"A New Deal For Broadway" abolishes all-white creative teams; includes commitments from Shubert, Nederlander, Jujamcyn to each rename theatres after a Black Artist- Page 3

[JasonC3]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 12:16pm

I know the naming has historically been arbitrary @ErmengardeStopSniveling which is why I suggested that some criteria might be in order given the visibility and reaction that these new names will likely incur.

From a public relations standpoint given the heightened attention right now to all things DEI-related, being able to offer some relevant explanation for who gets chosen might be wise. Choices that appear random or less warranted than others could unnecessarily unleash yet another social media/media backlash. Updated On: 8/24/21 at 12:16 PM

[Bettyboy72]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 12:36pm

I'd love to see a theatre named after Diahann Carroll. I think "The Carroll" sounds really lovely as a theatre. The woman was a trailblazer and endured a lot of racism and death threats when she appeared on TV as Julia. 

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 1:02pm

If the theatre owners release a statement about why they're renaming + have a ceremony involving people who worked with the honoree, that would probably be sufficient enough?

[joevitus]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 1:24pm

Kad said: "I think renaming of the theaters is easily the least substantive of the things in the document.

Abolishing all-white creative teams is a massive and important commitment."

How exactly do you deprive people of the right to work with the team they want to work with? I think encouraging people to give more Black designers is a great idea, but how you tell people they can't work with the team they prefer is beyond me--that they are actually barred from doing so? I can't imagine that working out.

[everythingtaboo]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 1:34pm

joevitus said: "How exactly do you deprive people of the right to work with the teamthey want to work with? I think encouraging people to give more Black designers is a great idea, but how you tell people they can't work with the team they prefer is beyond me--that they are actually barred from doing so?I can't imagine that working out."

Some could consider it an overreach, but it's how a lot of diversity initiatives start, by ensuring that the "work with who you want/who you know" doesn't just include the same white and/or male faces that they usually do. It has to start somewhere.

[Fosse76]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 1:36pm

HogansHero said: "@Fosse76 You are wrong about the name of the theatre. The Nederlander's landlord is Vornado. This arrangement is much more complicated than anyone could imagine."

No, I'm not. While the hotel property was initially leased to Marriott by the city, the retail space and theater were leased to Vornado (in 2012). However, Marriott since opted to purchase the property (presumably in 2017, the amended expiration date of the lease with the city). But, it appears the new ownership did not alter the agreement with Vornado (for whatever reason). Though that still doesn't change who the actual owner is (Marriott). 

Either way, Nederlander doesn't own the theatre, and would have no power to rename it. 

[joevitus]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 1:42pm

everythingtaboo said: "joevitus said: "How exactly do you deprive people of the right to work with the teamthey want to work with? I think encouraging people to give more Black designers is a great idea, but how you tell people they can't work with the team they prefer is beyond me--that they are actually barred from doing so?I can't imagine that working out."

Some could consider it an overreach, but it's how a lot of diversity initiatives start, by ensuring that the "work with who you want/who you know" doesn't just include the same white and/or male faces that they usually do. It has to start somewhere."

It's beyond an overreach--it's likely illegal. 

I totally support more diversity, but let's be real: if it isn't voluntary, it isn't going to happen. Considering the money involved, nobody is going to jeopardize the future of a Broadway show to employ someone whose skills/talents they aren't as pleased by/assured of just to satisfy some arbitrary criteria. 

[VintageSnarker]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 2:29pm

joevitus said: "How exactly do you deprive people of the right to work with the teamthey want to work with? I think encouraging people to give more Black designers is a great idea, but how you tell people they can't work with the team they prefer is beyond me--that they are actually barred from doing so?I can't imagine that working out."

Exactly. How cruel to deprive Bartlett Sher of Michael Yeargan and Catherine Zuber. How do you expect the man to function??? /s

[Kad]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 2:40pm

joevitus said: "Kad said: "I think renaming of the theaters is easily the least substantive of the things in the document.

Abolishing all-white creative teams is a massive and important commitment."

How exactly do you deprive people of the right to work with the teamthey want to work with? I think encouraging people to give more Black designers is a great idea, but how you tell people they can't work with the team they prefer is beyond me--that they are actually barred from doing so?I can't imagine that working out."

And how do you deprive talented individuals the ability to work and build reputations and careers because the limited number of repeatedly working Broadway directors keep using the same, largely white and male, designers over and over?

No, this commitment is likely not legally enforceable. But it is in writing and it will force people to think more critically about their hiring. 
 

