Do preview comments help move the needle?

[pacificnorthwest]

Posted: 3/13/25 at 12:56pm

Was just reading the “Smash” previews thread where, despite a measure of positivity, the critique is mostly critical.

It made me wonder to what extent producers/directors take message board discussions to heart and make meaningful changes. Obviously, shows adapt during the preview run. But I’m specifically curious about changes that any of you attribute to the influence of Broadway World and other theater communities online.

As for Smash, I'm hoping the production team is paying attention. I'd planned to see it but am on the fence now.

 

Updated On: 3/13/25 at 12:56 PM

[Kad]

Posted: 3/13/25 at 12:59pm

Well, considering the long history of productions not making meaningful changes despite reactions here and elsewhere, I think it's safe to say the answer to the subject question is generally no.

[CATSNYrevival]

Posted: 3/13/25 at 1:01pm

It’s unlikely Smash will open with an entirely new book than they started previews with, which is what it sounds like it needs.

[Sutton Ross]

Posted: 3/13/25 at 1:11pm

Not at all, your average theater-goer isn't coming here to read them. The marketing for Smash is confusing which a tourist (and the people who buy the most tickets) won't have any time for honestly.

 

[ChiDoc]

Posted: 3/13/25 at 1:30pm

Kad said: "Well, considering the long history of productions not making meaningful changes despite reactions here and elsewhere, I think it's safe to say the answer to the subject question is generally no."

I know I certainly romanticize the old image of late night meetings and rehearsals with a ghostlight resulting in massive changes that save a show, but that era is gone.  Once shows go in front of audiences, songs might change and specific lines might be adjusted, but wholescale book changes don't seem to happen.  Alas.

[James885]

Posted: 3/13/25 at 2:18pm

No snark intended, but if I were either a producer or a creative of a show in previews on Broadway I probably wouldn't be making major changes to my show based off the opinion of people on message boards. I know industry people do sometimes read these boards, but I can't imagine that it would be a completely smart thing to use responses on either this board or reddit / ATC as a serious way of determining how to implement changes in a show. 

I could be way off base, and I know producers sometimes use focus groups as well. I would also imagine that most creatives and producers have trusted folks that they turn to for feedback, and of course they are watching the show each night to see the audience's reactions and whatnot. 

Of course the big issue is that major structural changes to a show generally don't (can't?) happen in previews anymore due to the many technical constraints. It seems like workshops / labs or between productions is when those type of global changes to a show happen.

[binau]

Posted: 3/13/25 at 4:55pm

Gregg Barnes, who did the costumes for the Bernadette Follies (2011) said publicly that he read every comment online about the DC Tryout. If you recall there was A LOT of criticism of Bernadette's sexy red dress being very unlike the character. Which was allegedly at the request of Bernadette herself. 

Then the first preview of Follies happened and the dress had changed (along with a few other things in the revival) and everything seemed to click into place. 

Some quotes albeit from 20+ years ago in the Nytimes:

https://www.nytimes.com/2003/10/05/theater/theater-are-the-toughest-crowds-on-broadway-online.html

''Every person in every Broadway show goes onto the chat rooms,'' says the ''Hairspray'' star Marissa Jaret Winokur, who ignored her fellow Tony winner Sutton Foster's advice to avoid them. ''Everyone's scared to admit it.''

"Do posts influence shows' creative teams? If so, no one involved in a production would ever admit it. ''They have said things with which we agree and think that we are working on,'' said Richard Frankel, one of the producers of ''Little Shop of Horrors,'' ''Hairspray'' and ''The Producers.'' ''But do we change things because they said them? No.''"

[rosscoe(au)]

Posted: 3/13/25 at 6:54pm

The sad part is some of the suggestions made on these boards should have been listened to. The real issue is producers don’t have the balls anymore to change things, everything these days is just yes men or woman saying this is fabulous. Throwing good money after bad, than wondering why it flopped. 

[Zeppie2022]

Posted: 3/13/25 at 7:09pm

OK, let's pretend the producers take comments made here to heart and decided to make changes. What could reasonably be changed in less than a month (show officially opens April 10th) that could make a difference. I can't imagine it is easy to implement a bunch of changes at this late date.

