2021: Cynthia Erivo calls out COLOR PURPLE producers for replacement casting communication- Page 2

[JSquared2]

Posted: 8/17/21 at 2:10pm

ErmengardeStopSniveling said: "Erivo most definitely has casting approval now(or at least consultation) if she's attached in a leading role, being that she's a 2x Oscar nominee. But no producer is going to grant casting approval to a "nobody" making their Broadway debut (and at the time of her hiring was the least famous of the 3 leads –– yet still got first-position billing for playing the indisputable lead role).

Incorrect -- not even the megastars (Jackman, Lupone, Peters, etc.) have casting approval (or even consultation) in their contracts.  As a courtesy, some producers may like to discuss casting of certain other roles -- but that's about it.

 

[JBroadway]

Posted: 8/17/21 at 2:15pm

ACL2006 said: "None of her movies have done well. She's an amazing talent on the stage, but it's fascinating that her movie career isn't going so well."

 

Erivo's personality aside (I won't take a stance on that at the moment because I have mixed feelings and I think it's complicated) - I don't think it's all that accurate to say that he film career isn't going anywhere. 

Getting nominated for an Oscar for a bad movie isn't uncommon, but it's still something of a feat. 

She hasn't had the meteoric rise of, say, Florence Pugh or Timothee Chalamet, but for someone as new to the spotlight as she is, her career is actually going quite well. Maybe her projects haven't been the biggest critical or commercial hits, but compared to 99% of the actors working in the film industry? She's doing just fine. Again - especially when you consider that she's really only been working in film for 3 years. It takes some film actors decades to achieve what she's already achieved, and presuming she doesn't burn too many bridges, she has a long, fruitful career ahead of her. 

[Pashacar]

Posted: 8/17/21 at 4:34pm

I apparently missed this entirely...what was her involvement with the Great Comet fiasco?

[blaxx]

Posted: 8/17/21 at 4:50pm

JBroadway said: "ACL2006 said: "None of her movies have done well. She's an amazing talent on the stage, but it's fascinating that her movie career isn't going so well."



Erivo's personality aside (I won't take a stance on that at the moment because I have mixed feelings and I think it's complicated) - I don't think it's all that accurate to say that he film career isn't going anywhere.

Getting nominated for an Oscar for a bad movie isn't uncommon, but it's still something of a feat.

She hasn't had the meteoric rise of, say, Florence Pugh or Timothee Chalamet, but for someone as new to the spotlight as she is, her career is actually going quite well. Maybe her projects haven't been the biggest critical or commercial hits, but compared to 99% of the actors working in the film industry? She's doing just fine. Again - especially when you consider that she's really only been working in film for 3 years. It takes some film actors decades to achieve what she's already achieved, and presuming she doesn't burn too many bridges, she has a long, fruitful career ahead of her."

There's no denying she's doing well. But she's very far to having the mega star status that would justify these kind of diva fits.

She sadly believes that she has earned unacceptable behaviours and unrealistic accommodations.

[Patty3]

Posted: 8/17/21 at 5:42pm

Says the woman who got Great Comet closed and put hundreds of people out of work. 

[amoni]

Posted: 8/17/21 at 5:48pm

'It still boggles my mind why she would agree to making her Aretha series when Jennifer Hudson had already been cast by Aretha herself, and the biopic was already underway."

She did it because she's a working actress and needs to pay the rent, and oh she probably wanted the part.You're not one of those people that think every actor is a millionaire who can just turn down work left and right, are you?

[Patty3]

Posted: 8/17/21 at 5:53pm

GiantsInTheSky2 said: "She continues to show how obnoxious and self righteous she is. As if someone making their Broadway debut needs to be consulted about casting decisions! It’s a shame that all her talent is contrasted with an overall crappy person.

It still boggles my mind why she would agree to making her Aretha series when Jennifer Hudson had already been cast by Aretha herself, and the biopic was already underway."