Prying open these kept gates will not be painless.

[Dolly80]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 2:54pm

This just sounds like that Dear White People crap.

Designed to create division and make the choice of a creative team come down to to tokenism rather than who is best for the job.

I completely agree that we need more black directors- designer etc, but this feels the wrong way to go about it all.

[GiantsInTheSky2]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 2:59pm

The lengths people will go to defend the white male gatekeeping of this industry is truly LOL-worthy. You guys just keep telling on yourselves.

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 3:16pm

It's certainly not illegal, being that most of these positions on Broadway productions are offer-only.

As you no doubt know, a Creative Team is a vast group of people (Playwright, Composer, Lyricist, Director, Choreographer, Music Director/Supervisor, Set/Costumes/Lighting/Sound/Hair Designers, etc) and the document is requesting that at least one of those individuals not be a white person. It's not a huge ask. Being that there are so many pipeline issues related to Broadway, this helps to broaden the net everyone casts when looking for talent. It is good for directors to have new relationships with designers and other personnel.

And as we've seen with shows like TOOTSIE, when your entire production team is white and male, it is very easy to overlook things.

And though this won't be legally enforceable, journalists and "Theatre Twitter" will help keep productions accountable. There will be instances where this isn't met, and if there is diversity in alternative ways (eg. a female and trans writing team), it's going to go down a lot smoother than just a cis white male creative team for a show written by cis white male authors.

Updated On: 8/24/21 at 03:16 PM

[JasonC3]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 4:13pm

I can't speak to the specifics of theater, but in corporate America, it often works like this:

Assuming the players are truly committed to DEI, it is about being affirmative in casting a wide net, expanding their awareness of existing talent, and building a pool of highly qualified diverse individuals from which people are selected.

If people default and go to the usual suspects, nothing changes. You end up with a self-selecting inner circle of the same people selecting the same people.

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 5:14pm

Yes, the pipeline is a big issue for Broadway.

The Shubert Org is a great example of that. They typically elevate candidates from within. The current organization is extremely white and male: Of the current 13-person leadership (President and 12 VPs), there are two women and two people of color. Its 7-person Board has 5 men and two women (one is a person of color).

[joevitus]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 6:04pm

Dolly80 said: "This just sounds like that Dear White People crap.

Designed to create division and make the choice of a creative team come down to to tokenism rather than who is best for the job.

I completely agree that we need more black directors- designer etc, but this feels the wrong way to go about it all."

Agreed.

[Dolly80]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 6:28pm

Sorry I meant that Dear White American Theatre letter.

Who are these people who are going to be dropped into these creative teams to tick a box?

I know that what’s happening in the UK for instance is that there’s been a huge move to make sure more women are in key creative roles and often to tick that
Box, when the best female lighting, set, sound designers etc aren’t available, they are having to employ really inexperienced people who just aren’t in the same league creating resentment and not doing anyone any good. People have to be employed on their ability first and foremost.

[JasonC3]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 7:28pm

What matters gets measured. If people aren't accountable for producing results, the only box that gets "ticked" historically has been white male.

Presumably people producing shows won't want to throw money at unqualified creative teams so they will just have to expend more effort to assemble diverse qualified creatives.

If they do so merely to "tick a box" than that is on them.

[Kad]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 7:42pm

Why are we so earnestly clinging to the myth of meritocracy? You may as well be preaching about Santa Claus.

Is it merit when candidates are drawn from a shallow and exclusionary pool? Is it merit when connections and networks get you in the door?

And how are people supposed to hone their abilities if they DONT GET HIRED?

[HogansHero]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 8:07pm

@Fosse76 no matter what the ownership is (I don't think you are exactly correct but it's irrelevant and I'll assume for these purposes that you are), it doesn't matter. One does not need to "own" property to name it. For example, the Bank of America does not "own" the 42-43/6-7 block (the Dursts do) and the Roundabout did not need the permission of either to rename their theatre after Sondheim. (We can play the same game with lots of theatre [the Lyric, the Gershwin, etc.] but I'm sure you get the point.) Is it theoretically possible that there is a provision on the name of the theatre in the lease (because that's the only way you would be right)? Yes, but beyond unlikely for a number of reasons including the complicated journey of the fee simple ownership of the land and the leases by a cascading group of landlords and tenants. [I doubt you know this for a fact, but if you do let us know.]

Re enforceability, by its terms it is not legally enforceable but this misapprehends what's going on here. The big boys have signed onto this; this is the prevailing sentiment; chart your own course at your peril. 

