SUNSET BLVD. Reviews - Page 6

[EDSOSLO858]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 12:29pm

Who's seeing Mandy make her Norma debut tonight?

[EDSOSLO858]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 12:31pm

(double post)

[CreatureKitchen]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 12:37pm

QueenAlice said: "Please open your minds to be challenged by theatre at intentionally encourages you too think less and feel more."

I agree with the rest of your comment but not this. This production absolutely prioritizes thinking over feeling. It’s Brechtian and alienating, and I found myself frequently stepping back to think about the meaning of certain choices. This production is about Concept, not characters or emotions, and I think it’s understandable why that doesn’t work for some.

 

[BETTY22]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 1:45pm

I would love to know what the box office did yesterday after all that opening night press.

NYT review, will not help, but they have lots and lots of quotes......

[binau]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 1:58pm

If you just read the headlines they are pretty much a rave for Nicole - even if no one reads the article it makes it seem like the show has buzz and raves. I can see the advance has just been getting stronger and stronger. I think they're pretty much set for the rest of the year now. 

[Auggie27]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 1:59pm

I wrote a post similar to the Queen Alice defense of Lloyd’s world building in this thread and the comment above leads me to ask a bigger question: are demographics unfamiliar with either the musical or its source more likely to accept the Lloyd conceit(s)? If this tale unfolds with the contemporaneity that if does here, isn’t this iteration’s storytelling accessible on its own terms? Is Swanson and Close aren’t in the audience consciousness, do they suspend disbelief readily?

Updated On: 10/22/24 at 01:59 PM

[soxboy22]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 1:59pm

djoko84 said: "This is areviews thread, why are the fangirls posting publicity articles about Nicole's red carpet fashion and the opening night parties? The tweens on here are a joke."

Kinda rude.

 

[CreatureKitchen]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 2:50pm

This production modernizes the story in a way that I think feels much more relevant and exciting to the TikTok generation. And people are always going to be weirdly defensive of "their" Norma and tear down anyone who isn't Betty/Glenn/whoever their favorite is, so unfamiliar viewers will be more accepting without that bias.

That being said, I've also seen some confusion online from people who go in blind. Multiple people have been confused at what happens during the ending with the blood, I saw someone ask why Norma has a dead pig (I guess they misheard chimp and there's no dead chimp prop...). A couple people on another forum said they burst out laughing when Betty said she loved Joe because it came out of nowhere, and I've also definitely seen some confusion over how young Nicole looks, like "I thought Norma was in her 30s, why is her career over"? This production, like Daniel Fish's Oklahoma, seems to be commenting on the original, and expects some audience familiarity with the source material. Audiences with ingrained bias might be less accepting of the new conceit, but they'll also have the context to fill in any gaps and appreciate the different choices Lloyd is making.
 

 

[chernjam]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 2:51pm

Does the NY Times still do a second review on weekends by a different critic?  I'm out of the loop about how things have changed/are handled now, but that used to be the norm

[JSquared2]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 2:54pm

BETTY22 said: "I would love to know what the box office did yesterday after all that opening night press.

NYT review, will not help, but they have lots and lots of quotes......"

 

I'm hearing they wrapped close to $1M yesterday.

 

[chernjam]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 4:15pm

CreatureKitchen said: "This production modernizes the story in a way that I think feels much more relevant and exciting to the TikTok generation. And people are always going to be weirdly defensive of "their" Norma and tear down anyone who isn't Betty/Glenn/whoever their favorite is, so unfamiliar viewers will be more accepting without that bias.

That being said, I've also seen some confusion online from people who go in blind. Multiple people have been confused at what happens during the ending with the blood, I saw someone ask why Norma has a dead pig (I guess they misheard chimp and there's no dead chimp prop...). A couple people on another forum said they burst out laughing when Betty said she loved Joe because it came out of nowhere, and I've also definitely seen some confusion over how young Nicole looks, like "I thought Norma was in her 30s, why is her career over"? This production, like Daniel Fish's Oklahoma, seems to be commenting on the original, and expects some audience familiarity with the source material. Audiences with ingrained bias might be less accepting of the new conceit, but they'll also have the context to fill in any gaps and appreciate the different choices Lloyd is making.


"

Some of the jokes I'm sure will go over peoples heads who don't know the movie or history of the musical (the turban, the ape, in my case, the Pussycat dolls pic) but having read about people confused about the ending before I saw it, and then seeing it, that's odd to me. 
Spoiler

 

Click Here To Toggle Spoiler Content

He clearly (and dramatically) gets shot and killed - done amazingly with the lighting and everything- far more impactful than any production previously... and the blood, I thought it was clear Norma was channeling Salome and took the dead Joe as her John the Baptist - again that was more dramatic and made the connection far better than any other production I've seen of Sunset before.

 

[TotallyEffed]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 4:31pm

It sometimes seems like we've entered a new wave of revivals that really require a knowledge of the show and previous productions before going in. I know a lot of people had an issue with John Doyle's Sweeney back in the day, but I can't imagine seeing the recent revivals of Cabaret, Sunset, and Cats blind. I may be entertained and have a great time but I would be confused as heck. Actually, I found this production of Sunset confusing as heck and I know it better than just about anyone could.