And make a version where they literally could not use any of Aretha's hits because the Hudson film had the rights. That mini-series was a wast of time. I don't know much about Aretha as an activist but Erivo played her as an angry and bitter woman. The ultimate typecasting.

[GiantsInTheSky2]

Posted: 8/17/21 at 5:57pm

amoni said: "'It still boggles my mind why she would agree to making her Aretha series when Jennifer Hudson had already been cast by Aretha herself, and the biopic was already underway."

She did it because she's a working actress and needs to pay the rent, and oh she probably wanted the part.You're not one of those people that think every actor is a millionaire who can just turn down work left and right, are you?”

Please cite your sources for where you got any of that from. I never spoke to any sort of (completely unfounded and fabricated) financial struggles on her part. My point was that it was tacky on her part - and not to mention disrespectful, since her family was very vocal about that project. 

[Patty3]

Posted: 8/17/21 at 6:09pm

Pashacar said: "I apparently missed this entirely...what was her involvement with theGreat Comet fiasco?"

Here is an article from Billboard to explain it. I don't know who the prominent stage actors are but the article only quotes Erivo's tweets.

https://www.billboard.com/articles/news/7882075/casting-controversy-broadway-mandy-patinkin-josh-groban-great-comet-okieriete-onaodowan

[JBroadway]

Posted: 8/17/21 at 6:10pm

Pashacar said: "I apparently missed this entirely...what was her involvement with theGreat Comet fiasco?"

 

Erivo spear-headed a social media crusade against Great Comet because of Oak Onaodowan's dismissal. She claimed that it was racist, because they were replacing a Black actor with a White actor.

The result was that Mandy Patinkin, who was set to replace Oak, dropped out of the production because of the bad press. The production was on tenuous financial ground following their Tony losses, and they had been relying on celebrity casting for tickets (somewhat successfully in fact). So without a star lined up, and with a poor advance, they had no choice but to close. 

It turned out, however, that there were actual conflicts between Oak and the creatives about his rehearsal etiquette and his preparedness. Plus, they had already temporarily replaced Britain Ashford (a white actor) so that they could bring in Ingrid Michaelson for a short run to sell more tickets. Between those two factors, it became clear that this was a very rare instance where someone "played the race card" even though it wasn't actually applicable to the situation. Which is why many people are resentful toward Cynthia Erivo. 

[PipingHotPiccolo]

Posted: 8/17/21 at 6:19pm

thats an excellent summary by JBroadway. I'd add that even before it became clear that Oak was unprepared and clashing with the production, I thought the position Erivo and others took was kinda silly. Mandy Patinkin is a name, a Broadway icon of sorts, who is particularly popular these days from Homeland among other things. He was an audience draw that Oak was not; we have seen this happen to so many talented people on Broadway, pushed out or sidelined for a bigger 'name' that to inject race here seemed preposterous from the start.  (We can ignore the fact that the two female leads were both women of color, the Company was pretty diverse--especially for a show set in, checks notes, 1800s RUSSIA). 

 

The producers were trying to keep the show open, something Oak couldn't help them do (even assuming he was doing a bang-up job from the start--and from what I've "heard" he sounded pretty good as he got into the role a bit). Was just a shame all around. 

[Owen22]

Posted: 8/17/21 at 10:06pm

I wouldn't exactly say there is a racist stench to most of these comments but at the very least try to understand being a black woman on Broadway who had almost singlehandedly (props to John Doyle as well) made an inferior piece of writing a hit in revival.  The show was produced solely for her. The show was an off West End hit, but never transferred, but this producer, whom she chased down the hall HAD needed her to not only get the show up, but to win the awards.  She may not have had any power, again, being a black actress on Broadway, no matter how big, she was misguided in thinking she did, but you can understand why she thought she might. How she FINALLY might.  And how it must have hurt to once again find out she didn't.  After going through two costars, maybe she thought she had earned a consultation.  That much at least.  At least wonder how many times in her young life this woman's pride had already been stomped on, no matter how amazingly talented she was.