[mrshowbiz90210]

Posted: 3/13/25 at 7:43pm

We know for a fact that producers and publicists are monitoring the boards for buzz from this specific niche. As to them actually affecting change, doubtful. 

[theatergoer3]

Posted: 3/15/25 at 10:12am

It doesn’t feel like creative teams use them as much anymore (something like Shuffle Along aside) or as much as they should. 

However, it does seem to affect buzz and WOM. Definitely thinking of rush tickets as well. Of the shows that started previews last week, Dorian seems the favorite and in position to get a nice boost if it hasn’t already. 

Updated On: 3/15/25 at 10:12 AM

[BETTY22]

Posted: 3/15/25 at 10:31am

Most producers now have focus groups and surveys audience during previews.

However, they cannot make changes without authors approval. 

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 3/15/25 at 10:56am

Zeppie2022 said: "OK, let's pretend the producers take comments made hereto heart and decided to make changes. What could reasonably be changed in less than a month (show officially opens April 10th) that could make a difference. I can't imagine it is easy to implement a bunch of changes at this late date."

This is the problem.

It's really really tough to make substantial changes when a show is running nowadays. It was different in the 1950s when there wasn't this level of tech. It's much easier for someone to get hurt nowadays and there are a hundred people in the building who all need to be on the same page.

If you want to change a piece of staging, that means the lighting has to change. If you want to add a whole new musical number or replace a scene, that requires a larger amount of re-teching. Plus time to write it, orchestrate it, rehearse it, maybe needs new costumes, etc. At best you have 3 days of daytime rehearsals each week to make real changes.

This board can reinforce opinions shared elsewhere. If three people complain about a line, that doesn't mean anything. If 15 people complain about something being confusing, that's worth at least considering that maybe some clarity is needed.

It's also a matter of the authors, producer, and director being on the same page.

Updated On: 3/15/25 at 10:56 AM

[mrshowbiz90210]

Posted: 3/15/25 at 12:19pm

ErmengardeStopSniveling said: "Zeppie2022 said: "OK, let's pretend the producers take comments made hereto heart and decided to make changes. What could reasonably be changed in less than a month (show officially opens April 10th) that could make a difference. I can't imagine it is easy to implement a bunch of changes at this late date."

This is the problem.

It's really really tough to make substantial changes when a show is running nowadays. It was different in the 1950s when there wasn't this level of tech. It's much easier for someone to get hurt nowadays and there are a hundred people in the building who all need to be on the same page.

If you want to change a piece of staging, that means the lighting has to change. If you want to add a whole new musical number or replace a scene, that requires a larger amount of re-teching. Plus time to write it, orchestrate it, rehearse it, maybe needs new costumes, etc. At best you have 3 days of daytime rehearsals each week to make real changes.

This board can reinforce opinions shared elsewhere. If three people complainabout a line, that doesn't mean anything. If 15 people complain about something being confusing, that's worth at least considering that maybe some clarity is needed.

It's also a matter of the authors, producer, and director being on the same page."


I would agree with above other than 15 people complaining never affects change. If substantial issues from the tryouts carry onto to NY without real consideration, doom is evident. The only production that I saw extraordinary changes executed after so many issues were discovered was a kiss of the spider woman with Chita - after its initial run in Purchase, NY 

[poisonivy2]

Posted: 3/15/25 at 12:23pm

I remember Bart Sher in the My Fair Lady previews asking people what they thought during intermission and afterwards. I got stopped on my way out of the theater. He wanted to know if some effect he was going for "read" to the audience.

[Mike66]

Posted: 3/15/25 at 9:37pm

I do think that the people on this board (or boards, in general) were heard about the Overture in the current production of Gypsy.  Folks who went during previews had complained that they were starting the Overture while people were still being seated, but right before opening night that was changed.  

I saw it a few weeks later and yes, at 8 pm SHARP, the lights went down and the first notes were played.  (And yes, they finished just before 11 pm).  And YES, I really did appreciate being able to soak up the music without interruption.

That may not be the same as wholesale changes, but it was a meaningful something.  And I was grateful for it.

