Phantom to change to "re-staged" production in flagship productions? — Page 2

As someone who has seen the show 100 times or more (and that's not hyperbole), this change would end my relationship with Phantom. Gutting the Prince/Bjornson masterpiece and installing Cameron Mackintosh's "re-imagined" U.S. Tour production in Her Majesty's Theatre and The Majestic would be an unforgivable sin. 

While first-time tourists in London and New York may account for a healthy slice of Phantom ticket-buyers, the show also enjoys an unusually large amount of repeat visits from theatregoers such as myself. Those whose first exposure to Phantom was the recent CamMack redesign may not care, and may even welcome such a change, but the vast majority of longtime aficionados who were introduced to the show via "the brilliant original" will almost certainly turn away.

As I've said before on this board, I have literally seen Phantom of the Opera at least once every time I've visited New York (which, pre-Covid-19, was typically 3-4 times per year) and London, including both the 25th and 30th anniversary performances in New York and two of the three Royal Albert Hall 25th anniversary performances. If this nightmare becomes reality, it's over. I predict that the show will limp along for a brief period and then close.

Goodbye, "Longest-Running-Musical-in-Broadway History".

Updated On: 6/21/20 at 09:44 AM

https://twitter.com/OfficialALW/status/1274999965740392449?s=20

"Please believe me. I'm doing everything in my power to ensure that when the Phantom returns it is the brilliant original - ALW"

Why would this not be in his power? Does he not own the show he created with Maria Bjornson, Gillian Lynne, and Hal Prince, all of whom are (sadly) dead now?

Updated On: 6/22/20 at 10:12 AM

I imagine this could end up in court if Cameron and Andrew's Really Useful Group don't reach an agreement privately on the show's future.

Has it hurt sales for Les Miz in London? Glad I saw the original 2 years ago before it closed. 

Lot666 said: "https://twitter.com/OfficialALW/status/1274999965740392449?s=20

"Please believe me. I'm doing everything in my power to ensure that when the Phantom returns it is the brilliant original - ALW"

Why would this not be in his power? Does he not own the show he created with Maria Bjornson, Gillian Lynne, and Hal Prince, all of whom are (sadly) dead now?"

I think you are reading too much into the statement. He simply means that he will do everything in his power to reopen the show, and that it will be the original production when it does. Period. 

Tag said: "^No I think, it only confirms that these rumours are true."

Even if it were true, there would likely be issues with doing the same in New York. Chief among them is cost, but a lengthy closure would also likely affect its tenancy at the Majestic (and if/when renewed, a stop-clause would most certainly be a part of the new agreement, which the current one does not have).

***EDIT

According to some on the Theatreboard.uk, the physical set is woefully outdated and needs to be replaced (the way they go on and on about it, you'd think it was a deathtrap). The "new" production would look more like the recent UK tour.

Updated On: 6/22/20 at 01:28 PM

cwilliams said: "If the show can't go on in it's current form because of low ticket sales, which I didn't think was an issue"

I seriously doubt that as well. This isn't about weak ticket sales, it's about Cameron Mackintosh being one of those millionaires for whom there can never be "enough" money. He's not a composer or an artist of any kind; he's simply a ruthless capitalist.

Updated On: 6/22/20 at 03:00 PM

I can't speak to the most recent UK tour, but the one that closed not too long in the US was not really all that scaled back. It was only 1 or 2 trucks smaller than the original tour, and more than a few venues actually had to do some renovations to host that tour, namely beefing up the support of their stage floors because that central set piece weighed close to 10 tons. The one advantage it may have had was that it was designed and built with updated technology and show controls, but as Disney showed with The Lion King, you can send out an "updated" tour that looks 95% the same as the original but has updated mechanics and show controls and is easier to load in and out.

The recent world tour that was supposed to be the “brilliant original” used that same painted main drape.

Updated On: 6/22/20 at 07:56 PM

I believe for the new UK tour, the "brilliant original....sort of", they got rid of the angel and had the Phantom pop out from behind an added gargoyle in the cemetery set instead of flying in on the angel. I recall someone sharing a video of the new chandelier that looked to be some sort of a huge track that extend from the ceiling to the false proscenium, where the angel used to be. So the original false proscenium would still be there, with no angel in the middle of it. I've heard people say that the angel was never safe and "they" have been wanting to get rid of it for years. 