[JSquared2]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 4:49pm

TotallyEffed said: "It sometimesseems like we've entered a new wave of revivals that really requirea knowledge of the show and previous productions before going in. I know a lot of people had an issue with John Doyle's Sweeney back in the day, but I can't imagine seeing the recent revivals of Cabaret, Sunset, and Cats blind. I may be entertained and have a great time but I would be confused as heck. Actually, I found this production of Sunset confusing as heck and I know it better than just about anyone could."

 

Apparently not?

 

[TotallyEffed]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 4:52pm

Norma Desmond twerking was not on my bingo card that night, no.

[Seb28]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 5:11pm

After reading all the reactions here it becomes more and more clear that this is all about Scherzinger. Her performance (definitely not characterization) and the hype around her person.

Not about the character of Norma, not about the story, not about the acting, not about the concept, not about the lyrics. In fact, there doesn't seem to be any interest in any of these things.

Both the people who know the show and the ones who are new seem to be confused. Both positive and negative reactions seem to be confused.

It is indeed thinking over feeling and also "yass queen" over any kind of storytelling or sincerity.

I think Lloyd has no clue about any of the lyrics in the show, resulting in laughs at serious moments (like the Betty scenes*) and an incoherent product and I would not call that an achievement. He is just lucky that Scherzinger is popular as a person.

(* and the shtick during the title song, and the breaking of the 4th wall, and the trashing of the lyrics and story, and the Tik-Tok jokes, and the cardboard cut-outs, and the Mc Hammer references, and the over-acting to the point where the first act seems like a parody, and creating a disconnect and deliberately pulling the audience out of the story all the time.

People seem to love Scherzinger, not the concept.) 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Updated On: 10/22/24 at 05:11 PM

[Seb28]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 5:24pm

CreatureKitchen said: "This production is about Concept, not characters or emotions, and I think it’s understandable why that doesn’t work for some."

I agree.

I see 2 kinds of reactions on this show, one group that wants at least a coherent and sincere concept because there is no real characters or emotions (so not liking the concept), and one group that does neither care about concept nor characters and emotions (so not caring about the concept. But accepting it).

 

[Matt Rogers]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 5:45pm

Seb28 said: "After reading all the reactions here it becomes more and more clear that this all about Scherzinger. Her performance (definitely not characterization) and the hype around her person.

Not about the character of Norma, not about the story, not about the acting, not about the concept, not about the lyrics. In fact, there doesn't seem to be any interest in any of these things.

Both the people who know the show and the ones who are new seem to be confused. Both positive and negative reactions seem to be confused.

It is indeed thinking over feeling and also "yass queen" over any kind of storytelling or sincerity.

I think Lloydhas no clue about any of the lyrics in the show, resulting in laughs at serious moments (like the Betty scenes*) and an incoherent product and I would not call that an achievement. He is just lucky that Scherzinger is popular as a person.

(* and the shtick during the title song, and the breaking of the 4th wall, and the trashing of the lyrics and story, and the Tik-Tok jokes, and the cardboard cut-outs, and the Mc Hammer references, and the over-acting to the point where the first act seems like a parody, and creating a disconnectand deliberately pulling the audience out of the story all the time.

People seem to love Scherzinger, not the concept.)

All sorts of very broad generalizations and assumptions in this post. I know the show and was not confused in the slightest. I’m a person and I loved the concept. So many great theatrical moments. It’s easily the most entertaining show I have seen in many years. I’m going back tonight to see Mandy. Couldn’t resist. 











"

 

[CreatureKitchen]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 5:48pm

I find it interesting, especially in the preview thread, how many people were essentially defending this production by disparaging the original. Like, “you’re not supposed to care about any of the characters” “it’s good that all the gimmicks distract from the lyrics because the lyrics are bad” “it’s good they cut songs and replaced them with rushed dialogue scenes because those songs suck” “Sunset isn’t about  ageism/misogyny/insert deeper theme, it’s just silly camp”.

Don’t get me wrong, the show is full of flaws and I totally understand why some dislike it. But, at a certain point, if the best you can do as a director is to distract from the material you’re directing, why are you directing it? If you’ve so diverged from the original that audience members are laughing at the big love scene because there was no hint those characters were falling in love, are you serving the material or is the material a flimsy excuse to stage your concept?

 

 

[Matt Rogers]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 5:59pm

CreatureKitchen said: "I find it interesting, especially in the preview thread, how many people were essentially defending this production by disparaging the original. Like, “you’re not supposedto care about any of the characters” “it’s good that all the gimmicks distract from the lyrics because the lyrics are bad” “it’s good they cut songs and replaced them with rushed dialogue scenes because those songs suck” “Sunset isn’taboutageism/misogyny/insert deeper theme, it’s just silly camp”.

