS", there were exceptions. Ethel Merman as an established mega-star received $5,000 a week during her run in GYPSY from 1959 to 1961. I would bet that her rival Tony nominee in 1959, THE SOUND OF MUSIC star Mary Martin, probably received a similar amount.
"Madam Rose...and her daughter...Gypsy!"
#70
Posted: 6/23/11 at 2:43pm
I was able to see the refurbishing of the Selwyn when The Wooster Group did their performances of The Hairy Ape inside the theater.
If anyone ever tells you that you put too much Parmesan cheese on your pasta, stop talking to them. You don't need that kind of negativity in your life.
#71
Posted: 6/23/11 at 2:51pm
I was born on the Lower East Side lived there until I was about 7 or 8 and then we moved to the Bronx. I returned to the city circa 1982 when I started high school. I went to school on 49th between 8th and 9th Avenue. Back then it was known as "Hell's Kitchen", now realtors refer to it as "Clinton"...whatever.
The Times Square of the '80s was my playground.
The Times Square of the '80s was my playground.
#72
Posted: 6/23/11 at 3:24pm
I was very young and working an office job full time in late 70s New York. I never felt in danger, though I was always SUPER cognizant of who was around me at all times (I'm a neurotic NYer and I'm STILL like that.)
Yes, it was dirtier and there were LOTS of skeezy people around---but Time Square was UNIQUE, it wasn't the Disneyfied mall experience it is now.
NO business can afford to be there anymore except franchises and chain stores. It's f*cking depressing, quite frankly....
Yes, it was dirtier and there were LOTS of skeezy people around---but Time Square was UNIQUE, it wasn't the Disneyfied mall experience it is now.
NO business can afford to be there anymore except franchises and chain stores. It's f*cking depressing, quite frankly....
#73
Posted: 6/23/11 at 4:05pm
What bothers me even more is how it has raised real estate prices so high that Manhattan is virtually untenable to those who aren't well off or have rent control.
#74
Posted: 6/23/11 at 4:10pm
As much as it will make some people scream, brick, I think that we would see a real renaissance if New York were to get close to bankruptcy again. As it is now, artists working for art alone simply can't exist in the city as they could in the 70s.
It would be virtually impossible for a Charles Ludlam to come of age today, forming a troupe, finding a theatre, writing and producing his own bizarre and brilliantly entertaining shows for a couple hundred dollars, and receiving attention from the Times. A new Circle Rep would be equally impossible.
It would be virtually impossible for a Charles Ludlam to come of age today, forming a troupe, finding a theatre, writing and producing his own bizarre and brilliantly entertaining shows for a couple hundred dollars, and receiving attention from the Times. A new Circle Rep would be equally impossible.
#75
Posted: 6/23/11 at 4:24pm
As much as it will make some people scream, brick, I think that we would see a real renaissance if New York were to get close to bankruptcy again. As it is now, artists working for art alone simply can't exist in the city as they could in the 70s.
That's a large part of the issue that I struggle with, when I try and rationalize people talking about how much they liked New York in the 70s and 80s. Again, I wasn't there, but I would gather that much of that comes from knowing that the people who were there (either in the audience or on the stage) wanted to be there. They wanted to be artists or they wanted to appreciate art. New York seemed scary to outsiders, so many stayed away.
I'm going to guess that almost no one here wants it to go back to the way it was when token suckers ruled that subways and subway riders felt so unsafe that they took to carrying guns. I'm sure no one wants to see the Bronx burning again. I think what most of the posters here want is that feeling they had when the city felt alive with creative energy. I know that's what I want and although I think you're right about another bankruptcy leading to a renaissance, I really hope there's another way for it to happen.
Of course I could be totally wrong. How do I know some of you weren't scamming the system and stealing people's tokens?
That's a large part of the issue that I struggle with, when I try and rationalize people talking about how much they liked New York in the 70s and 80s. Again, I wasn't there, but I would gather that much of that comes from knowing that the people who were there (either in the audience or on the stage) wanted to be there. They wanted to be artists or they wanted to appreciate art. New York seemed scary to outsiders, so many stayed away.
I'm going to guess that almost no one here wants it to go back to the way it was when token suckers ruled that subways and subway riders felt so unsafe that they took to carrying guns. I'm sure no one wants to see the Bronx burning again. I think what most of the posters here want is that feeling they had when the city felt alive with creative energy. I know that's what I want and although I think you're right about another bankruptcy leading to a renaissance, I really hope there's another way for it to happen.
Of course I could be totally wrong. How do I know some of you weren't scamming the system and stealing people's tokens?
When I see the phrase "the ____ estate", I imagine a vast mansion in the country full of monocled men and high-collared women receiving letters about productions across the country and doing spit-takes at whatever they contain.
-Kad