Re just ticking boxes and all those other systemic racism tropes, there is no need to "employ really inexperienced people who just aren't in the same league" because there are an abundance of exciting creatives who have not made their way to the top rungs of their crafts because the system has kept them down. Don't believe it? You need look no further than the brilliant writers whose exciting as hell work we have already seen this season (Bioh and Nwandu) [and the many other black playwrights in recent years writing uncompromising plays]. We are incredibly enriched by this work and I would love to hear an explanation of how we went the entire preceding era of New York theatre without uncovering any such talent and insight. Yes, "a massive and important commitment."

Updated On: 8/24/21 at 08:07 PM

[bk]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 8:32pm

LightsOut90 said: "Kad said: "I think renaming of the theaters is easily the least substantive of the things in the document.

Abolishing all-white creative teams is a massive and important commitment."



which has zero legal enforceability and is highly unlikely to happen

"

Exactly. If an all-white creative team is the best team, that's it. If an all Black creative team is the best team, that's it. All Asian, great. Whatever. But abolish. No. And I don't care who has signed onto it. No one is going to force you to hire based on this kind of thing. The theaters will find out exactly how enforceable this is the minute a powerhouse show with a powerhouse producer is available with an all-white creative team. Every new play opening on B'way this season, as far as I've read, is written by a person of color. Every one. And I think that color is the same color. So, should other minorities be up in arms about that?

[Kad]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 8:59pm

bk said: "LightsOut90 said: "Kad said: "I think renaming of the theaters is easily the least substantive of the things in the document.

Abolishing all-white creative teams is a massive and important commitment."



which has zero legal enforceability and is highly unlikely to happen

"

Exactly. If an all-white creative team is the best team, that's it. If an all Black creative team is the best team, that's it. All Asian, great. Whatever. But abolish. No. And I don't care who has signed onto it. No one is going to force you to hire based on this kind of thing. The theaters will find out exactly how enforceable this is the minute a powerhouse show with a powerhouse produceris available with an all-white creative team. Every new play opening on B'way this season, as far as I've read, is written by a person of color. Every one. And I think that color is the same color. So, should other minorities be up in arms about that?"

Glad that you pulled your head out of the tar pits to issue this proclamation from the Pleistocene era. 

[Playbill_Trash]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 9:08pm

Whoever previously said that it’s “pointless” to have theatres named after Schoenfeld and Jacobs needs to learn their history.

If it wasn’t for the work that they did, there would be no Broadway today. And that goes past the Shubert organization - the entire industry has them to thank for keeping the industry alive. Thankfully, those in charge have not forgotten their origins. All minorities deserve representation. Stop ignoring the minorities that built the theatre world…

I second the vote for a Chita Rivera theatre, and the notion that this is all unenforceable lip service - which will be proven when it comes down to the money involved.

[PipingHotPiccolo]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 10:42pm

there needs to be a way to force the White (Boys) Club to let more POC in the doors, but i think it will be incredibly awkward/uncomfortable when a team of sorts puts together a show and then has to go around the table and make sure the right people are included. that said, i dont have any suggestion for how else to diversify this industry, so 

the Chita Rivera Theater sounds great, and i hear Robin deJesus saying it, which is even better.

[HogansHero]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 11:08pm

bk said: "The theaters will find out exactly how enforceable this is the minute a powerhouse show with a powerhouse producer is available with an all-white creative team."

I hesitated to respond to the partly quoted post because I did not want to engage anything that is such a blatant exudation of systemic racism but I excised all that so that I could LOL at this. First, the "powerhouse producers" of whom you speak are, so far as I know, on board. Second, if they were inclined not to be, what would they say? "Ooooh, if you try to make us hire a black person, we'll show you. We'll open the show in Biloxi, Mississippi." 

[joevitus]

Posted: 8/24/21 at 11:29pm

JDonaghy4 said: "there needs to be a way to force the White (Boys) Club to let more POC in the doors, but i think it will be incredibly awkward/uncomfortable when a team of sorts puts together a show and then has to go around the table and make sure the right people are included. that said, i dont have any suggestion for how else to diversify this industry, so

the Chita Rivera Theater sounds great, and i hear Robin deJesus saying it, which is even better."

You either don't know that white women have a fair amount of power on Broadway, or you think there is a radical difference between who the powerful white men and the powerful white women are willing to hire (please demonstrate with examples and comparisons). This also assumes no white men on Broadway hire people of color (demonstrate this as well). 

Your vision of the world is a cartoon.