[TheatreMonkey]

Posted: 3/15/25 at 11:30pm

Mike66 said: "I do think that the people on this board (or boards, in general) were heard about the Overture in the current production of Gypsy. Folks who went during previews had complained that they were starting the Overture while people were still being seated, but right before opening night that was changed.

I saw it a few weeks later and yes, at 8 pm SHARP, the lights went down and the first notes were played. (And yes, they finished just before 11 pm). And YES, I really did appreciate being able to soak up the music without interruption.

That may not be the same as wholesale changes, but it was a meaningful something. And I was grateful for it."

Just to play devil's advocate, I think it's quite the leap to assume that because of Internet message boards they changed the timing and light cues...

Obviously the production got feedback that the initial start of the overture was a disservice, but I don't think we can conclusively say it was due to Internet message boards. Comments from trusted individuals attending previews? Sure. But a handful of folks online -- even if in agreement -- that's still a leap.

[BenjaminNicholas2]

Posted: 3/16/25 at 12:25am

Re: SMASH

Considering Stro hasn't had a hit in quite some and that this new production isn't getting positive buzz, perhaps it might be prudent for her or her team to keep track of what the boards are saying.

There's a lot of good advice to be had here.

[sinister teashop]

Posted: 3/16/25 at 11:01am

Updated On: 3/16/25 at 11:01 AM

[sinister teashop]

Posted: 3/16/25 at 11:01am

Updated On: 3/16/25 at 11:01 AM

[sinister teashop]

Posted: 3/16/25 at 11:02am

sinister teashop said: "binau said:


''Every person in every Broadway show goes onto the chat rooms,'' says the ''Hairspray'' star Marissa Jaret Winokur, who ignored her fellow Tony winner Sutton Foster's advice to avoid them. ''Everyone's scared to admit it.''


Great quote.

I can tell you for a fact from my brief foray into substack theater criticism that actors go on theater chat and review sites. In my opinion, these are the most vulnerable people to negative criticism because there are so many factors that they are out of their control, like physical attributes and even miscasting. Perhaps a playwright might be as vulnerable to negative criticism because so much is riding on their contribution. But in my opinion, actors should stay away from chat sites because people can be unnecessarily cruel but more often they are just thoughtless.. their opinions come out of their heads without much consideration for how they might affect others.

singleticket's substack
 

Updated On: 3/16/25 at 11:02 AM

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 3/16/25 at 11:24am

On SHUFFLE ALONG, they had 3 dark days in the middle of previews to implement changes. I can't recall another show doing that in recent memory. I bet those 3 days were more productive than all the other daytime rehearsals combined.

But many producers and GMs budget this stuff with the hubris that their show will be strong enough at the start of previews not to need this kind of time or change. 

Updated On: 3/16/25 at 11:24 AM

[Kad]

Posted: 3/16/25 at 11:29am

Given that the musical development cycle now includes rounds of readings, followed by workshops and labs, then focus groups and other testing, a process spanning years before an actual production is even mounted, the fact that shows regularly still arrive on Broadway with glaring, potentially fatal flaws makes one question the entire time consuming and expensive process. 

Updated On: 3/16/25 at 11:29 AM

[Zeppie2022]

Posted: 3/16/25 at 11:44am

"Given that the musical development cycle now includes rounds of readings, followed by workshops and labs, then focus groups and other testing, a process spanning years before an actual production is even mounted, the fact that shows regularly still arrive on Broadway with glaring, potentially fatal flaws makes one question the entire time consuming and expensive process"

Well said and very true. 

[mrshowbiz90210]

Posted: 3/16/25 at 12:16pm

Kad said: "Given that the musical development cycle now includes rounds of readings, followed by workshops and labs, then focus groups and other testing, a process spanning years before an actual production is even mounted,the fact that shows regularlystill arrive on Broadway with glaring, potentially fatalflaws makes one question the entire time consuming and expensiveprocess."

once the show has transferred to New York… The creative team and producers are often diluted. By the fact, they have a hit or early fans that show up to the previews glowing about every dance step or sustained note. So I do not believe these comments, move the needle other than to dissuade people from seeing inferior productions that are not worth the money