[NYCblurb]

Posted: 8/17/21 at 10:08pm

HARRIET could have been titled CELIE'S GOT A GUN. Same character, different movie. I have seen all her films/tv. She was brilliant in The Color Purple on Broadway, though her range is limited and she is mean. Talented folks can get away with a lot. Mean only goes so far. Talent? She has got that. Incredible in so many ways. STAR QUALITY? She ain't got it.

Updated On: 8/17/21 at 10:08 PM

[Nocredits]

Posted: 8/17/21 at 10:23pm

Owen22 said: "I wouldn't exactly say there is a racist stench to most of these comments but at the very least try to understand being a black woman on Broadway who had almost singlehandedly (props to John Doyle as well) made an inferior piece of writing a hit in revival. The show was produced solely for her. The show was an off West End hit, but never transferred, but this producer, whom she chased down the hall HAD needed her to not only get the show up, but to win the awards. She may not have had any power, again, being a black actress on Broadway, no matter how big, she was misguided in thinking she did, but you can understand why she thought she might. How she FINALLY might. And how it must have hurt to once again find out she didn't. After going through two costars, maybe she thought she had earned a consultation. That much at least. At least wonder how many times in her young life this woman's pride had already been stomped on, no matter how amazingly talented she was."

I agree...there is a stench of some underlying racism to some these comments here. Not to say that folks should not disagree with her stance or comments...but some of yall commenting are lacking any kind of empathy, context and or nuance when it comes to being a black actress in this industry. For example of the sublet racism going on on this chat ; her comments or your disagreement with them have nothing to do with if you think Harriet was a good movie but yet folks feel the need to take a shot at that. Also its problematic to put the blame of a closure of a show because a black women spoke out about how she felt at the moment  and not examining why she would say the things when she said them at that point in time, whether you agree with her or not. 'Comet would have stayed open if that black women would have kept her mouth shut'...that is the context in what some of these comments are.

[JBroadway]

Posted: 8/17/21 at 10:32pm

I would agree with Owen22 and Nocredits' comments, at least in part. It's partly why I pleaded the 5th a bit in my earlier post. I have a hard time processing Erivo's approach to activism, because on one hand, a lot of the individual points she makes do seem sort of illogical and entitled to me. But like you guys said, I can never understand what it's like to be a Black woman, let alone a Black woman in Hollywood. It's true that there are many other marginalized people in Hollywood who come across as more level-headed and reasonable than Erivo. But there are many different ways to react to, and confront systemic adversity, and I'm not sure it's my place as a white man to judge that. It doesn't mean she's above criticism, or shouldn't face pushback on certain specific arguments (I do think the was in the wrong on the Comet issue, and I think she did play a significant, tangible role in what happened). But I do try to empathize that she's always trying to do the right thing and call out systemic issues. She's doing more good for the industry than bad, certainly. 

If I had to guess the underlying edict behind her various call-outs: I think she recognizes that people should be valued for their talent, and not their star value. And I think she feels that if someone TRULY values her talent, she should be treated with the same value that star power gets others - especially as a Black person, who are often undervalued. This is why she took issue with Oak being replaced by a white celebrity, it's why she wanted to have a voice in Headley's replacement, it's why she took issue on Twitter to being dreamcast as one of the Muses in Hercules, etc. 

Updated On: 8/17/21 at 10:32 PM

[PipingHotPiccolo]

Posted: 8/17/21 at 11:37pm

pray tell what her race has to do with her latest gripe that Jennifer Holliday's hiring wasn't pre-cleared with her- another black actress, by the way, whose career she wanted control over (after helping to shut down a show she was not even in, over faux claims of racism/bigotry that i think almost everyone would reasonably agree were utter nonsense, costing many other actors of color their jobs). 

if there are accusations she has made of her own mistreatment due to her race/gender, i'm all ears and wouldn't necessarily be surprised or unsympathetic given the world we live in. but the Comet debacle and her latest whining about the producers at Color Purple ain't it.

fwiw, i say all this as a huge fan of not just her voice but also her acting: i liked Harriet fine, but she was incredible in it. I also think she did really solid work on The Outsider, a meh show on HBO last year. I think her career will continue to do fine, and I hope to see more of her. That doesn't excuse her asinine comments. 