I am going to quote Justin D from last November, 2019, because he shared a video of what the new chandelier may look like, along with a picture of the Angel-free proscenium, and a video of the new tour........which apparently may become the new Broadway/West End.  Much of it does look the same; I certainly see some Lynne dance moments there, but not enough of the show is shown to really tell what else has been changed.  

Here's Justin D's post from last November with the links: 

sbflyfan said: "I have no doubt the new "world tour" will end up in North America within the next few years, probably advertised as "the brilliant original" or something similar.

However, this is still NOT a replica staging of the original Prince/ Björnson touring production, and it does water-down certain scenic elements and effects.

Most notably, the chandelier travels on a track, much like the version which is available to rent for school productions. It moves in a very similar fashion to this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lci_WAiONHw

The track gets in the way of the angel statue, which is no longer present at the top center of the proscenium. The angel statue is used during the rooftop scene, but only as a standalone prop on stage for the Phantom to hide in and appear from.

As the cast bows in front of the closed red curtains, the Phantom is briefly illuminated behind them to shout "Go!" before the chandelier falls.

There are photos where some of the adapted designs are visible here: https://www.edwardpierce.com/phantomoftheopera"

If this were to tour the US in 5-10 years from now, I could live with the changes. My only tiny issue is I still feel they could design something to go up in the proscenium between the tracks so it doesnt look so bare. Also from the press clip in Dubai, the deck candles seem to be only about a quarter of the amount of candles usually used. 

But the lighting is gorgeous and it looks wonderful.

Tag said: "Is the "current" UK tour the same staging as the South Korean international tour? Both the "brilliant original" with the modifications?

It is not, and that is where the confusion is. 

South Korean International tour designs:
https://www.edwardpierce.com/phantomoftheopera

This production tries to remain mostly true to the original flagship design elements.

"Current" UK tour which opened at the beginning of 2020:
https://www.instagram.com/p/B86-D4pnU1A/

https://twitter.com/phantomopera/status/1235607487631540224

This production pulls front-of-house elements (scrim and chandelier) from the 2015 "reimagined" tour, looking like some sort of mash-up of that tour and the original flagships. Comparing the original flagship proscenium to the 2020 UK Tour version, it's a knock-off of Maria Bjornson's original design, not incorporating any of her elements, except perhaps some of the pieces along the top.

Sure, shows can be re-designed and change, and I'm not here to nitpick the size of candles or props. I do take issue with Cameron Mackintosh marketing his new tours as "The Brilliant Original" when the staging is "A Modified Re-Design Of The Brilliant Original."

Re: The original topic of this thread, equipment and technology have come a LONG way in the 30 years since the original London and Broadway flagship productions were opened.  Are there not ways to replicate and replace worn out sets without re-designing them?  I understand the lighting equipment hasn't been changed or updated and is expensive to maintain. Is there not modern lighting equipment which could replicate (or extremely closely replicate) the original lighting equipment?  If the angel is "unsafe," isn't there a way to alter the rigging equipment or add a safety harness inside it to make it safer to use? 

I highly doubt Phans would take issue with those types of behind-the-scenes updates. However, when you start to change visual scenic elements and parts of the staging, you detract from the essence of the original production. It's no longer "The Brilliant Original."  Therein lies the upset and pushback from fans of the show (myself included).

Surely Mackintosh (a billionaire with the best contacts in the industry) should be able to devise ways to "refresh" or "update" the behind-the-scenes operating mechanics of these two original sit-down productions, while still retaining the original designs and staging, instead of bringing in completely new design elements (a new style of chandelier, new scrim design, eliminating the angel, etc). 

Understandably, it would be difficult (impossible?) to update the mechanics of such a large and intricate show, piece-by-piece, while performances are happening.  I'm sure the cast and crew would need rehearsal with the new technology/equipment they'd be working on, around and with.  But now is his chance.  It's just a question of "does he want to do it the hard way, or the easy way?"

Updated On: 6/23/20 at 01:09 AM

“The set of this, the original production, is now over 34 years old and unsurprisingly many of the scenic elements are coming to the end of their natural life which was never envisaged to be as long as this when first built. LW Theatres, operator of Her Majesty’s Theatre, also need to attend to a number of remedial works on this historic building that for the last four decades has only been able to undertake decorative work.”

https://www.thestage.co.uk/news/the-phantom-of-the-opera-to-remain-closed-for-extended-period-while-maintenance-work-to-set-is-carried-out

Updated On: 6/23/20 at 04:55 AM