Don’t get me wrong, the show is full of flaws and I totally understand why some dislike it. But, at a certain point, if the best you can do as a director is to distract from the material you’re directing, why are you directing it? If you’ve so diverged from the original that audience members are laughing at the big love scene because there was no hint those characters were falling in love, are you serving the material or is the material a flimsy excuse to stage your concept?

"

It’s not distracting from the material. It’s a new take on the material. Just like every Shakespeare production stages everything in different ways, different eras, etc. (not comparing this material to Shakespeare, fyi) 

By the way, Norma and Joe were never “falling in love”. She with him, yes, but he with her? No way. Not in any version, including the film. 

[Seb28]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 5:59pm

Matt Rogers said: "I’m a person and I loved the concept "

That's great and I do acknowledge that there's a group that does either not care about concept of trashing the material nor the characters and emotions, or in your case even loves it. And that's ok.

 

Updated On: 10/22/24 at 05:59 PM

[Bwaygurl2]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 6:07pm

CreatureKitchen said: "I find it interesting, especially in the preview thread, how many people were essentially defending this production by disparaging the original. Like, “you’re not supposedto care about any of the characters” “it’s good that all the gimmicks distract from the lyrics because the lyrics are bad” “it’s good they cut songs and replaced them with rushed dialogue scenes because those songs suck” “Sunset isn’taboutageism/misogyny/insert deeper theme, it’s just silly camp”.

Don’t get me wrong, the show is full of flaws and I totally understand why some dislike it. But, at a certain point, if the best you can do as a director is to distract from the material you’re directing, why are you directing it? If you’ve so diverged from the original that audience members are laughing at the big love scene because there was no hint those characters were falling in love, are you serving the material or is the material a flimsy excuse to stage your concept?



"

These are all excellent questions. 

[Seb28]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 6:08pm

Matt Rogers said: "It’s not distracting from the material. It’s a new take on the material.

By the way, Norma and Joe were never “falling in love” ."

It is about the love scene between Joe and Betty. A very serious moment where she tells him she loves him. What is happening here is just bad directing. A director who does not understand anything about the moment, the building up and the script. I am getting tired of this "new artistic take" nonsense. That is not what this is.

 

 

[Matt Rogers]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 6:10pm

Seb28 said: "Matt Rogers said: "I’m a person and I loved the concept"

That's great and I do acknowledge that there's a group that does either not care about concept of trashing the material nor the characters andemotions, or in your case even loving it. And that's ok.

"

Because many do not believe this is “trashing the material “. You are aware that the authors approved this concept, correct? It could not have proceeded in London or NY without full author approval. So if they are okay with it, so am I. Also, they have a full orchestra playing every note of this score as richly and gorgeously as I have ever heard it played. That, in my opinion, is worth the price of admission alone. 

[SonofRobbieJ]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 6:13pm

CreatureKitchen said: "I find it interesting, especially in the preview thread, how many people were essentially defending this production by disparaging the original. Like, “you’re not supposedto care about any of the characters” “it’s good that all the gimmicks distract from the lyrics because the lyrics are bad” “it’s good they cut songs and replaced them with rushed dialogue scenes because those songs suck” “Sunset isn’taboutageism/misogyny/insert deeper theme, it’s just silly camp”.

Don’t get me wrong, the show is full of flaws and I totally understand why some dislike it. But, at a certain point, if the best you can do as a director is to distract from the material you’re directing, why are you directing it? If you’ve so diverged from the original that audience members are laughing at the big love scene because there was no hint those characters were falling in love, are you serving the material or is the material a flimsy excuse to stage your concept?"

I feel summoned.

I said all of those things (except the thing about silly camp...I would never call Sunset Boulevard silly camp). But my reason for saying all those things is that I feel there is an inherent flaw in the musicalization of Sunset Boulevard which flattened a really gnarly property into a show with a traditional R&H love plot and a leading character that is begging for empathy and understanding. That is not what Wilder did when he co-wrote and directed Sunset Boulevard and so I feel like the choices made weakened an excellent property.

By literally employing all of the main Brechtian devices to distance use from the groundswell of feeling inserted into the musical, Lloyd wrenches the property back closer to the spirit of the original film. That's why I loved it. I think the film is an utter masterpiece and the musical is not. I was wonderfully surprised by how invested I was in the story under Lloyd's direction. And Scherzinger left me gobsmacked. I thought her casting was a joke, but they turned the joke back around on us and she has taken both the West End and Broadway by storm with her...yes...characterization. 

That said, I can't imagine seeing this show without some context either through knowledge of the musical or the movie (or both). It's a production that's in conversation with the versions that came before. 

[CreatureKitchen]

Posted: 10/22/24 at 6:15pm

Matt Rogers said: "By the way, Norma and Joe were never “falling in love”. She with him, yes, but he with her? No way. Not inany version, including the film."

I wasn’t talking about Joe and Norma. I was talking about Joe and Betty (referencing my earlier comment about people being confused and laughing when she confesses her love, because there’s no indication she’s falling in love).

My point about whether the concept distracts from the material or elevates it is a matter of opinion. I think, for instance, a cardboard cutout of ALW and a person in a monkey suit distract from the lyrics being sung, rather than elevating them.