Bootleg/Filming Shows Discussion — Page 2

I've seen clips of obvious audience filmed videos from shows dating back to 1977 ("The King & I" w/Yul Brynnur & Constance Towers) and some from the 1980's which are surprisingly good. A few of these (such as "Rags" & "Legs Diamond" will most likely never be revived again outside concert productions, so I did manage to watch the whole video without squirming. But as an avid theatergoer since childhood, I prefer to be there to see it live and capture every magical moment. I saw Annie & Mickey in the original "Sugar Babies" (on tour), and the audience filmed footage of the show is wretched, but in my mind's eye, I can recall every moment I saw live at the Pantages Theater.

For shows that are difficult to get tickets to, I don't even want to see clips before I actually see it live. Certainly the artists deserve to have their works protected, and I wouldn't want to be next to somebody obviously filming, although I'd be hesitant to make a disturbance. It's a tough call to make, and even artists disagree on what's right/wrong or ethical, etc. For the professionally filmed shows, they are entertaining, but as somebody who loves live performance, I just feel like the emotional element is missing when it's on a TV screen or computer rather than in the audience. Some people become shut-in's and anti-social because of Times Square crowds and audience behavior, and often, I'm upset by how people act, but you can't let one bad experience take away your passions. I'll watch it live, often 2 or 3 times, and if somehow, I get a copy of numbers or in a few cases, the whole show, I'll give it a perusal, but usually, they are nearly impossible to watch because of bad sound or photography, or angles that make the viewing experience claustrophobic.

Like people have said above, there's a BIG difference between people on cellphones during shows and bootleggers. Most people on cellphones are either responding to a text, or taking a photo or a short video of a certain part for posterity. Which I vehemently disagree with, but seeing as they did pay for their tickets and generally don't distribute those things, it's an entirely different subject. I've known "professional" bootleggers before (my job often requires me to interact with them) and with the actual good ones you would have no idea that they're filming. Professional bootleggers don't film with cell phone cameras. They don't post their videos to Youtube, they don't give out videos for free, and most of them also hate people who use phones in the audience because it increases their chances of being caught and also, if it is an amateur bootlegger, that's infringing on their business potential.

None of this contains any sort of value judgement on whether what they're doing is right or wrong, but let's at least get our facts straight and decide what we're debating on before we get into the morals of it.

LizzieCurry said: "Other forms of entertainment can adapt, as Harris tweeted. Wasn't it the MLB that would try to take down twitter users' clips of games until they realized that if THEY put up a tiny clip of an amazing double-play or walk-off home run or something, then clips taken from a screen recorder wouldn't be a problem?

Granted, twitter/baseball aren't quite the same thing, but if you can get in front of an issue, then it's less work than causing industry angst and trying to issue cease-and-desists."



Two big differences: Shows release clips all the time - doesn't seem to change anything about bootlegging. But in sports - it's LITERALLY a once in a lifetime moment. Even when the two teams play the very next day it will not be the same. And it's part of a statistic.

I think it's okay. I would never record video myself, but if it's already out there, what's the harm? I enjoy watching them when I know I won't be able to see the show.

Most people don't live close to NYC, and can't afford to spend thousands of dollars on a trip, but they still deserve to see the work of art.

I think audio recording is completely fine. I have never done it, but I totally would. I spent hundreds of dollars on this and if I want to hear the audio again, why not? It's not distracting anyone.

Updated On: 10/3/19 at 01:09 PM

ellbellthomps said: "I think it's okay. I would never record video myself, but if it's already out there, what's the harm? I enjoy watching them when I know I won't be able to see the show.

Most people don't live close to NYC, and can't afford to spend thousands of dollars on a trip, but they still deserve to see the work of art.

I think audio recording is completely fine. I have never done it, but I totally would. I spent hundreds of dollars on this and if I want to hear the audio again, why not? It's not distracting anyone."

The most overused word on this board "deserve". Those people you mentioned don't "deserve" anything other than enjoying something they've bought a ticket to see which does not include the right to record it in any form. Yet another case of entitlement run wild.

Updated On: 10/3/19 at 01:17 PM

oops

Updated On: 10/3/19 at 01:26 PM

ellbellthomps said: "LizzieCurry said: "What do you mean by "if it's already out there"?"

If someone else recorded it, (which i don't encourage), and its free, what's the harm?

"

ellbellthomps said: "I think it's okay. I would never record video myself, but if it's already out there, what's the harm? I enjoy watching them when I know I won't be able to see the show.

Most people don't live close to NYC, and can't afford to spend thousands of dollars on a trip, but they still deserve to see the work of art.

I think audio recording is completely fine. I have never done it, but I totally would. I spent hundreds of dollars on this and if I want to hear the audio again, why not? It's not distracting anyone."





Because it's stealing. Because artists deserve to be paid for 'entertaining' you.



YOU don't deserve anything you don't pay for. You want to hear it again, BUY the recording. There isn't one yet? BooHoo.

Because it's stealing. Because artists deserve to be paid for 'entertaining' you.



YOU don't deserve anything you don't pay for. You want to hear it again, BUY the recording. There isn't one yet? BooHoo."

I agree, they totally deserve it. They're amazing. If I already paid to get in, and don't sell it/give it away what's the problem? Of course I'll buy the recording once it comes out.

I buy every recording, and if I enjoyed the show I'll see it again, regardless of whether or not there's a bootleg that I've seen.

ellbellthomps said "If some kid from across the globe loves theatre and they come across a bootleg, what's the problem?

90% of people can't afford to spend thousands of dollars to travel to new york."

Tough. They can find a form of entertainment they can afford. Every major city has theater. Attend that. The way you rationalize stealing the work of these artists in your mind is really something.

ellbellthomps said: "Very vague. For all I know, you didn't have an option to see a bootleg.

Also, no ones running around whining. If there's a bootleg and you can't see it, watch it.

Some actors even support it (Ben Platt, my mother whos an actor... etc.)"

What's vague about it. The rules you agree to when you buy a ticket and the copyright laws say you can't do it. So you don't get to decide you can anyway. You don't get to roll thru a red light cause you don't see any other cars nearby and don't see any harm in doing so. As far as my ability to see a bootleg, I'm talking more generally about not being able to afford every possible thing I could want and accepting that and not thinking I had some inalienable right to those things anyway. That is after all, the point you're making, that people should be able to have whatever they want anyway even if the cost to buy it or experience it is too high for them, correct? As far as actors actually supporting it, tell them Uncle Charlie thinks they are fools.

RaisedOnMusicals said: "ellbellthomps said:Some people do want bootlegs,

Some people also want heroin.

Exactly -- although I think they can have as much heroin as they want --- at least they're only causing damage to themselves.