[SouthernCakes]

Posted: 8/17/21 at 11:37pm

I’m not sure we are understanding each other. She’s incredibly talented. No one is disputing that. It’s just that her actions haven’t been great. She’s acting at an Andra McDonald level. Wanting a say in casting, etc. You’re not there. You’re still climbing. And everyone lined up at an audition on 8th Ave would love to be where you are. So chill. And ride the wave.

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 8/18/21 at 12:19am

Many of the comments do stink of racism here, which make me sorry I started the thread in the first place. Even if I don't really sympathize with the specific argument Erivo was making to Vanity Fair, as a Black woman in the entertainment industry, she deals with levels of trauma that many people posting here will never, ever face.


Two clear up two things here:

COMET was already on the road to closing. Remember, Mandy Patinkin was only going to do it for 3 weeks. After he left, the show would have stumbled again, and closed shortly thereafter; it's not the type of material that can be "stunt cast" easily. Without the controversy, it probably would have only run 2-3 more weeks.

People seem to be inflating the success of that revival of CP: it came short of recouping on Broadway; John Doyle edited and directed it very well at the Menier (starring Erivo) with the support of the original Bway producers; and then those producers moved it to Broadway. Erivo gave a lot of talent to the production, but the production also gave Erivo her career. It's symbiotic. We don't know all of what went on behind the scenes and in the offices, but it is not uncommon for a rising star to get "burnt out" from doing the show after the Tonys when offers start coming, and there were months of performances after the Tonys where the show really wasn't pulling in great numbers. (We also don't know verbatim what the exchange between Erivo and Sanders was, or if there's other nuance that wasn't conveyed.)

Updated On: 8/18/21 at 12:19 AM

[Nocredits]

Posted: 8/18/21 at 6:30am

if there are accusations she has made of her own mistreatment due to her race/gender, i'mall ears and wouldn't necessarily be surprised or unsympathetic given the world we live in. but the Comet debacle and her latest whining about the producers at Color Purple ain't it.

See...and this is where the misunderstanding and lack of nuance comes into play with comments like these. You are saying that you POC should only speak up or you would only care if there is something personally happening to them when it comes to their race. That's not how it works. We are allowed to speak up on any injustices we see happening to our brothers and sisters, that's how progress works. Now if you disagree with her stance thats all in well...but POC don't owe you a personal explanation about their own trauma/mistreatment/accusations etc.  to garner your sympathy. And once again...She. Did. Not. Close. Comet. 

 

[WestEndGal]

Posted: 8/18/21 at 6:59am

Cynthia has definitely rubbed me up the wrong way on some things she has said in the past, especially her involvement in the Great Comet debacle, but I have zero problem with what she was saying here about the CP producer.  what stood out to me was what a spineless douche the producer was being. Maybe Cynthia had no say on casting, but some common courtesy in him letting her know in advance would have been nice. The dude literally ran away from her when she wanted to have a conversation, and then laid into her when he did ordain himself to speak to her. Is it too much to ask for directors/producers to treat their cast with a little bit of respect?! 

[Bettyboy72]

Posted: 8/18/21 at 9:29am

I agree with what other have said about the comments here being racist in nature. White celebrities make commentary all the time on situations that have nothing to do with them and there are no repercussions. Erivo was lauded and promoted as being a reason to see TCP long before her Tony win. She was the reason the production was transferred as her performance was incandescent. Her starry leading ladies (Hudson and Brooks) were added later.  She was the reason myself and many others bought a ticket. While I think Hudson is a glorious singer, I think she is a mediocre at best actress. I was there to see Erivo, as were most because when she was out, the refund lines were huge. She was a draw. 

Erivo had a right to believe that she could expect some level  of respect on TCP. At least she was at tipping point in the process. She had to make a decision about how she would let people treat her when she finally had some leverage. I support her decision to not be a doormat. It is not being difficult or a bitch to demand someone stop walking, acknowledge you and look you in eye to address you. 

She didn't close Comet. That show was a bloated, big budget disaster IMHO. I saw it once and that was enough. If you need a celebrity to break even every week, you've got a problem. If the music and spectacle can't get them in the door, you've got a problem. They took a huge gamble doing that to the space and they lost. They had a good thing going when it was smaller scale and like any investment, they took a risk and it didn't pan out. She may have misspoke, but asserting that she closed Comet and attributing that to her is also scapegoating a woman of color. Check out Debra Messings twitter sometime and see how much misinformation she spouts off about and never pays dearly for. She sees one meme or a headline and runs with, tagging people, swearing calling people out. She doesn't lose any sleep and she doesn't lose any work. White privilege exhibit A. 

[KFC1991]

Posted: 8/18/21 at 10:08am

I don't see any racism on this thread (although I do wonder if that plays a part in the criticism she receives). I think white liberals are often wary of disagreeing with black people.
I don't see what she said to The Color Purple producer as a big deal but so many people already dislike her that they are seeing it in most negative light possible.
She didn't "close" Comet but it would certainly have run longer without her stirring the pot and playing the race card.
Her career is doing great and she hasn't suffered repercussions because folks don't like her. My roommate worked with her on Aretha and said she wasn't pleasant. I think she's talented and I'm happy she's getting opportunities.

[WestEndGal]

Posted: 8/18/21 at 10:12am

Yeah, I had to unfollow Debra Messing on social media because she’s become so insufferable! 

[Plannietink08]

Posted: 8/18/21 at 10:23am

I do wholeheartedly believe that the producers of THE COLOR PURPLE turned Cynthia into the person she seems to be now. I bet they made her believe she was untouchable and powerful and would become the world’s biggest star… so of course she would develop this attitude where she believes she has power over the production.
I know people who worked with her on SISTER ACT and the X-Factor musical and no one has had a bad word to say about her but as soon as she went across to the US to reprise her role on THE COLOR PURPLE it all went downhill.
There’s no denying that she is incredibly talented and can, and likely will, do amazing things but what’s different between her and other stars who have had meteoric rises in relatively short times is that they come across as humble and likeable. With Erivo I’ve personally seen by former work colleagues turn on her on social media which speaks volumes.

[PipingHotPiccolo]

Posted: 8/18/21 at 10:25am

Nocredits said: "if there are accusations she has made of her own mistreatment due to her race/gender, i'mall ears and wouldn't necessarily be surprised or unsympathetic given the world we live in. but the Comet debacle and her latest whining about the producers at Color Purple ain't it.

See...and this is where the misunderstanding and lack of nuance comes into play with comments like these. You are saying that you POC should only speak up or you would only care if there is something personally happening to them when it comes to theirrace. That's not how it works. We are allowed to speak up on any injustices we see happening to our brothers and sisters, that's how progress works. Now if you disagree with her stance thats all in well...but POC don't owe you a personal explanation about their own trauma/mistreatment/accusations etc.to garner your sympathy. And once again...She. Did. Not. Close. Comet."

what a disingenuous characterization of what i said, which did not include one word about her not being "allowed" to speak up (about anything, let alone about) mistreatment of others in the industry. Nor did I even remotely suggest she owes me anything, let alone a personal explanation about her own trauma?

The two instances being discussed are the Comet debacle and Jennifer Holliday's casting in The Color Purple. What trauma is at play? She doesn't mention any, not her own or anyone else's. I never once even implied that I only care to hear from her if she describes her own trauma, or suggested she shouldn't speak up about injustice, anywhere. 

She hasn't.